Speed tolerances

[FJRider]

There is a posted 25km corner not far from here that I can get around at 90km/hr on my R1 ...

I know a few 15 km corners that I struggle with at 20 on the bike ... I'd better sell it and get a van ...

Maybe an R1 ...

[FJRider]

18.4% increase over 10 years

BTW: the road toll does not have to be lower just because of targeting speed; there are many variables. Age of the fleet, experience of the drivers, length of the journeys, condition of the roads etc. etc. The speed policy has had a number of effects - just not (only, or even necessarily) the one that is commonly claimed by those who tout it as The Panacea.

So ... nearly 20% increase in vehicles on the road with the death toll the same ...

BTW ... it was claimed the "targeting of speed" made NO difference to the death toll ... the points you mention CAN/DO make a difference in the toll figures, (but weren't mentioned) ... but proving effect of any/all of those points, with statistics (speed included) ... would be difficult ... at best.

If with the ability of modern vehicles to travel faster/handle better ... with those abilities to become even better in future (???) with poor handling vehicles STILL on the road ... the toll wont change much.

[tigertim20]

I know a few 15 km corners that I struggle with at 20 on the bike ... I'd better sell it and get a van ...

Maybe an R1 ...

haha, wont help, there are other corners that are marked at 35, and it doesnt feel really safe going too much over that. road knowledge makes a massive difference, and a surface can change dramatically over the course of a day.

[FJRider]

haha, wont help, there are other corners that are marked at 35, and it doesnt feel really safe going too much over that. road knowledge makes a massive difference, and a surface can change dramatically over the course of a day.

There is a 15 km corner on the Reefton side of Springs Junction ... that I struggle at 15 ...

[GrayWolf]

cars on the raod vary greatly in age, suspension, handling etc. The limits they set are designed to be limits for good conditions, in ANY car, i.e. a WRX, a Bentley, a Cadillac, and a model T should all be able to get around that corner safely at the posted speed, so no, his argument is not invalid, you are just too quick to act like you know everything.
Yes, certain vehicles can go around corners faster.
There is a posted 25km corner not far from here that I can get around at 90km/hr on my R1, does that mean we should increase the limit on that corner? - of course not, the tour busses, older cars with shitty suspension, inexperienced drivers etc etc wouldnt get around it at that speed, and raising the limit high enough to suggest to them the posted speed is safe would be lunacy.

I think you'll find that the posted 'recommended' limit isn't just about the speed a corner can be taken at. From memory when that is put in place it also takes into account following corners, road width and line of sight for braking on the given corner. There are many corners (Rimutaka's are a classic example) that the actual corner can be negotiated at double plus the 'posted speed', however; traveling above that limit means you are unable to stop in the event of the carriageway being blocked.

[JATZ]

There is a 15 km corner on the Reefton side of Springs Junction ... that I struggle at 15 ...

You should go straight ahead then... Palmer rd's a nice ride
Just look out for the blind fords

Slow drivers dont make anyone do anything, they're not the one pushing the accelerator of the car doing the dumb passing moves

Ah fuck it.... I had a response typed out, but....what's the point
As you were

[tigertim20]

I think you'll find that the posted 'recommended' limit isn't just about the speed a corner can be taken at. From memory when that is put in place it also takes into account following corners, road width and line of sight for braking on the given corner. There are many corners (Rimutaka's are a classic example) that the actual corner can be negotiated at double plus the 'posted speed', however; traveling above that limit means you are unable to stop in the event of the carriageway being blocked.

yes, but I was trying to point out to him that not all vehicles handle the same, the one limit needs to account for the lowest common denominators, or close to it

[Kickaha]

Ah fuck it.... I had a response typed out, but....what's the point
As you were

Nah go on explain how someone not even in the same vehicle "makes you" do something, it's just people making bullshit excuses

[FJRider]

You should go straight ahead then... Palmer rd's a nice ride
Just look out for the blind fords

I got ON to Palmers road once ...

[cs363]

Nah go on explain how someone not even in the same vehicle "makes you" do something, it's just people making bullshit excuses

Yep, had a conversation about something similar today - nobody 'makes you' do stuff (unless maybe they've hypnotised or brainwashed you...) it's a lack of self control.
Not taking the high road either, I know I've been guilty of it in the past as have most people, frustration can get the better of all of us at some time or another.

