Speed tolerance reduced for December and January

[Tazz]

http://www.stuff.co.nz/motoring/news...speed-campaign (from over the page)

Road safety campaigner Clive Matthew-Wilson...snip...

But Matthew-Wilson said about 80 per cent of fatalities occurred at speeds below the legal limit.

Just clicked. This is just population control. They're trying to thin out the herd

Seriously though, IF that quote is accurate I'd be hoping he wasn't behind this particular campaign himself, otherwise he's pretty much just invalidated it to my eye

[Trade_nancy]

A 104kph tolerance is a nice idea that cannot be implemented with fair play in mind. Speedos are not manufactured to that degree of accuracy...as has been said.
My new bike says nothing about the speedo accuracy - but my older CB750 manual stated "..accurate to +/- 8% ". So 8% inaccurate from the factory. How can we maintain 3-4% accuracy? You could go 4-5% below the 100kph limit and constantly look at your speedo instead of the road. Is that safer popo? Look at your clock instead of the road? 42 years of motorcycle riding and car driving instinctively tell me NO.
Last time a cop pulled me up on the bike - about 8 months ago - I was coming up the Mt Stewart hill at 100-110. Speed built up to 116 as I went over the top and went left into a slight decline. Throttled back to about 105 when I looked down and saw the speedo. Next corner - cop car driving towards me - flashes on and passes by. Comes back and stops me. Gives me a telling off for doing 116. Time wasting fool. He did a u-turn in traffic and chases me at 120++ to not give me a ticket...for doing 116 for all of 4-5 secs. He told me - up to 110 is fine. So,..now it's dangerous to do up to 110??? What changed? Need more cash.
Bikers - keep your eyes on the road and not your speedos.

[DMNTD:Me]

A 104kph tolerance is a nice idea ....

Agreed....

[buggerit]

Looking at the Stalker radar specs I see their accuracy is + 1.6 to -3.2kmh stationary and + - 3.2kmh mobile so it would be possible
to get a ticket at 102 kmh if you are unlucky

[R650R]

Looking at the Stalker radar specs I see their accuracy is + 1.6 to -3.2kmh stationary and + - 3.2kmh mobile so it would be possible
to get a ticket at 102 kmh if you are unlucky

Interesting, I remember a whole lot of UK camera tickets being scrapped due to similar margins with their two photo system and stripes on the road...
Wonder if anyone has ever challenged in court the true language of the offence, ie doing x amount of kilometres per HOUR. Just with the way the legal system is so exacting with language and all... Anyone involved in engineering or measurement knows that to have a credible measurement and reasonable portion of x must be measured by a device calibrated to ten times more accuracy than the measurement being made. I mean if we were being ticketed for metres per second there would be no problem but to say someone is travelling at 104 kilometres per hour after a brief microscopic measurement in time compared to an hour there is scope for technical doubt...
Something to digest, chew or spit out there anyway...
Giving another one away to Team Rastus here but you know we've all got one of those stories of "Some twat pulled out in front of me today, lucky I was going slow because of reason x otherwise I would have collected him..."
And in reference to an earlier remark, its not about denying the laws of physics, its just that life involves many risks, action/outdoor sports etc but only driving is so heavily regulated... There's no ACC levy or limits to the ways in which you can break bones sking or mountain climbing, playing rugby etc...

[rastuscat]

Above post is very common sense.

Anyone ever noticed that the speedo errors almost always mean that you are doing less tan you thought you are?

I had a Gilera Runner a few years back. Two stoke monster scooter. It had a speedo that was reading 70 km/h/ when you were doing 55. I spoike to a bloke who said that in Italy, TPTB made it that way so that the ego-fuelled nutters who ride them could think they were doing 70 when they were only actually doing 55. Figured.

Back in 2013, my 2009 R1200RT has a speedo that reads 108 when I am doing 100 actual. If it was indicating 100, I'd be doing about 92 actual. If it was indicating 105, I'd actually be doing maybe 98.

From these things I suspect that most speedos register optimistically. Certainly the Corollas I've had over the years are maybe 10% optimistic.

So, in fact, if someone gets tagged at 105 actual (well, as good as a calibrated radar or laser is) on the open road, their speedo would have been reading well over that, due to speedo error.

Happy to hear folks honest experience on this, given that speedo error has become such a talking point.

Anyone know what cosine angle effect is? It always means that unless the detection device is being progressed directly down the axis of travel of the target vehicle, the readout will display less than the actual speed. Another factor in the motorists factor.

http://www.copradar.com/preview/chapt2/ch2d1.html

What I guess I am getting to is that if someone gets pinged at 105, or 55 in town, they were actually doing more than that.

Just another side to the debate.

[Mom]

Tag team plod on the northern motorway today. One hell of an accident blackspot that motorway extension particularly at "commuter hour". I travel at almost the same times every day, yesterday I saw 2 cars with naughty almost dead people (how they survived travelling at over 104kph is beyond me) being talked to on the side of the road. Thank goodness for cruise control.

I made the comment at the start of the month that it would be a great money spinner for the state at the times I commute, The comment in response was "they wont target the commuter, they will be on the open road looking for the speedsters" Tui anyone?

[buggerit]

Above post is very common sense.

Anyone ever noticed that the speedo errors almost always mean that you are doing less tan you thought you are?

I had a Gilera Runner a few years back. Two stoke monster scooter. It had a speedo that was reading 70 km/h/ when you were doing 55. I spoike to a bloke who said that in Italy, TPTB made it that way so that the ego-fuelled nutters who ride them could think they were doing 70 when they were only actually doing 55. Figured.

