BOMBSHELL. MNZ and ACC Trail ride plans

[RJM]

K6K you've definitely raised some points I hadn't considered.

[t3mp0r4ry nzr]

sweet. as long as every rugby and netball player in the country is licensed too! those cunts probabley make up more acc claims than riders, in frequency and total cost.

[Keithf]

One thing that the ACC likes to do is work with industry groups to work on ways to reduce the cost of injuries in the work place generally through training and education programs. This is good for business and the ACC as it can save both parties money. I am not sure quite how this would work for off road motorcycling in general but it could be as much about training as it is licensing.

So with that in mind that the MNZ and ACC have got together in some fashion is possibly a good thing -that the MNZ appears not to have consulted widely about what they are a about at this stage is a bit of a concern.

Like Tony I am all for a bit of regulation to ensure that events are well managed, marked and marshaled and have a first aid presence. Personally I am not too concerned if the price of a trail ride goes up to $50 because to me that is still pretty cheap entertainment for a days riding.

What does concern me is that and outcome of discussions between the ACC and the MNZ is a system that is unworkable for the people who put on events.

Regarding the question about an increased ACC levy directed at us and the fairness of it -I agree that we all pay for ACC by a number of means but that didn't stop them increasing the rego for big bike riders

[Ktmboy]

sweet. as long as every rugby and netball player in the country is licensed too! those cunts probabley make up more acc claims than riders, in frequency and total cost.

I'm a rugby player as well Well an aged one and yes we do pay levies and are registered with the NZRFU.

The cost implicatiosns are a worry. How do you manage this especially in remote locations.
Here is a scenario. Johnny buys a bike off trademe and comes out for a ride. Do we turn him away at the gate because he has no license?

[takitimu]

I am still in shock that MNZ are doing this and even more that any other sport is letting them, it's the thin edge of a massive wedge and affects rugby/skiing/golf/boxing etc etc.

Basically I can't believe that because my sport is dirt biking and not rugby that I get charged, that makes no sense to me, especially as I'm a desk jockey and my odds of a work injury are apart from RSI effectively zero and in 5 years ACC have not paid for any injury I've had.

If this has to happen and I think It would be dumb if it did, then it should be like any other ACC workplace where say the sandpit/power/epic get certified and regularly inspected, it's really the fund raising trail rides that will be affected the most and it's so wrong that yet again rural communities are punished by pen pushers in wgtn.

MNZ failed to stop road riders from being gouged by ACC, I see no evidence that as dirt bike riders we'll fare any better and to my first point we are being used as guinea pigs by ACC to get fees from sports and that is against what I consider was the huge benefit of ACC, as such I think it should be opened to competition ( or maybe that is the objective, make it so directly funded that it can be ).

[Ktmboy]

Nigel, its MNZ that are driving this more than ACC and the Dept of labour. MNZ see it as a very very good source of income and I'm sure they could all be nicely recompensed with the proceeds from managing this.

Its making a job for themselves..

Its also a privacy thing.
We have 11,700 riders on our data base and MNZ would have access to all. Its your personal info and we are not at liberty to hand this on to anybody.

[takitimu]

To me it's a logistical nightmare, where the costs of enforcement/management could easily double the ACC costs, so much distance and remoteness involved.

When I first heard of this I could not get my head around how you could police/enforce it at any reasonable rate, I still can't.

So many reasons for MNZ to be wary of this.

I do however like the idea of guidelines worked put in conjunction with ACC & dept of labour for the running of events and I'd even suggest the option of being able to be certified. BUT it should be optional and be a situation where MNZ are adding real value ( Insurance/Promotion etc ), not where they are just clipping a ticket/being rule enforcers.

[young1]

I would only presume then, living in a democratic country as we do, that a similar scheme is being proposed for skiers (swipe their ACC 'card' before getting on the chair lift) or for rugby players etc etc

Or am I just being silly....

[Ktmboy]

To me it's a logistical nightmare, where the costs of enforcement/management could easily double the ACC costs, so much distance and remoteness involved.

When I first heard of this I could not get my head around how you could police/enforce it at any reasonable rate, I still can't.

So many reasons for MNZ to be wary of this.

I do however like the idea of guidelines worked put in conjunction with ACC & dept of labour for the running of events and I'd even suggest the option of being able to be certified. BUT it should be optional and be a situation where MNZ are adding real value ( Insurance/Promotion etc ), not where they are just clipping a ticket/being rule enforcers.

Right on the button. Takitimu for MNZ president.

[dave hamilton]

Well MNZ is like the IRD A PACJ OF HOMOS I SAY PISS ON THEM BOTH FUCK MNZ lucky here in the waikato we got plenty of free ride space hehe so up you MNZ

[MSTRS:Me]

I really enjoy riding without having to worry about licenses, rego fee's, WOF's etc etc.

I'd like that too....
Coming from the 'other side', but still just a recreational user, it's high time that something was done to cover offroad injuries. Let's face it, we all know that in many (most?) cases, treatment costs come from the motor fund and we road riders have been subsidising the offroaders for years.
And before anyone goes all postal on me, I understand how abhorrent it is to think that a previously 'free' activity is likely to get a price put on it. For me, who really only rides as a leisure activity, it was utterly vile to have my rego go up, when I pay ACC on my wages and on my fuel just like you guys do.

[ktm84mxc]

This is what you get with MNZ they have this deluded view that they are doing it for the betterment of the sport, when in fact all we want is to be left alone to ride our bikes as shown by the poor response to the elections.
MNZ can't tell an individual what they can & can't do , they can only do so if it is written in law or by Queens charter
This may see the end of MNZ as we know it.

[BM-GS]

This is what you get with MNZ they have this deluded view that they are doing it for the betterment of the sport, when in fact all we want is to be left alone to ride our bikes as shown by the poor response to the elections.
MNZ can't tell an individual what they can & can't do , they can only do so if it is written in law or by Queens charter
This may see the end of MNZ as we know it.

That's why MNZ, DoL & ACC are all in there together, once it's in legislation, MNZ get to do whatever they can get away with and charge us for it.

I think regulation as regards trail standards is probably a good thing so long as the process for this doesn't increase consts to the point where (more) people start riding illegally. It's hard enough for people to ride on their own property now, it'll get harder once the neighbours get a licence to snoop.

The Law of Unintended Consequences?

[Jay GTI]

I'd read about this in DRD a while back and they were as concerned as we are that this is all going on behind closed doors without consultation with us, the people who will be affected by any legislation.

While I agree that some kind of regulation can only be a good thing, as there should be basic standards met by the organisers of any professional event, my concern is that MNZ are in fact only representing themselves. As said already, they may well be working on legislation that will bouy their coffers, at the expense of us, the people they are supposedly representing. This may not be true, but without any transparency, there is no way of knowing and the 'conspiracy theorist' in me is very concerned we are being excluded because we would not like what is being discussed.

As has also been said, once in legislation, there will be very little we can do, illegal riding will increase, but most of us are law-abiding people and will continue to ride, just MNZ and ACC will be taking their slice.

MNZ have not been proving themselves of late, with the issues with the Pukekohi MCC and the like, this is only increasing my scepticism in their true representation (themselves).

[Ronin]

Right on the button. Takitimu for MNZ president.

The elections for MNZ president finished a couple of weeks ago. Only 10% of the membership voted. The largest portion of members by far is off road.

Just saying is all.