Tazers

[Lou Girardin]

I'm not talking about media bias. I'm suggesting that that particular poll was conducted at a time, following a number of very high profile controversies, that ensured the poll results showed a dramatic drop in confidence. The results are a good indication of the publics gulability towards media hype and the level of editorial instict of the NBR to spot a commercial opportunity.

Then how would you pick a time when there ISN'T a controversy?
This weeks effort is a rapist recruit and DNA tests for newbie coppers.

[spudchucka]

Then how would you pick a time when there ISN'T a controversy?
This weeks effort is a rapist recruit and DNA tests for newbie coppers.

The difference is the NBR has gone, "Hey, controversy, lets have a poll". They surveyed about 500 people only. Previous public satisfaction surveys have polled three times that sample. A responsible agency would choose to poll at another time because the current climate, (the one at the time of the NBR poll) would lead to the results being a forgone conclusion.

Why can't you see anything positive out of the recruit story? They have 1) solved a 2 year old sex crime and 2) taken a potentially corupt cop out of the ranks before he can cause any damage. The new measures of fingerprinting recruits prior to attending the college and taken DNA off them, (I hadn't actually heard of that before) are both positive and proactive measures to ensure the integrity of the police.

Instead of viewing these measures as taking positive steps to improve the integrity and image of the police you choose to look on it as just another controversy. Take the FTP googles off for once in your life.

[Wolf]

FAWOMFT ???

WTF does that mean???

Usenet/IRC shorthand for "Frequently Argued Waste Of My Fucking Time".

Anything that has been done to death many times but keeps being resurrected (despite being previously beheaded, staked through the heart and buried in an unmarked grave by a crossroads at midnight with a side-order of garlic and Holy Wafers).

Surprised the term is not well known here...

[Lou Girardin]

Do you actually know the time frame of the survey, they can't conduct them instantly. There would have been pre-planning for it. You're making the same assumptions that you bag others for.
If it's true that there was a warrant issued for that recruit at the time of the offence, then it's hardly a positive circumstance that he got that far into training, is it?
Besides I don't really give a fat rats about that, it was the ridiculous comment from Beckett that really annoyed me. "Prefer not to have him" indeed.

[Indoo]

If it's true that there was a warrant issued for that recruit at the time of the offence, then it's hardly a positive circumstance that he got that far into training, is it?

Where did you read about the warrant? I understood that there was an attack on a street worker and Police gained fingerprints at the scene but couldn't match them to anyone as the offender obviously hadn't been fingerprinted before.

When his fingerprints were taken at college they were entered onto the system and obviously were matched to the crime.

There are tests and interviews a recruit goes through but really unless the guy is rather thick hes hardly going to admit to an attack 2 years ago.

Besides I don't really give a fat rats about that, it was the ridiculous comment from Beckett that really annoyed me. "Prefer not to have him" indeed.

Understatement of the year but given the guy hasn't been convicted of anything he can hardly call for him to be drawn and quartered.

[Skyryder]

If you genuinely believe the springbok protesters were innocent, you are looking through some seriously rose tinted glasses.

Some probably were innocent, and trying to peacefully protest, but there were definitly segments of the protestors that were there to cause trouble, and were willing to use violence. Lets not forget the destruction of the fences at rugby park, the flour bombing plane, and the ones who tried to use physical force to stop people attending the games.

Lets not forget that even the "innocent" protesters were still breaching the law with regards to unlawful assembly & breach of the peace. The riot squads were fully justified in using force to disperse the crowd. I personally believe that for the most part the cops were pretty restrained in their use of force. Hell lets face it I'm not the greatest fan of law enforcement, but if i'd been in their shoes i'd have kicked the everloving snot out of those protestors.

I saw more violence from the pro tour faction. Don't ever recall the police taking any action agaist them. The Redsquad was just that Rednecks with a uniform and the authority to use violence once unleashed by their masters.

Skyryder

[spudchucka]

Usenet/IRC shorthand for "Frequently Argued Waste Of My Fucking Time".

Never truer words spoken, thanks for that.

[spudchucka]

Besides I don't really give a fat rats about that, it was the ridiculous comment from Beckett that really annoyed me. "Prefer not to have him" indeed.

For christs sake get over it Lou. Show me a official from any Govt agency that doesn't talk PC shit like that to the media.

I don't know anything about the details of the case of the recruits offending and I'm not about to talk about details because it is all before the courts now. However I do concede that if he had been a suspect for the offence at the time then it is very dissapointing that he made it through the recruitment vetting process.

[Storm]

Usenet/IRC shorthand for "Frequently Argued Waste Of My Fucking Time".

Anything that has been done to death many times but keeps being resurrected (despite being previously beheaded, staked through the heart and buried in an unmarked grave by a crossroads at midnight with a side-order of garlic and Holy Wafers).

Surprised the term is not well known here...

It will be, oh yes, it will be *sighs and shakes head dejectedly*

[trev]

Anyhow back to the Tazers.

I've got my helmet on to deal with the pepper spray , will the leather / cordura jacket stop the prongs ??

[Skyryder]

Listen Cheeze-dick, Next time I am 'socialising' with Dangerous and co. I WILL explain to you the psychology of Police thoughts and actions - and it sure as hell differs a whole lot from your ideas which is out of this planet as far as realism goes!!

If I wasn't so tollerant things would be different.

NZ is NOT the USA - or else you would be paying for your comments.

Cheeze-dick?? Oh come on Scum is that the best that you can come up with a bit of name calling? And what's with this "If I wasn't so tollerant things would be different? Some kind of veiled threat. O for fucks sake Scum and you accuse me of being a 'dick?

