First accident...

[Beren]

Posting here as I think the other biker involved is probably also a member of Kiwibiker...

Had a car try unusually hard to kill me this morning

I was in the left hand lane on the auckland bridge having just passed a guy on a GN250 who was also in the left hand lane. The car in the right hand lane beside me suddenly swerved into our lane and hit me hard enough for me to take out his wing mirror. I managed to get round the car without any further incident and was wobbling down the road a little thinking how lucky I was to still be on two wheels when i realised everyone behind me was stopping.

The car had hit me hard enough accross the road that apparently I clipped the GN rider with my rear somewhere who subsequently lost control and came off. Which possibly means the GN rider was the reason I didn't spill.

GN and car limped off the motorway and after a bit I found out where they had stopped to exchange details. Car driver has apparently admitted that it was his fault. He apparently braked, swerved and slid on the loverly wet road to avoid hitting the car in front that had suddenly slowed.

Unfortunately me being in a slight hurry and overtaking the GN put me in a vulnerable position further to the right of my lane than I would normally be, so I didn't have time to get out of the way when the car leaped out and tried to eat me.

While the car was at fault a more defensive riding attitude on my part could possibly have saved the GN rider from having a spill - or perhaps the car would have just taken him out instead I'm not sure. But if you are on here at all - Sorry Dude.

[cheshirecat]

Everythings easy in hindsight. You are OK, the GN rider is intact, you didn't intend harm and did what you thought right in the moment.

[oneofsix]

interesting tail. I guess the car thought it was the GN that took out his wing mirror and the GN rider was too shook up to not the mistake.

[FJRider]

... While the car was at fault a more defensive riding attitude on my part could possibly have saved the GN rider from having a spill - or perhaps the car would have just taken him out instead I'm not sure. But if you are on here at all - Sorry Dude.

It would seem that neither YOU or that CAR Driver were thinking any further ahead than the front of you're respective vehicles ... (like what would happen IF ...)

While the car was the initial cause of the incident ... it was only ONE factor in it's end result. ... Vehicles travelling closely together on a multi-lane WET road, with one (you) overtaking ... but it wasn't your fault ... ???

Let me guess ... you do it all the time ... and you haven't had this happen before ...

Right ... ???



I guess you thought that would never happen ... to you ...

[Beren]

While the car was the initial cause of the incident ... but it wasn't your fault ... ???

Umm no, it wasn't my fault. I was travelling in the left hand lane, I was in a flow of traffic not overtaking. Car in the right hand lane swerved into my lane while I was alongside him and took me out - he did not indicate or give any indication that he was going to make the manouver before he did it. I wasn't overtaking/undertaking the car. I wasn't splitting between traffic. I had just overtaken the GN that had been in my lane, on the right of him, staying in my lane. So no it wasn't my fault, at all. The car pulled directily into me because he had failed to react to something happening in his lane and lost control of his vehicle.

However, while the accident was not legally my fault not being in an accident would have been even better. Had I been in the centre of my lane rather than to the right of it I may have possibly been able to react in time to swerve to the left and avoid being hit. Had I been in slightly less of a hurry and not overtaken the bike in front I would have been using less of my concentration on that and been able to spend more on expecting a car to do something stupid.

Yes I drive on the road all the time and no I have never had a car loose control next to me skid into my lane and sideswipe me before.

I really feel most guilty about the poor guy on the GN. I don't know if me not being there he would have been hit by the car anyway - I got away with what I suspect is going to be a decent bruise on my forearm and slightly bent handlebars. He came off and his bike had more damage than mine. Which was why I was hoping he was a member - would see this and post his experience of the accident as well. Thankfully ATGATT meant that I think he will just have some bruising.

[FJRider]

... Had I been in slightly less of a hurry and not overtaken the bike in front I would have been using less of my concentration on that and been able to spend more on expecting a car to do something stupid.

Riding without due care and attention ... right there ...

Yes I drive on the road all the time and no I have never had a car loose control next to me skid into my lane and sideswipe me before.

Especially one that fails to indicate ... whilst doing so ...

I might suggest you spend more time expecting such things ... you may live longer ...

I really feel most guilty about the poor guy on the GN. I don't know if me not being there he would have been hit by the car anyway - I got away with what I suspect is going to be a decent bruise on my forearm and slightly bent handlebars. He came off and his bike had more damage than mine. Which was why I was hoping he was a member - would see this and post his experience of the accident as well. Thankfully ATGATT meant that I think he will just have some bruising.

You were there ... you hit HIM ... has HE got your insurance details ... ???

[Str8 Jacket]

Accidents are always caused by *something*. You can usually avoid the accident by being prepared. If I didn't look around and be aware of what was going on araound me I would've been killed a few times over and it wouldn't have been my fault.....

Learn the lesson about observation and awareness of other road users, you'll find that you will avoid many more accidents that "wouldn't have been your fault"....

Remember - once you're dead or seriously injured it won't matter who was at fault.

[FJRider]

Accidents are always caused by *something*. You can usually avoid the accident by being prepared. If I didn't look around and be aware of what was going on araound me I would've been killed a few times over and it wouldn't have been my fault.....

Learn the lesson about observation and awareness of other road users, you'll find that you will avoid many more accidents that "wouldn't have been your fault"....