[haydes55]

Nah go on explain how someone not even in the same vehicle "makes you" do something, it's just people making bullshit excuses

Agreed still the decision of the driver behind. However would you happily sit behind a car going 20km/h under the speed limit for an hour? Wasting 12 minutes drive time. Then the trail of tailgating cars behind you that keep pulling out into oncoming traffic to try see an opportunity to overtake.

The only time I speed in my car is when I have to overtake slow drivers. When other cars are going 100km/h I go 100km/h. I'm not going to waste my time because a driver lacks enough skill to control their car at a set speed limit. If you are incapable of operating a motor vehicle at the speed of the flow of traffic then you shouldn't be allowed to operate said vehicle. If you wish to go slower, pull over when possible, 20 seconds pulled over on the side of the road is a small price to pay compared to the hours of other peoples time you take up by driving what you are clearly incapable of doing so.

[tigertim20]

Agreed still the decision of the driver behind. However would you happily sit behind a car going 20km/h under the speed limit for an hour? Wasting 12 minutes drive time. Then the trail of tailgating cars behind you that keep pulling out into oncoming traffic to try see an opportunity to overtake.

The only time I speed in my car is when I have to overtake slow drivers. When other cars are going 100km/h I go 100km/h. I'm not going to waste my time because a driver lacks enough skill to control their car at a set speed limit. If you are incapable of operating a motor vehicle at the speed of the flow of traffic then you shouldn't be allowed to operate said vehicle. If you wish to go slower, pull over when possible, 20 seconds pulled over on the side of the road is a small price to pay compared to the hours of other peoples time you take up by driving what you are clearly incapable of doing so.

12 minutes, meh, why are you so important that 12 minutes is the difference between life and death, and the difference for the fate of earth as we know it?
just slow down rossi.

[haydes55]

12 minutes, meh, why are you so important that 12 minutes is the difference between life and death, and the difference for the fate of earth as we know it?
just slow down rossi.

I get annoyed sometimes, and I wait until I have a safe overtaking area to do so, whereas I have seen numerous overtakes when they shouldn't have overtaken, just to get past a slow driver. I'm presuming a lot of the road toll could be attributed to this. 12 mins is like $2 on minimum wage! that could buy me a pie! I work driving from customers houses to customers houses, services and drive times are given set times (drive times calculated by the office ladies using google maps) a slow driver can be the difference between me getting to a job on time and having a happy customer and being 12 minutes late (half the service time) cranky customer, and more often the case no lunch breaks. (My aggression towards slow drivers stems down to I'm hungry!)

[Scuba_Steve]

So 20% of the road toll might not have died ... had they not been exceeding the limit ... ???

And of the 80% ... could they have been travelling too fast for the road/weather/traffic conditions ... at the time ... ???

80% couldn't drive regardless of speed, it is not an issue. 20% just had unfortunate circumstances. Unless your looking at it from Katman's view then 100% couldn't drive regardless of speed.

Slow drivers dont make anyone do anything, they're not the one pushing the accelerator of the car doing the dumb passing moves

Bullshit! they force you to drive their speed, & alot of them also force you to floor it at passing lanes if you want to pass them (I will qualify it by saying in a cage too)

[cs363]

I get annoyed sometimes, and I wait until I have a safe overtaking area to do so, whereas I have seen numerous overtakes when they shouldn't have overtaken, just to get past a slow driver. I'm presuming a lot of the road toll could be attributed to this. 12 mins is like $2 on minimum wage! that could buy me a pie! I work driving from customers houses to customers houses, services and drive times are given set times (drive times calculated by the office ladies using google maps) a slow driver can be the difference between me getting to a job on time and having a happy customer and being 12 minutes late (half the service time) cranky customer, and more often the case no lunch breaks. (My aggression towards slow drivers stems down to I'm hungry!)

As the saying goes 'better to be late than dead on time'. Not much use to your customers if you've ended up in hospital or worse, better to put up with the odd cranky customer isn't it?
Not condoning poor drivers that don't use their mirrors/pull over to let faster traffic past and so on, but the reality is they are the hazard and it's down to you how you deal with it whether they are right or wrong.
Reality is that most of us from time to to time make the wrong decision in these situations and pass when perhaps we shouldn't, but if there was an accident it would still be the overtakers fault in that situation.