40 demerits is it worth it?

**Jackrat** · 17th December 2003, 17:01

Originally Posted by igor

at least i know me mother. unlike u i ant a six finger banjo playing web footed bush lawyer boy.

stop wharring on with shit unless ya know what ya talking about or r also the Iraqi minister of mis information

PS change ya non de plume to "Jackass" its more fitting

over and out

Yeah I know her too.
The doc, says the rash will go away in time.
Pity that won,t work for a half baked penis exstension like you.

**Nouseforaname** · 17th December 2003, 17:05

Originally Posted by igor

yes that cause the minimum disqualification for dangerous driving is 6 months disqualification. also u could of been sent to prison for up to 3 months and a maximum fine of $4500. Dangerous is heard b a District Court Judge.

where as careless driving has a maximum fine of $3000 and a disqualification at the courts discretion. These matters r usually heard b4 a Community magistrate who is softer than a Judge and only disqualifies halfwits with huge previous history

P.S. Pays to read something b4 u answer so u don't look like a halfwit for replying with a stoooopid answer

No shit! the reason i bought my case up was because you say that someone who gets done for careless is a half-wit, then i was wondering what you would call me for getting done dangerous driving.

**igor** · 17th December 2003, 17:31

Originally Posted by Nouseforaname

No shit! the reason i bought my case up was because you say that someone who gets done for careless is a half-wit, then i was wondering what you would call me for getting done dangerous driving.

I wasn't belittlin anyone except the guy who knows it all. can't remember his name

he milked he case out and played the system and thought he won

he didn't, it would of been cheaper to plead guilty early.

he was happy cause he didn't get a disqualification, he never was gunna get one unless he was a halfwit with a huge history as i explained in my other post.

he has an us - them mentallity.

now he has broken into making insults which he wouldn't get 1/10 for in the real world

looks like he is another capital "L"

thats short for loser in my line of work

**Jackrat** · 17th December 2003, 18:13

Originally Posted by igor

I wasn't belittlin anyone except the guy who knows it all. can't remember his name

he milked he case out and played the system and thought he won

he didn't, it would of been cheaper to plead guilty early.

he was happy cause he didn't get a disqualification, he never was gunna get one unless he was a halfwit with a huge history as i explained in my other post.

he has an us - them mentallity.

now he has broken into making insults which he wouldn't get 1/10 for in the real world

looks like he is another capital "L"

thats short for loser in my line of work

Hey Egor you posted the first insult,If you can,t cop the reply.piss off.
Your claim of only about a $200 fine for careless is wrong.
As for my insults geting 1/10.
Your own are just a repeat of the last time you came on and made a twat of yourself.Check your last few posts.Pretty sad huh!

**BugSplat** · 17th December 2003, 18:53

The messages we send:

Take it on the nose & just pay – says we enjoy roadside taxation & want to keep being routinely shafted.

Defend a doubtful ticket – says there’s no profit issuing doubtful tickets, so if an ‘Officer’ isn’t convinced a Court will uphold the charge, then it’s best for them to let you off with a warning.

Defend, defend, defend all the time every time – says roadside taxation will become un-profitable, the cops will be spending 80 %+ of their time in court & not meeting their quotas. The Government will be loosing money on ‘Roadside Taxation’ and, God willing, we’ll see more realistic enforcement policies that are really safety based & not just revenue collecting.

There were over 1.5 million roadside taxation notices issued a year.
Consider the court time to process all these if we all stand up for our rights:

Say there are 40 courts working on nothing else, they schedule 10 cases per day, 255 days a year, It would take more than 14 years to process 1 years worth of tickets. Now if you throw in some of Jackrat’s suggestions & each ticket means 3 court dates we’re talking 42 years to process.
Even a politician is going to have to accept that that’s not sustainable.

Remember, we managed to get rid of the “Broadcasting License Tax” by making it cost more to collect than was actually collected.

**marty** · 17th December 2003, 19:24

Originally Posted by BugSplat

The messages we send:
Say there are 40 courts working on nothing else, they schedule 10 cases per day, 255 days a year, It would take more than 14 years to process 1 years worth of tickets. Now if you throw in some of Jackrat’s suggestions & each ticket means 3 court dates we’re talking 42 years to process.

you've obviously never sat thru a defended court hearing. a speeding ticket can easily take 90 minutes to process in a not guilty forum, court starts at 10am, breaks at 11 for 15 mins, again at 1 until 2.15, then til it finishes. they generally don't start new cases after lunch. you would be lucky to process 5 hours of sitting time in court in a day - that's a maximum of 3 cases per day.

then there's the issue of getting justices of the peace to sit (they need 2, on minimum/voluteer basis) - judges don't sit on minor non-imprisonable traffic matters.

one good way of getting rid of a careless driving charge is to get it transferred to a busy court (auckland central/otahuhu/north shore), plead guilty by letter, say i'm very sorry i won't do it again and i've learned from my mistake, and that i've been to an upskill course (maybe a trackday) to prevent me from misbehaving again.

in my experience that almost always results in a 'convicted and discharged', or even a 'discharge without conviction' sentence.

to those of you who won't admit to anything, just defend it. don't defend yourself though - you'll only end up looking like an idiot. weigh up the costs - lawyer, minimum $1000.

