Fitness!

[Night Falcon]

for my 2 cents...being fit will always benift you when chucking a large DS bike around. Having said that I've observed over the years that riders with good bike control skills use a lot less energy when chucking the said DS around the trails. In fact there are some blokes I've ridden with that seem to use almost no effort hauling their bikes round narly tracks!

As for myself I know I need more fitness but hate exercising with a passion so getting the right balance between skill set and fitness seems like a good idea for me. I'd rather spend more time on my bike learning better techniques so I use less effort on the trails than more time on an exercycle getting fitter to compensate for poor riding skills.

I bought a camelback a few months ago and found that drinking more water while riding has had a marked improvement on my endurance. As someone commented already, managing your enery levels with snacks and fluids while riding does help you make the most of the fittness you already have.

[Blagger]

I think that women, on average, need more upper body strength for chucking the bike around. Only on average and individual body shape will differ.

I'm currently teaching a woman (60kg or so) to ride a KLX300. She can only just get her feet down and she finds it hard work particularly the sideways wrenching motion that comes up from the much-debated core through the pectorals and supports the shoulders and biceps.
I'm trying to get her to keep her elbows up and out as that helps her with leverage when turning or seems to.

Previous advice to get out and ride a lot I agree with - after all you're working with a machine so in a way that same machine is your best traing device.

[Akzle]

I'm trying to get her to keep her elbows up and out as that helps her with leverage when turning or seems to.

i'll chuck in erg training,

then answer the post above:
it's a lot easier to push/pull bars from behinds them. not on top. go ahead. try it.
"having elbows up and out" sounds uncomfortable. teach her to drop her shoulder into the corner a bit, which should put her arms in the right place and make it much less work.

if you're skidding a dirty, it'll be easier to pull the outside bar...a

[Crisis management]

then answer the post above:
it's a lot easier to push/pull bars from behinds them. not on top. go ahead. try it.
"having elbows up and out" sounds uncomfortable. teach her to drop her shoulder into the corner a bit, which should put her arms in the right place and make it much less work.

While you are entitled to your opinion how about qualifying it with "this is good for road riding"?

The "attack" position on a dirt bike is a well understood body position for off-road riding, stand on the pegs, knees bent gripping the bike with the ankles or inner calves, leaning forward from the waist with the head directly over the steering stem and with your elbows up and out. Blagger, you're doing the right stuff, just don't over do it with your friend while she is learning, once you get tired you make mistakes and they result in hard landings, 30 minutes at a time with lots of breaks and food / water.

[Gwinch]

If you’re exercising correctly your “core” develops by proxy. There’s no need for targeted “core” exercises and little real benefit or results. But it makes people sound like they know what they're talking about.

You'd be astounded by the number of people who don't exercise correctly however. I agree with you that in an ideal world if you're doing the big compound movements such as dead-lifts, squats, lunges and bench press etc then you're working your core sufficiently that doing separate exercises is no longer an absolute necessity.

The problem here is two-fold. Many people shy away from proper squats and dead-lifts as they're intimidated by the exercise. They'll either head on over to a leg press machine which disengages the core almost entirely and also not do dead-lifts because of the reputation it has for being a "back-breaker". The other issue is that many people don't have a correctly trained core. The transversus abdominus (TVA, inside the rectus abdominus and internal/external obliques) is the foundation of core stability. Even elite athletes can neglect the importance of this muscle. Studies have shown that without proper neuromuscular training the neurons do not fire correctly and the external muscles take over almost all of the work (which they shouldn't!) which leaves the TVA doing very little. There are very specific movement patterns you can utilise to re-train your TVA to fire up properly when you actively recruit your other core muscles.

[superjackal]

You'd be astounded by the number of people who don't exercise correctly however. I agree with you that in an ideal world if you're doing the big compound movements such as dead-lifts, squats, lunges and bench press etc then you're working your core sufficiently that doing separate exercises is no longer an absolute necessity.

The problem here is two-fold. Many people shy away from proper squats and dead-lifts as they're intimidated by the exercise. They'll either head on over to a leg press machine which disengages the core almost entirely and also not do dead-lifts because of the reputation it has for being a "back-breaker". The other issue is that many people don't have a correctly trained core. The transversus abdominus (TVA, inside the rectus abdominus and internal/external obliques) is the foundation of core stability. Even elite athletes can neglect the importance of this muscle. Studies have shown that without proper neuromuscular training the neurons do not fire correctly and the external muscles take over almost all of the work (which they shouldn't!) which leaves the TVA doing very little. There are very specific movement patterns you can utilise to re-train your TVA to fire up properly when you actively recruit your other core muscles.

I’d believe any figure on the number of people who don’t exercise correctly.

