Modern four stokes?

[Flicks]

A 450 has a taller engine too so the weight is alot higher in the bike. Which makes it feel heavier and harder to turn.

[brp]

Interesting stuff how larger crank and height etc makes noticeable difference ...


Yeah 300 2 stroke could be the go - with it firing twice as quick bit like having a 600cc four storke


Cherz

[brp]

Good article

http://motocrossactionmag.com/mobile...ERSU-7117.aspx

[Jinxycat]

and then after a while you can make one of these

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...type=1&theater

[Crisis management]

Good article

http://motocrossactionmag.com/mobile...ERSU-7117.aspx

Made for an interesting read and pretty much accurate in my book. I'm at the stage of selling the 200exc and replacing it with a 450exc, simply because it's easier for me to ride the 4 stroke, easier to get up hills and I'm getting old & lazy. Quite correct about the slower turning 450, quite a noticeable difference in how you have to corner (don't ask for the solution yet, I haven't figured it out) as the 450 wants to stay up and going straight while the lighter bike is more flickable.
Depends on how you want to ride, I'm enjoying not having the 2 stoke "hit" but will miss the fast turning and I will see how I go in Riverhead (tight, steep and very slippery) before making a final comment.

[Boo]

I think you would really miss the 200 at Riverhead,you'll be working harder on the 450 due to its weight and handling.

[t595]

Made for an interesting read and pretty much accurate in my book. I'm at the stage of selling the 200exc and replacing it with a 450exc, simply because it's easier for me to ride the 4 stroke, easier to get up hills and I'm getting old & lazy. Quite correct about the slower turning 450, quite a noticeable difference in how you have to corner (don't ask for the solution yet, I haven't figured it out) as the 450 wants to stay up and going straight while the lighter bike is more flickable.
Depends on how you want to ride, I'm enjoying not having the 2 stoke "hit" but will miss the fast turning and I will see how I go in Riverhead (tight, steep and very slippery) before making a final comment.

Sounds like you need a 300. I've gone from 200 to 250 husaberg,completely different power. Like a tractor of the bottom with no real hit,still a heap of mid range and top tho

[Crisis management]

Sounds like you need a 300. I've gone from 200 to 250 husaberg,completely different power. Like a tractor of the bottom with no real hit,still a heap of mid range and top tho

Ridden a few 300s as well in my search for the perfect bike, and given unlimited funds would have taken a 390 Berg, however I'm happy with the 450 decision but am always open to buying something else if I'm proved wrong, Riverhead will be a proper test of my decision making!


As a sided note: where's the best place to buy race tech springs, local or direct from race tech? Being a skinny white guy I need springs that will let my 70kgs actually compress the suspension....

[t595]

Ridden a few 300s as well in my search for the perfect bike, and given unlimited funds would have taken a 390 Berg, however I'm happy with the 450 decision but am always open to buying something else if I'm proved wrong, Riverhead will be a proper test of my decision making!


As a sided note: where's the best place to buy race tech springs, local or direct from race tech? Being a skinny white guy I need springs that will let my 70kgs actually compress the suspension....

What rate?i have some spare sets. Or try slavensracing.com

[warewolf]

Even the 300EXC feels like a bus compared to the 200, but I reckon I'd take one over the 450 for its light weight if nothing else. The 300 feels lazy in its power delivery but it does get the power out. The 4Ts are all valve clatter and unless the throttle is already open and working, very sluggish to respond to the throttle. The extra grunt is more forgiving but they are much more tiring to weave between the trees. The 4T EXCs are nearly 20kg heavier than the 200, and have more reciprocating mass as well, whereas the 300 is only 2kg heavier.

[Crisis management]

What rate?i have some spare sets. Or try slavensracing.com

I'm after 4.0 or 4.2 kg/mm front springs (Racetech calculates 3.9kg/mm), don't know about the rear yet as I have to disassemble it first (and it feels better set up than the front which is very stiff)

Even the 300EXC feels like a bus compared to the 200, but I reckon I'd take one over the 450 for its light weight if nothing else. The 300 feels lazy in its power delivery but it does get the power out. The 4Ts are all valve clatter and unless the throttle is already open and working, very sluggish to respond to the throttle. The extra grunt is more forgiving but they are much more tiring to weave between the trees. The 4T EXCs are nearly 20kg heavier than the 200, and have more reciprocating mass as well, whereas the 300 is only 2kg heavier.

