How much do you earn?

[Drunken Monkey]

That coupled with your posts about drugs in the Marc Ellis thread makes me think I know what you mean?

Say no more say no more! Know what I mean, nudge nudge, wink wink, say no more!

Busted!

[Biff]

I wonder how our numbers stack up to the national averages? (Assuming every answer has been honest, of course)

According to Google, on average, for the number of people that have casted a vote so far, we earn above the national average - by quite a bit. If (as you rightly commented) people here are indeed telling the truth.

[scumdog]

I baffel brains daily with my bullshit and I generally just get told off or people walk away from me. Hmmmm

Yeah but I suspect you're not meant to baffle your OWN brain too!! Sheesh!

[ManDownUnder]

According to Google, on average, for the number of people that have casted a vote so far, we earn above the national average - by quite a bit. If (as you rightly commented) people here are indeed telling the truth.

I think our demographic would possibly skew the income level anyway.
1) Motorcyclists (presumably those with a modicum of disposable income?)
2) Those with access to a PC (same thing re income)
3) PC Literate...

etc
?

Talking through my bum as usual here, but the results don't really surprise me
MDU

[Motu]

I think our demographic would possibly skew the income level anyway.
1) Motorcyclists (presumably those with a modicum of disposable income?)
2) Those with access to a PC (same thing re income)
3) PC Literate...

etc
?

Talking through my bum as usual here, but the results don't really surprise me
MDU

Um,no - not for me.

1) I have no disposable income,never have.To me bikes have always been something I do on the cheap,buy wrecks and fix them for my own use.

2) A PC is part of my job,and has been forced apon me.

3) PC literacy is not a term I would use to describe what I do with a computer.

[chickenfunkstar]

I'd drag the average down a bit.
I think i'm on about 12K at the moment.

[Virago]

top man!

And a bloody good example of what I'm talking about... AN Y ONE can do it... millionaires are actually a dime a dozen... we all know one - you just gotta know what you're looking for.

Yes, you're right - ANYONE can do it. But (and this is the key issue), EVERYONE can't.

A democratic economy is a little like a "pyramid" wealth creation scheme, or pyramid-based selling schemes. The reality is that there is only a certain amount of money to share around. ANYONE can rise to the top, but not EVERYONE.

If all members of society did their very best, there would of course be greater wealth to share around. But any suggestion that we could ALL be millionaires is naive in the extreme.

Anything above pure Communism will always result in a have / have not society. The closer you get to a free-market economy, the greater the imbalances. For every millionaire, there has to be 100's of people in poverty. For those casualties, being told "anyone can do it" is of little consolation.

(End rant)

[ManDownUnder]

3) PC literacy is not a term I would use to describe what I do with a computer.

I'm scared to think what Buggy or Biff will do with that line...

[ManDownUnder]

Yes, you're right - ANYONE can do it. But (and this is the key issue), EVERYONE can't.

A democratic economy is a little like a "pyramid" wealth creation scheme, or pyramid-based selling schemes. The reality is that there is only a certain amount of money to share around. ANYONE can rise to the top, but not EVERYONE.

If all members of society did their very best, there would of course be greater wealth to share around. But any suggestion that we could ALL be millionaires is naive in the extreme.

Anything above pure Communism will always result in a have / have not society. The closer you get to a free-market economy, the greater the imbalances. For every millionaire, there has to be 100's of people in poverty. For those casualties, being told "anyone can do it" is of little consolation.

(End rant)

Gotta disagree with you on that one.

The amount of money "going around" ain't a fixed amount. If the country was full of highly trained specialists (in their respective areas) we'd all be charging each other more for the services being offered... and we'd also be earning higher dollars for everything we offer (goods and services) overseas - the nett income into the Country would exceed to expediture by a greater margin that it currently does... and we'd all be better off...

Or did I miss something?

[Virago]

Gotta disagree with you on that one.

The amount of money "going around" ain't a fixed amount. If the country was full of highly trained specialists (in their respective areas) we'd all be charging each other more for the services being offered... and we'd also be earning higher dollars for everything we offer (goods and services) overseas - the nett income into the Country would exceed to expediture by a greater margin that it currently does... and we'd all be better off...

Or did I miss something?

If we could all charge more for our respective services, where is the nett gain?

A working mother earning $30+ an hour relies on paying someone $10 an hour for childcare or housework.

Haves / have nots.....

[Ixion]

Gotta disagree with you on that one.

The amount of money "going around" ain't a fixed amount. If the country was full of highly trained specialists (in their respective areas) we'd all be charging each other more for the services being offered... and we'd also be earning higher dollars for everything we offer (goods and services) overseas - the nett income into the Country would exceed to expediture by a greater margin that it currently does... and we'd all be better off...

Or did I miss something?

True, but what I think Mr VV meant was, that even if the amount of wealth in the country increases (and thus, as you say, we're all better off), there will still be those who are relatively richer. Nowdays , even poor people have a standard of living beyond the dreams of the wealthiest people of 200 years ago. But we still have rich and poor. Increase the overall wealth of the country, and we will still have rich and poor. The poor will be richer than they are now, perhaps even as rich as the rich are now, but the rich will be richer still . So the (now richer) "poor" will still feel agrieved that they are not as rich as the (now richer) rich

Until everybody becoems a Communist, like me.

[Ixion]

Doesn't anyone else find this thread vaguely unpleasant?

In my experience, income is not always related to one's actual contribution to society and/or the economy. There tends to be a correlation, but there is no inviolable causality involved.

In other words, to take a random example, there are lots of cunts with 'marketing' in their job titles getting paid six figures to sit around all day with their dicks in their hands, taking credit for the work of others.

As a general empirical rule (with a few notable exceptions) I find that, much as I would like it to be otherwise, the wealthier someone is, the more I will dislike them personally.

[/re-lurk]

Hey, come back here. Where you delurk from ? Y' can't just delurk and run, without telling us what you've been up to. We've MISSED you !

[Lou Girardin]

If we could all charge more for our respective services, where is the nett gain?

A working mother earning $30+ an hour relies on paying someone $10 an hour for childcare or housework.

Haves / have nots.....

To quote Eddie Vedder, "The haves, have not a clue"

[ManDownUnder]

If we could all charge more for our respective services, where is the nett gain?

A working mother earning $30+ an hour relies on paying someone $10 an hour for childcare or housework.

Haves / have nots.....

The nett gain starts at Macro level (GDP being higher - more money into NZ than out)... which then filters down to us plebs, which in turn manifests itself as us being able to charge more for our various services (as we do now - there is still money in doing that).

If you spend 30% of your income on a service, I'd rather have 30% of $100,000 than $30% of 30,000.

If you're buying locally made products, same theory applies

If you're purchasing goods imported the cost of those goods is going to appear a lot lower (you income has gone up, but the price imported goods stays the same... ish) so they're dirt cheap!

MDU

[TonyB]

The problem with communism:
-it discourages excellence- why become a surgeon when you're on the same money as the street sweeper outside?
-it encourages apathy- see above
-it never works because those in power become corrupt and end up living like kings.
-if it's such a great system, why do they build walls and fences and have border patrols to try and keep their people in?

Not saying that capitalism is perfect either. As someone mentioned before, there seem to be massive differences in pay rates. One person can work their butt off, have to be at work exactly on time or face reporcussions, and only get $30k a year, while others can sit behind a desk playing on the net, go out and play golf, have 3 hour lunch breaks, arrive late, leave early and pull $100k plus.