“Core”-type exercises are some of the trickiest to get right. Same goes for dead-lifts and deep squats, both of which (IMHO) have dangers and side-effects that outweigh their benefits as exercises. Go heavy and deep and enjoy - no knees in your old age, big thighs and well-developed buttocks. That’s about all they’re good for. I spent years trying to develop obliques, serratus, christmas trees. Best way to develop those is to diet. They’re good exercises – just not very pleasing to the eye.

Squatters bum is impossible to get rid of. Like over-developed traps, once you got ‘em, you can’t get rid of them.

[Hoon]

I do weights 3 times a week and cardio another 2-3 times. My core is still weak. During Army PT most the guys can "bridge" for 2+ minutes but I'm struggling after 40 secs. Need to throw more ab work into my program I think. Some guys with naturally strong cores will no doubt scoff at core specific exercises but for me they are necessary.

Jogging/squatting/deadlifts etc ruining your body is just another myth. As long as you are doing it right then you have nothing to worry about. Don't be put off by those that have been doing it wrong.

I've just overcame a niggling knee/leg injury that's been causing me grief for years. Ended up being due to muscle imbalance i.e weak quads/glutes/hams. The fix was the last thing I would have ever thought of to try fix a bung knee.......smashing out squats, deadlifts, step ups and lunges. After 6 weeks my knee was fully recovered and I'm now injury free for the first time in about 15 years.

[Blagger]

Haha I always ignore that green-inked troll

If Kiwibiker represents Kiwis, he's Richard Prosser

[Akzle]

While you are entitled to your opinion how about qualifying it with "this is good for road riding"?

The "attack" position on a dirt bike is a well understood body position for off-road riding, stand on the pegs, knees bent gripping the bike with the ankles or inner calves, leaning forward from the waist with the head directly over the steering stem and with your elbows up and out. Blagger, you're doing the right stuff, just don't over do it with your friend while she is learning, once you get tired you make mistakes and they result in hard landings, 30 minutes at a time with lots of breaks and food / water.

nono. i'll qualify "my opinion" with physics. it works. every day of the week and on every vehicle, all the time.

so i'll add, "this is good for offroad riding" and qualify with "at a beginner level"

teaching a n00b should be done the easiest way to inspire confidence. attacking shit comes later. i'm talking from a farm/bush POV, not hardcore trails and ramps and shit.

[Akzle]

Haha I always ignore that green-inked troll

If Kiwibiker represents Kiwis, he's Richard Prosser

i'd rather you called me an asshole in my own right than compare me to a politician.

that's just fucking rude.

[aimee]

I think that women, on average, need more upper body strength for chucking the bike around. Only on average and individual body shape will differ.

I'm currently teaching a woman (60kg or so) to ride a KLX300. She can only just get her feet down and she finds it hard work particularly the sideways wrenching motion that comes up from the much-debated core through the pectorals and supports the shoulders and biceps.
I'm trying to get her to keep her elbows up and out as that helps her with leverage when turning or seems to.

Previous advice to get out and ride a lot I agree with - after all you're working with a machine so in a way that same machine is your best traing device.

i agree - us ladies do, on average, have far less upper body strength than do boys, so we have to work on it more.

thanks for the advice there: useful for me!

(i'm on a klx250s, and my mechanic kindly lowered it by an inch or so, which means i can get a foot flat...very useful!)

[Jay GTI]

nono. i'll qualify "my opinion" with physics. it works. every day of the week and on every vehicle, all the time.

so i'll add, "this is good for offroad riding" and qualify with "at a beginner level"

teaching a n00b should be done the easiest way to inspire confidence. attacking shit comes later. i'm talking from a farm/bush POV, not hardcore trails and ramps and shit.

Ah awesome, the "learn to ride wrong first, then sort out the bad habits later" line of advice.

You're an asshole, that better?

[noobi]

Ah awesome, the "learn to ride wrong first, then sort out the bad habits later" line of advice.

You're an asshole, that better?

But that provides so much enjoyment for other riders.

RE: the physics. You might want to them again mate, there's a reason the 'attack' position is used by all fast riders.

Using low elbows might make sense to begin with, but high elbows make a lot more.

[nzspokes]

The "attack" position on a dirt bike is a well understood body position for off-road riding, stand on the pegs, knees bent gripping the bike with the ankles or inner calves, leaning forward from the waist with the head directly over the steering stem and with your elbows up and out. Blagger, you're doing the right stuff, just don't over do it with your friend while she is learning, once you get tired you make mistakes and they result in hard landings, 30 minutes at a time with lots of breaks and food / water.

Im going to be practising just that on the weekend. One question, which part on my foot should be on the peg? Ive read the ball and the arch?

[Ocean1]

Im going to be practising just that on the weekend. One question, which part on my foot should be on the peg? Ive read the ball and the arch?

The balls of your feet on the pegs. Gives you the additional "suspension" of your ankles and allows you to move around on the bike more. Being fat, old and lazy I move to the arches sometimes, when things are a bit less taxing, just to give my calf muscles a break. I've even been known to sit down.