Hi Colin, I will give an honest report of my impressions from riding the 450 once I have done that (something about cracked ribs & sprained thumb from Buckets putting a brake on things ATM) but having ridden Andies 525 in the two man last year and a couple of other 450s' at Woodhill I think it's a do-able alternative for me.... old, slow & lazy! I promise to report back! Interestingly I found the 450 easier to ride in Woodhill (forestry & sand base) as i could loft the front more consistently and the added weight kept it more stable (less kicking out of the rear), turning was different tho and I think will take a bit more authority to achieve speed.. tree roots I will pass judgement on later, they are usually my downfall on the 200.

I weighted the 450 with half a tank of fuel and it's 117.6kg, I will weight the 200 when it returns (sons got it at the Sandpit today).

Edit: weighted the 200, full tank of fuel so 3 kgs in that.... 110.9kg.

Both weighted with the same scales so any error is the same the 450 is not so different after all! 10kgs!


Iain

[warewolf]

I had a look at the specs and over the years the 2Ts are getting heavier but the 4Ts are getting lighter! In 2003 it was 97 vs 115kg. At Woodhill I found that the 2T was lighter and more responsive, so it leapt up out of the sand easier and turned easier. And that was on a bike that had worse suspension than my 4T.

There is no black-and-white answer, just different shades of grey. When I'm using the grunt and solidness of the 4T, I want one...when I'm using the peppy zing of the 2T scalpel, I want one!

[Pornstar]

So you're feelin the 200 is not enough these days aye?, so you crave some more useable power then aye? so you jump straight to a 450 4t? anyway enough of that, The answer is staring you in the face man, XC 250, Holy cow man, what a machine, I test rode one a few weeks back and would totally recomend you try one. Fantastic.

[Jay GTI]

the added weight kept it more stable (less kicking out of the rear.

Don't think that is necessarly due to the weight, more the way 4Ts are more effective at turning power into traction. My old RM would spit the rear out sideways in a heartbeat, which meant I'd pretty much have to be through the corner and upright before I put any real throttle in. With the KTM (weighs about the same as the RM), I can wind on a big handful of the throttle mid-corner, it just tends to dig in and and the power pulls the bike upright for me.

I lent the KTM to a guy with a 300EXC a couple of months ago at Woodhill and he was astounded at the difference in the corners. He was doing the same as the RM out of the corners, because getting on the gas too early on his 300 just kicked the back out, whereas he had been watching me power through corners on my bike and was surprised at how easy it was to do on the 4T.

The thing with the eternal 4T vs 2T arguement is that you can argue cost, power delivery, traction and all sorts of technical details until the cows come home, but rider preference is as much to play in it as any other factor. I do still miss the raw snot of my RM and the fact I could loft the front wheel over anything before my brain even registered I needed to, but I am ultimately a lot faster on the KTM. That is because the power is so much more smooth and controllable, I get way less arm pump and the KTM doesn't suddenly decide that it wants to kill me because I've looked at the throttle wrong, which was always an issue with the RM.

[flyingcr250]

Ridden a few 300s as well in my search for the perfect bike, and given unlimited funds would have taken a 390 Berg, however I'm happy with the 450 decision but am always open to buying something else if I'm proved wrong, Riverhead will be a proper test of my decision making!


As a sided note: where's the best place to buy race tech springs, local or direct from race tech? Being a skinny white guy I need springs that will let my 70kgs actually compress the suspension....

Ive owned 5 ktm 300's, i ran my new 450xcf in at the last wmcc ride, it was the first time id really ridden a 450 before, i found it really good in the expert sections, and had no problems throwing it through the corners (after id gotten used to it), the torque is awesome something i feel the 350 lacks abit.