Gareth Morgan in the Herald on ACC levies for bikers

**caseye** · 16th July 2012, 21:26

Would have made you a very young man then Voltaire.
Ha , trust you to spoil a good argument with facts from one who has been there.
Point is though and I know it's not lost.
We do have an abysmal standard of driving and yes riding here, it could be made a lot better without going to extremes, someone just needs to get it started.
Why not a bunch of hairy arsed bikers?

**Voltaire** · 16th July 2012, 22:12

Originally Posted by caseye

Would have made you a very young man then Voltaire.
Ha , trust you to spoil a good argument with facts from one who has been there.
Point is though and I know it's not lost.
We do have an abysmal standard of driving and yes riding here, it could be made a lot better without going to extremes, someone just needs to get it started.
Why not a bunch of hairy arsed bikers?

Maybe everyone should spend a weekend helping at A and E......
The standard of driving/riding discussion has been going on for years and years, I remember fitting my 500/4 with a device that made the headlight flicker.....thus noticed by cars....

mind you I was happy with just a leather jacket, work boots and jeans then.....not any more.
What was the original post....paying for multiple bikes......can't say I'm keen but they ain't gonna change that.....easy money.

**Maha** · 17th July 2012, 07:39

Originally Posted by caseye

Would have made you a very young man then Voltaire.
Ha , trust you to spoil a good argument with facts from one who has been there.
Point is though and I know it's not lost.
We do have an abysmal standard of driving and yes riding here, it could be made a lot better without going to extremes, someone just needs to get it started.
Why not a bunch of hairy arsed bikers?

..and how many times has it been 'attempted' before Mark?
The Auckland Action Group (2009) at least got out there and put 3-4-rides together, albeit with ever decreasing numbers at each ride.
So clearly, that is not the way to go.
I now believe its an 'up to the indivdual' thing.
Cleaning up the stats....starts with one.

Not alot of thought is given to error when the decision is made to ride like you're at the track.
What goes on inside the helmet can (and often does) dictate the outcome of your day on the bike.

**GrayWolf** · 18th July 2012, 08:55

Whats as interesting is MrKiwi and Mr Morgan have both gone very quiet when some suggestions and/or challenges have been placed.... Does make one wonder just what they are really thinking?

**oneofsix** · 18th July 2012, 09:04

Originally Posted by GrayWolf

Whats as interesting is MrKiwi and Mr Morgan have both gone very quiet when some suggestions and/or challenges have been placed.... Does make one wonder just what they are really thinking?

Possibly that Stoney was only the tip of the iceberg and now they have found a whole world of opinionated arseholes.

**caseye** · 18th July 2012, 09:35

LOL, Love it, could be you are 100% on the money there oneofsix.
Mark you have pin pointed where it all needs to start and noted that what we tried to achieve was never going to work, sad lot aint they mate.

**Flip** · 18th July 2012, 09:41

They have learnt two things;
1, They are fucking around with peoples lifestyles and that they do not have popular support to do so.
2, Bikers don’t trust both ACC and their lap dogs MotoNZ.

For the first time in a long time I am looking forward to another large Biker protest. Also escalating the level of belligerence to a level NZ has not seen in a while.

**Bald Eagle** · 18th July 2012, 09:54

Originally Posted by Flip

For the first time in a long time I am looking forward to another large Biker protest. Also escalating the level of belligerence to a level NZ has not seen in a while.

The last time this country managed to get motivated to a civil disobedience level was about some footy game and who was allowed to play it in a country thousands of miles away. ( Anyone remember 1981 ).

NZ'ers are a bloody apathetic bunch generally.

Move along nothing to see here.

**bogan** · 18th July 2012, 10:02

Originally Posted by oneofsix

Possibly that Stoney was only the tip of the iceberg and now they have found a whole world of opinionated arseholes.

Bang on! It's not just kb either, no more debating on their website either

**Swoop** · 18th July 2012, 10:15

Originally Posted by Flip

Bikers don’t trust both ACC and their lap dogs MotoNZ.

Perhaps they should change their title to QuangoNZ?

**Katman** · 18th July 2012, 10:24

Originally Posted by Flip

They have learnt two things;
1, They are fucking around with peoples lifestyles and that they do not have popular support to do so.
2, Bikers don’t trust both ACC and their lap dogs MotoNZ.

For the first time in a long time I am looking forward to another large Biker protest. Also escalating the level of belligerence to a level NZ has not seen in a while.

Before you go getting all Rambo on us it would be wise to consider what you mean by "popular support".

The government certainly don't have motorcyclist's "popular support" for fucking around with their lifestyle but I would suggest that the general public are, at best, indifferent towards motorcycling and at worst, actually supportive of the governments moves against us.

That is why we need to start being seen by the general public as something more than just clueless idiots.

**oneofsix** · 18th July 2012, 10:50

Originally Posted by Katman

Before you go getting all Rambo on us it would be wise to consider what you mean by "popular support".

The government certainly don't have motorcyclist's "popular support" for fucking around with their lifestyle but I would suggest that the general public, at best, are indifferent towards motorcycling and at worst, actually supportive of the governments moves against us.

That is why we need to start being seen by the general public as something more than just clueless idiots.

So you want a bunch of clueless idiots to see us as more than clueless idiots. Good luck with that.
We are a subgroup so normal prejudice will come into play, those that aren't onside will not come onside just because you are nice to them.
I have also discovered that more of the general public are on our side than we generally believe but for them it is up to us to fight, they will support. One or two, like diesel owners, have also realised we were the stalking horse and are therefore more likely to fight with us. Fight doesn't mean punch up, more support is gained by pressure, debate and argument, but a bikehoi does get attention.