And what's this psychology of police thoughts and actions? You expect me to believe that the boys don't swap stories at the end of the shift? I'm a bloke Scumdog, have been all my life. I know the macho culture of our sex when the boys get together with or without booze.

I'll look forward to some socialising with you via Dangerouse and co. I like to travel light with these guys. Suggest that you do the same leave all your baggage at home. There's no place for it out on the road.

Skyryder

[Skyryder]

Poor innocent doing-55mph-in-a-35mph-zone-in-defective-car-with-no-seat-belt-or-licence woman. My, how she was victimised by that evil policeman who had absolutely no right to pull her over, ask for her (revoked) licence and arrest her. The fucking bastard only gave her three clear warnings to "get out or she would be tased" and he totally ignored her saying "I'm not gonna" - fucking pig - evil bastard should have let her continue speeding up the road in an unsafe vehicle after the courts had decided that she wasn't fit to hold a licence for some reason. The evilness and power-tripping of that policeman was just so bad, wasn't it...

:lou: Bugger - sarcasm smilie doesn't work yet.

Seriously: The way she keeps on "crying" (very fake) ages after the second zap has worn off (hey, I've taken a couple of solid jolts from a bull fence straight into two nerve clusters (armpits - never try to rest your arms on a bull fence) and I was right as rain within a couple of seconds of disentangling myself - despite feeling at the time of the jolts like a team of martial artists had practised "synchonised striking" on several parts of my body) and the cop says "It's done with, we've been tased ourselves and we know the effects."

The woman was not "engrossed in a phone call and oblivious to what the officer was saying" as has been suggested on this thread, she was actively refusing to comply, she had refused pretty much every lawful instruction she was given (understandable why she was refusing to hand over her licence and papers - she knew full well she was going to be arrested once they learned her licence had been revoked) and she was giving them shit.

Back in the days before OC (Oleoresin Capsicum a.k.a. pepper) spray and tasers, that cop would probably have drawn a firearm and ordered her to leave the car. These days they have a less than lethal option. I note he attempted to remove her from the car and she kicked up a fuss so he backed off and drew his taser. She also allegedly took a swing at one of the cops but of course we couldn't see that through the body of the car [so obviously the cop was lying to look good in front of the camera, coz after all he's a pig and they do that shit for the power and she's such a sweet, innocent pleasant woman, really - yeah, right].

But what was he supposed to do, stand there all day arguing with her about whether she is going to get out of the car? Or maybe forcibly drag her from the car, twist her arm up her back and slam her into the pavement - I mean, that doesn't use weapons, right, so it's OK, right? Or maybe draw the firearm he was carrying on his belt and threaten her with it - screw the fact that there's no obvious call for lethal force, show her the gun and let her know he's serious... Or maybe he could've used a night stick - not lethal unless he breaks something really vital, and who cares if she gets a broken arm in the process.

Bollocks. I'm not saying that being tased is a "soft option" - from the rather real screams (as opposed to the histrionics afterwards) she emitted while being tased, I would gather it's not fun (as you would expect from a weapon designed to incapacitate) But it is a better option than many. It has risks, as they all do.

The cops, before they are allowed to use OC and tasers, must first be subjected to them so they know precisely what level of discomfort they are inflicting upon their targets. AFAIK, there has never been an official policy that cops be shot in the chest with a .38 at close range in order that they may better comprehend the level of force at their fingertips.

AFAIK, our own police have the same requirement on use of OC spray - you don't get issued it until you've experienced it - and I'll bet the same will apply to Tasers.

Nothing in the tape suggested that the officer was in danger. The other guy that I referred to in my post had his arms up in the air and was surrounded by police. He too was tazored. BOTH FOR NO APPARENT REASON. Hell for all I know they were both deaf. Unlikely yes but who here can say that they were not hearing impaired.

My position is clear. If an officer believes that his/her life is threatened or injury is likely then they have that right. No problem. But I suspect in time their use will be more loosely applied than at the time of r introduction. Just like speed cameras...............remember the bulshit that went with their introduction on our roads. Ain't no road sighns now with designated speed zones.

Skyryder

[Ixion]

Anyhow back to the Tazers.

I've got my helmet on to deal with the pepper spray , will the leather / cordura jacket stop the prongs ??

If not, I have the answer. Saw the COOLEST thing in the Army Surplus shop yesterday (the one in K Road, opposite the billboard of the huge tits. Where you get your gaiters). Bullet proof vests ! Didn't even realise what they were , had to ask.

Now I'm busy trying to think of a reason to justify buying one!.

[spudchucka]

But I suspect in time their use will be more loosely applied than at the time of r introduction. Just like speed cameras...............remember the bulshit that went with their introduction on our roads. Ain't no road sighns now with designated speed zones.

Skyryder

Come on, you can't compare speed cameras with tazers, that is utterly pointless.

As for the tazer videos, you have to remember that they are from the USA. The cops over there have learnt the hard way that a person that is resisting, even passively, can pose a threat to safety. They have all manner of crazy buggers with guns and god knows what else. Too many cops have ended up in a box because they were complacent in such situations. If some dead shit loser gets zapped because they are too stupid to comply with instructions then thats jsut too bad.

[Lou Girardin]

If some dead shit loser gets zapped because they are too stupid to comply with instructions then thats jsut too bad.

That would be covered by which piece of legislation?
The "Failing to obey a Policeman immediately Act 2005"?
Or the "Dead shit loser Act 2004"
Or even the "Attitude adjustment Act 2004"

The more you spout this crap under anonimity, the less trust I have in any cop.