Remember - once you're dead or seriously injured it won't matter who was at fault.

Most remember that ... as they lie on the tarmac ... beside (or under) their bike ...

and still ... the infamous 1st words come out of their mouth ... (like it really matters right then) ... It wasn't(couldn't be) MY fault ...

[bogan]

Most remember that ... as they lie on the tarmac ... beside (or under) their bike ...

and still ... the infamous 1st words come out of their mouth ... (like it really matters right then) ... It wasn't(couldn't be) MY fault ...

well it kinda matters, as you don't want to be stuck with a repair bill as well as the inujuries...

Often it also help to look not only at what the traffic are doing around you, but what is going on that might cause the traffic around you to do something stupid.

[FJRider]

well it kinda matters, as you don't want to be stuck with a repair bill as well as the inujuries...

Those Without insurance ... think it matters ...

Who believe claiming innocence ... and not admitting guilt ... are the same thing ...

Often it also help to look not only at what the traffic are doing around you, but what is going on that might cause the traffic around you to do something stupid.

Experienced riders/drivers already (should) know this ...
Stupid ... is not the monopoly of car drivers ...

[Beren]

Ay Bogan - completely agree on the paying attention to the whole picture aspect.

Unfortunately my actions placed me in a position from which I couldn't react to the threat caused by someone else doing something unexpected. I guess unless someone has some other nugget of information would be the bit that would my lesson from Today.

I don't quite understand what your problem is though FJRider, what I have been trying to say is: I've had an accident - it wasn't my fault - but that's a bit beside the point - I was lucky - you might not be - beware cages trying to kill you - Sorry dude if what happened to me ruined your day.

Fault and being able to avoid something given sufficient road skill and attitude are two very different things. Perhaps I'm missing something but you appear to be saying something different?

Just spoke to the other KB'er sho is now over at an A&E getting checked out. He now seems to think the car took both of us out. Hope you are OK Dude.

[Str8 Jacket]

Fault and being able to avoid something given sufficient road skill and attitude are two very different things. Perhaps I'm missing something but you appear to be saying something different?

Guess what I was trying to say is that you need to be on the look out and observe what is going on around you at all times. You will start to notice that road users all do similar things \ react a certain way just before an accident occurs. Once you get this sorted you will find it amazing how many accidents that you avoid without the 'person at fault' not even realising that you avoided them...
Things to remember is where you position yourself on the road as well. Cagers tend to have blind spots that they cannot see, don't sit yourself next to them (side of car by passenger door where driver will only see if they are looking for you etc).

[Beren]

Completely agree with that one. Even in the car I hate sitting in a cars blind spot. I chose a set of actions that left me in a situation where I wasn't able to defend myself, with too many inputs to identify and act in time to defend myself. The bugger side swiping me in an uncontrolled swerve at 80ish didn't manage to throw me off but really, really wish I wasn't in that position to start with! The pretty rare occasion that I left myself to the mercy of a cage and it immediately took the opportunity to try and kill me.

[FJRider]

... I chose a set of actions that left me in a situation where I wasn't able to defend myself, with too many inputs to identify and act in time to defend myself.

The pretty rare occasion that I left myself to the mercy of a cage and it immediately took the opportunity to try and kill me.

Those two thoughts may be your lesson for the day ...

Being "legally" not at fault ... and being blameless in the resulting aftermath of an accident ... is not the same thing ...

Had you thought of those two points I quoted of yours ... at the time ... (or sooner) would you have backed off ... ??? and if it happens again ... will you back off ... ???

You also chose a set of actions that left him (The GN rider) in a position that gave him few options ... without the experience to see what was happening ...

But hey ... you were in a hurry ... right ... !!!

[Beren]

Being "legally" not at fault ... and being blameless in the resulting aftermath of an accident ... is not the same thing ...

No, it's not; however, in this instance a car was in the wrong and struck me. I don't believe I am in anyway to blame for what happened. That was the guy that sideswiped two motorbikes because he wasn't paying attention to what was in front of him or what was beside him. Blame isn't the point though - not getting squished is.

Had you thought of those two points I quoted of yours ... at the time ... (or sooner) would you have backed off ... ??? and if it happens again ... will you back off ... ???

You know what I'm not sure. Thinking about what happened and how it happened I am not sure if riding in the middle of the lane without distraction would have meant I avoided getting hit by the car. The speed he came across the carriageway at, the relative position of the vehicles, along with the lack of space to do anything on the bridge makes the list of things I could have done differently pretty small. I have spent a few hours today now off and on analysing it as honestly as I can and I am not sure if it was posible to avoid getting hit - in which case staying two wheels down was not a bad result. Part of me says had I not been processing as much I might have seen the threat a half second earlier and maybe done something about it. The other part says actually there wasn't a lot I could have done differently, if you slow down for everything and everyone then you just end up riding so conservatively there would be no fun left.

You also chose a set of actions that left him (The GN rider) in a position that gave him few options ... without the experience to see what was happening ...

The only option I think I ruled out for the GN rider was to be in contact with a different part of a car. What I may have unwittingly done is give him more to think about which in turned slowed his reaction speeds down though. For which I am very sorry.

But hey ... you were in a hurry ... right ... !!!

Bottom line, yes.