**SpankMe** · 17th December 2003, 19:46

Igor and jackrat,

**Jackrat** · 17th December 2003, 19:58

Originally Posted by SpankMe

Igor and jackrat,

Fair enough

**mangell6** · 17th December 2003, 20:09

Igor and JackRat, Daddy SpankMe is being mean. :disapint:

Has anyone read the article in the North and South magazine for November 2003.

The Police expect a 30% increase in the total rode toll collected next year.

The like this 'speeding' thing because it is cut and dry, no "decision making" or "judgements" to be made, The posted speed limit is X and you were exceeding it by a minimum of 10km, therefore you have broken the law.

The magazine has a big 50k speed sign on the cover.

One ticket, open road NO ONE on my side of the road for over 1500m, 55 demerits. Only 3½ months untill I am clean again and then I can really thrash it.

Ah well . . . .

**Racey Rider** · 11th January 2004, 18:22

Originally Posted by Jackrat

....You and your legal aid rep, can now argue every point of evidence,Things to look for in the cops statment is time of offence,If the cop has not stated the offence took place at appoximately a time,but rather stated a set time,you can challenge his time keeping.
This may sound like a small thing but it works, as the cop is not allowed to state a set time,His speed gun evidence is only a very small part of the picture,

My Ticket (9/1/04) has a set time written on it. 1358 (two minutes to two).
73k in a 50k zone. Didn't see if the muffty cop was parked or coming towards me at the time he read the "Alleged speed" , Had other things on my mind. Am unsure what speed my speedo read.
Not a good start I know, but as I'm self employed, and can easily find time to go to court, Would it be worth a go? Fine cost $170, 35 Demerit points. They are my only current demerit points, and $170 isn't that much, but still worth saving. Then theirs the insurance company's that will want to know.
What else would I find out by asking for "Full Disclosure"?
Racey. - (On the track only officer!)

**wkid_one** · 11th January 2004, 20:46

Originally Posted by RACEY

Not a good start I know, but as I'm self employed, and can easily find time to go to court, Would it be worth a go? Fine cost $170, 35 Demerit points. They are my only current demerit points, and $170 isn't that much, but still worth saving.

$170 - hardly a deterrent really. It would be interesting to do the maths on this. Should the Government/Police put the fine up - there would no doubt be an expected drop in the number of fines issued. Do they then think it is better to keep the fines low and get more of them - than increase the dollar amount per individual fine - but risk a strongly positive correlation in the drop in offenses. Therefore are they scared that

a x b > c x d where

a = present fine
b = present number of infringements
c = new higher fine
d = new number of infringements based on increased fine

Because surely if they wish to reduce the road toll - they need to get tougher with the penalties?? No different than for more serious crimes.

You can have a sustained loss of traction from the lights - and have you car impounded. OR travel at 73 in a 50 zone and get a $170 fine and keep on the road - which is more dangerous in reality? Don't the consequences seem arse about face??

Sorry son - your exhaust is too loud. However you were driving at 45 in a 50 zone and your car is immaculately maintained. Here is a sticker get off the road. Oh but you Mr Socially Irresponsible doing 69 in a 50 zone - here is a $150 ticket - be on your way?????

**marty** · 11th January 2004, 20:51

you'll get to see the back of the officers copy of the ticket - it should have info about the readout and antenna, the cops ground speed, the location of the offence (between whatever roads), when they were qualified to use the radar, etc etc....

**Jackrat** · 12th January 2004, 08:39

As a self employed person you will not be eligable for legal aid.
It would help if you were a student with a spare $40.000 to bribe your victims family with,Oh sorry no victim aye!!
Your lawyer will cost you more than the fine.
You could/should still write in and try a hard line story but it's really time to cop it sweet.

**k14** · 12th January 2004, 09:28

I totally agree with bugsplat!!

Dont just lie down and take it like a prison bitch!!! Write letters and more letters. Send them to your MP, the prime minister, the governor general, every tom dick and harry at the LTSA and also all the police heads of new zealand and also your region. Make sure you document the CC's at the bottom of the letter so that everyone knows who you have sent it to.

In the letter you should probably admit that you were speeding, but say that it was a joke to give you a fine for doing what you did and that the road works werent even an issue. That the road was at it's normally low standards and that if signs are there signs should be from the start of Mt Messenger to just before Te Kuiti.

Just keep writing and writing.

Being on 70 demerits for the next 11 months myself. I have to drive quite cautiously and make sure i slow down everywhere and virtually never exceed more than 10kph over the limit.

I just took my first speeding fine, 130 in a 100 on a passing lane, lying down. Now that i have had a further 35 demerits added to my total, i regret not trying to get it cancelled.

If you do get caught fair and square in the next 2 years then you will be 1 ticket away from no licence for 6 months. Just think how much that will suck.