The Art of Situational Awareness.

[Katman]

in YOUR opinion, EVERY crash is avoidable,

Care to point out the post where I've ever said that?

[Virago]

I would also like to add..... if it hasnt been added already (sorry, havent read all replies) That getting angry or fucked off at somebody and reacting badly to it can also result in a lack of concentration...

Wise words.

I had a situation recently on a two-lane one-way street, in the right lane, about a couple of car lengths behind a car in the left lane. Another car pulled out in front of the car in the left lane, causing the driver to brake hard. I could tell by the angry gesticulation that things could escalate, so I also backed off - just in time, as the angry driver swerved into my lane to accelerate around the other car. Had I stayed where I was I would have been the victim.

Road Rage does indeed cause a dangerous lack of situational awareness - it has no place on a bike.

[Katman]

my comprehension abilities are fine,

Clearly they're not Tim.

What I have said is that the vast majority of crashes are avoidable and that every accident should be examined to see whether there was any lesson to be learned that could prevent the same thing happening again.

I stand by both those statements.

[tigertim20]

Care to point out the post where I've ever said that?

the attitude with which you respond to posts regarding crashes indicates that fairly often - but I notice you have veered sharply away from the latter part of my post, where i challenge you to demonstrate you superiority.
funny that.

[NONONO]

Usual katman crap.
What he APPEARS to be talking about is "Figure/Ground theory" derived from the Gestalt school of psychology. This is also described as "emergent reaction" in the examples he provides.
So, we normally focus on the figure, that which is "emergent" and we do not focus on the ground (or background) against which the figure emerges.
Think of a large painting, we normally look at one bit of it and the rest fades into the background. Have a look around the room you are in, how much of it was sharply visible while you were looking at this?
What Mr K implies is that we can, with some form of pop psychology training, teach ourselves to switch between figure and ground, emergency and the back ground that it "emerges" from, at will....This may be possible in the short term, although little evidence exists to support it, but long term, not really, even the best fighter pilots get shot down.
In any emergency the senses "Tunnel", that is, the brain focus intently on the emergent situation, all else is background. In a situation where damage is pending it provokes an even more acute physiological situation which precludes any such "awareness".
As for the 5%, 10% concentration stuff;
Pop psychology , try Oprah or Dr Phil.

[Katman]

Marco Simoncelli was far more skilled than you or I will ever be, and he died on a bike, i could list plenty of world class riders that have been maimed or killed while riding which highlights the point I'm making

You seem to be confusing results on a race track with the ability to survive on public roads.

[Katman]

Usual katman crap.
What he APPEARS to be talking about is "Figure/Ground theory" derived from the Gestalt school of psychology. This is also described as "emergent reaction" in the examples he provides.
So, we normally focus on the figure, that which is "emergent" and we do not focus on the ground (or background) against which the figure emerges.
Think of a large painting, we normally look at one bit of it and the rest fades into the background. Have a look around the room you are in, how much of it was sharply visible while you were looking at this?
What Mr K implies is that we can, with some form of pop psychology training, teach ourselves to switch between figure and ground, emergency and the back ground that it "emerges" from, at will....This may be possible in the short term, although little evidence exists to support it, but long term, not really, even the best fighter pilots get shot down.
In any emergency the senses "Tunnel", that is, the brain focus intently on the emergent situation, all else is background. In a situation where damage is pending it provokes an even more acute physiological situation which precludes any such "awareness".
As for the 5%, 10% concentration stuff;
Pop psychology , try Oprah or Dr Phil.

You should try moving your eyes around a bit more.

[caseye]

Well, I've seen just two people who are letting their dislike for Katman, not necessarily his message, cloud their judgement. Everyone else who has actively engaged in this thread has actually said that what the Op said in the first post is basically right.
I too fear for people who ride bikes with music blaring in their ears, also for those who block their ears with foam and other sorts of noise blocking materials.Why for Gods sake rob yourself of another sensory range.
This thread has so far enlightened me about certain books that may well teach me something and which I will follow up on it has also confirmed for me that many here do actually think about their road position and their situational awareness much more than some might have thought.
Keep up the good work Katman, as always 100% behind the message and the delivery, being nice never works,if I've learned anything in my short time on this coil it's that!
Bash em over the head with it and hope some of em take it in.

[nzspokes]

have veered sharply away from the latter part of my post, where i challenge you to demonstrate you superiority.
funny that.

Thats a key point.