Back in 2013, my 2009 R1200RT has a speedo that reads 108 when I am doing 100 actual. If it was indicating 100, I'd be doing about 92 actual. If it was indicating 105, I'd actually be doing maybe 98.

From these things I suspect that most speedos register optimistically. Certainly the Corollas I've had over the years are maybe 10% optimistic.

So, in fact, if someone gets tagged at 105 actual (well, as good as a calibrated radar or laser is) on the open road, their speedo would have been reading well over that, due to speedo error.

Happy to hear folks honest experience on this, given that speedo error has become such a talking point.

Anyone know what cosine angle effect is? It always means that unless the detection device is being progressed directly down the axis of travel of the target vehicle, the readout will display less than the actual speed. Another factor in the motorists factor.

http://www.copradar.com/preview/chapt2/ch2d1.html

What I guess I am getting to is that if someone gets pinged at 105, or 55 in town, they were actually doing more than that.

Just another side to the debate.

With the advent of GPS a lot of us make adjustments for speedo error so may feel a little hard done by if ticketed round the 105kmh
mark if we think we are travelling 104 or less given the radar + - 3.2kmh margin for error.

[pritch]

I had a Gilera Runner a few years back. Two stoke monster scooter. It had a speedo that was reading 70 km/h/ when you were doing 55. I spoike to a bloke who said that in Italy, TPTB made it that way so that the ego-fuelled nutters who ride them could think they were doing 70 when they were only actually doing 55. Figured.

I don't think the Italian PTB could be so precise, Italian electrics and all that. My Ducati had a speedo that read 100kph when the bike was doing 130 actual. I'm eternally grateful that one of my mates told me before one of your mates did.

I bought a GPS to avoid mistakes with mental arithmetic.

For the record the Subaru reads 3kph fast, the Triumph reads 6kph fast.

[Gremlin]

So, in fact, if someone gets tagged at 105 actual (well, as good as a calibrated radar or laser is) on the open road, their speedo would have been reading well over that, due to speedo error.

Happy to hear folks honest experience on this, given that speedo error has become such a talking point.

Having put a GPS onto several vehicles to get an idea..

BMW GSA is around 3-5kph high of real at 110 indicated. Depends which tyres I'm running and how worn they are (you can tell the difference).
Honda CB919, 110 indicated is 100kph. By the way, these differences are obviously sliding scale, more accurate at lower speeds.
Merc C200 Wagon 2001, dead accurate at 100kph.
Toyota Rav4 2005, dead accurate at 100kph.
Holden VY Ute 2003, 100kph indicated is 102-103kph real. Only vehicle I've come across that actually under-reads. It probably shouldn't (legally speaking), and I have no idea why, as the tyres and rims are standard.

[rastuscat]

I don't think the Italian PTB could be so precise, Italian electrics and all that. My Ducati had a speedo that read 100kph when the bike was doing 130 actual. I'm eternally grateful that one of my mates told me before one of your mates did.

I bought a GPS to avoid mistakes with mental arithmetic.

For the record the Subaru reads 3kph fast, the Triumph reads 6kph fast.

Guess that coz they read fast, you'll never get a ticket based on speedo error. Until you start factoring that in, and compensate for it by going faster.

Gileras are notoriously optimistic, both in speed and maintenance.

The Duc speedo sounds dodgy. Could you really not tell it was out though? I'd have thought the fact that you were overtaking everything else would give it away.

[R650R]

With the advent of GPS a lot of us make adjustments for speedo error so may feel a little hard done by if ticketed round the 105kmh
mark if we think we are travelling 104 or less given the radar + - 3.2kmh margin for error.

I hold all you GPS lovers accountable for the extra speed enforcement. Before this technology blitz that we'll all soon b forced to have we were quite free... TomTom in USA already sells GPS data to police over there, not at an individual level but on location data of where lots of users are breaking the law, kinda the opposite of what the consumer gets about traffic jams... I'd be quite surprised if cops here aren't doing same, they seem to be on be 'good' bits of road that hey never patrolled before...
Used to work with a guy that 'calibrated' his speedo via GPS. Long story short was after he argued the point over 2 km/h on a ticket and announced his GPS it ended up in the whole company being looked at and 3 months worth of his offending being downloaded, which was quite eye opening...

[Jantar]

... The temporary limit only affects those who normally travel between 104kph and 110kph ....

Not quite, it affects those who believe they normally travel between 104 and 110 even though they normally travel between 94 and 100. It also affects those who normally travel under 100 but treat this as a 6kmh reduction. However, the total effect is drop in average speeds of considerably more than 6 kmh.

[Jantar]

...The Duc speedo sounds dodgy. Could you really not tell it was out though? I'd have thought the fact that you were overtaking everything else would give it away.

A couple of years ago I was travelling down to Lawrence to meet up with Scumdog and a few other Otago riders. I took the old RE5 for a spin, and because of its age etc I rode it quite gently at between 90 - 100 kmh indicated. The distance from Alexandra bridge to Lawrence is exactly 100 km, and as I was crossing the bridge I noted the time and thought I would be slightly late into Lawrence. During the whole trip to Lawrence I never once exceeded 100 on the speedo, yet my time to get there was 59 minutes. And, yes, I was still overtaking most other traffic.

This tells me my average speed was almost exactly (but slightly over) 100 kmh. Obviously my RE5 speedo under reads. I have since put the GPS on it, and at 50 kmh it is correct. At an indicated 100 kmh it is doing 110. At faster speeds it under reads one hell of a lot more.

[Berries]

Can the solar powered roadside speed check displays be relied on for accurate calibration as they would be a thing the public could use to check their speedo accuracty maybe?

No, they can't. I went past two within an an hour with the same speed on my digital speedo, the readings were different by 8km/h.