[Ocean1]

Well, I've seen just two people who are letting their dislike for Katman, not necessarily his message, cloud their judgement.

I've seen a lot who dislike his behaviour and quite a few, including me who disagree with his ideas about how human brains actually work. Show me where my judgment's clouded.

[tigertim20]

You seem to be confusing results on a race track with the ability to survive on public roads.

not at all, simply one example.

Well, I've seen just two people who are letting their dislike for Katman, not necessarily his message, cloud their judgement. Everyone else who has actively engaged in this thread has actually said that what the Op said in the first post is basically right.
.

Nope, I am quite happy to take advice from those who can teach me. A few members on here, Nighthawk and Jantar are two such people, from whom I have learned quite alot.
The difference between these guys, and Katman, is that both are quite happy to back up their talk.
KM talks and acts like his riding ability is above reproach, always quick to point out the flaws in other's riding abilities or mentality, and talks about how other people are doing this wrong, and that wrong.
He has been challenged by me in this thread, and several other members over time to back this talk up, and produce it in an approachable, user friendly package that other riders can access and utilize to improve their riding and safety.
However KM maintains his status as a keyboard warrior with all the theoretical answers from behind the safety of a keyboard, while distancing himself from the opportunity to actually turn all of this 'theoretical knowledge' into a package that could actually have a positive effect on other rider's outcomes.
I will begin to give Km credit when he manages to turn all of his talk into something tangible, like producing a course comprising both theory and practice, which equips the rest of us (apparently) lesser riders with better tools and greater safety on the roads, instead of sitting at a computer in his underpants, constantly proclaiming his superiority.

I've seen a lot who dislike his behaviour and quite a few, including me who disagree with his ideas about how human brains actually work. Show me where my judgment's clouded.

+1

[caseye]

not at all, simply one example.

Nope, I am quite happy to take advice from those who can teach me. A few members on here, Nighthawk and Jantar are two such people, from whom I have learned quite alot.
The difference between these guys, and Katman, is that both are quite happy to back up their talk.
KM talks and acts like his riding ability is above reproach, always quick to point out the flaws in other's riding abilities or mentality, and talks about how other people are doing this wrong, and that wrong.
He has been challenged by me in this thread, and several other members over time to back this talk up, and produce it in an approachable, user friendly package that other riders can access and utilize to improve their riding and safety.
However KM maintains his status as a keyboard warrior with all the theoretical answers from behind the safety of a keyboard, while distancing himself from the opportunity to actually turn all of this 'theoretical knowledge' into a package that could actually have a positive effect on other rider's outcomes.
I will begin to give Km credit when he manages to turn all of his talk into something tangible, like producing a course comprising both theory and practice, which equips the rest of us (apparently) lesser riders with better tools and greater safety on the roads, instead of sitting at a computer in his underpants, constantly proclaiming his superiority.


+1

OK so if he can do it because you challenge him to, how about you do it, because we desperately need it. You seem to know what to do, how about seriously making a go of it??

[tigertim20]

OK so if he can do it because you challenge him to, how about you do it, because we desperately need it. You seem to know what to do, how about seriously making a go of it??

why dont I do it? - simple really, Im not the one on a crusade here. I have never said i know what to do to lower the bike crash rates - the post you have quoted states quite clearly that I learn from those who have something to give.
Unlike katman, I have not set myself up as a self proclaimed expert on the subject, KM has, and its high time he backs up his talk.

[Usarka]

I was never any good at art.

[caseye]

Could you bring yourself to consider even for a moment that if most of the idiots out there who give many of us motorcyclists a bad name, for once considered their actions and didn't do the stupid shit,( you know, passing on double yellows, on one wheel,cutting off anyone, bikes or cars to get back in before becoming a statistic, the usual stuff) that the accident rate would actually stop dead in it's tracks. or that for a moment if all of the people who ride fast in a straight line didn't fall of the end of the bloody road that there'd be almost no, rider error crashes.Because like it or not that's the Biggest percentage of motorcycle crashes in the whole scheme.Oh and of course it's the young ones on their 2 fiddys doing most of that, not us oldies returning to riding as the gubbermint would have you believe.
It is the message that is important, how it's delivered makes friends or enemies, no question.For once I'd like to see reasoned debate not slagging matches and if you have never tried to influence fools on fast bikes then I'd suggest you seriously try and see how far it gets you?
This is a place where you can talk and work through things if you guys would just do that I'd be happier, for one.