Bikers on the Rimutaka Hill

[TheDemonLord]

Fair call I suppose, but this is SH2 FFS. Fact is that semis and truck & trailer have to swing their front wheel over the line on the Wairarapa side on a few left hand corners. Still, for every truck doing this, there would be 10 cars (unnecessarily) crossing the centre line on right hand corners. Transit or the police could have several signs along the hill telling motorists to keep left/stop cutting corners, maybe warning other road users (cars) to be weary of bikes and trucks, but they just don't make that sort of coin like 5 k over the limit. Which exposes the crock of shit their whole safety campaign is.

As an ex truck driver some stand out roads I used to haul on were Whangamata to Waihi, Tairua to Whitianga, Arthurs Pass, and several dozen narrow bridges the length of the country. Whats the alternative... ship their shit to them on a daily basis, use 3 12 metre rigid trucks instead of one 22m semi... Not gonna happen.

Oh, Don't get me wrong - the Car drivers that cut blind corners should be lined up against the wall and shot at dawn - and you are 120% right about the Police not focussing on other areas of Road safety because it is difficult to enforce/collect fines for.

I guess the comment about SH2 being one of the roads is really indicitive of NZs roading infrastructure (calling it Shit would be an understatement when compared to other western countries)

[TheDemonLord]

They're not "sentiments". Rail will never be competitive in NZ mostly because of poor choices in rail gauge which limits rolling stock availability. You can't compare us to Europe. Our population density is minuscule. The economies of scale needed to make a complete overhaul of our rail network don't exist. Our road network is phenomenal when that is taken into account. Our traffic density is also tiny. Compared to Europe we barely have road congestion.

Rail could be competitive - it would take a lot of investment, it would take a lot of Accountants and NIMBYs being executed, it would take someone who is involved in planning to think for 5 minutes about future proofing a solution instead of the pervasive kiwi 'She'll be right mate' attitude that seems to infect all of our major govern-mental projects, and it would take someone with Balls to stick their neck out for the advancement of NZ

Actually - you are right, that will never happen....

[buggerit]

Didn't I?

If certain roads were closed to trucks - they would simply find an alternative route (with the increased cost of Haulage passed on to the consumer)

Then we would most likely see intense lobbying from the Haulage sector to change/improve/re-route certain roads so that they are now safe for Trucks

OR

industries would find alternatives (like Rail, Barge, Sea, Air) to deliver our goods.

More likely we would have 2 yrs of road works and end up with a boring bit of road

[caspernz]

This is an interesting comment - I agree that many truck drivers do indeed do their best to stay on their side of the road - but what if despite all the best efforts, they aren't?

To me at least, if a truck isn't able to safely navigate a stretch of road (and by safely I mean stay 100% on their side of the road 100% of the time), then they should not be allowed to drive it - I say this without predjudice to the truck driver themselves, but if the road is such that they cannot stay on their side - then their vehicle is not safe to drive on that peice of road.

This is a very valid point. I know from personal experience some vehicle combinations can stay within the lines all the way over and back. Some combinations can't. The sheer ignorance of some trucking firms sending combinations over that need one and a half lanes to negotiate the tighter corners simply pisses me off...maybe a bit more enforcement would make operators lean towards using the right vehicle combo for the Rimutaka Hill?

The big but is that on a road with centreline markings the law states something along the lines of travelling at a speed that allows you to stop within the lane visible to you...

So in some cases two wrongs end up in a prang.

[Pickle]

As far as bike riders go it is the group riders i feel are the most dangerous as the leader of the group will do an overtake pressuring all the followers to overtake to keep up with them. In such a situation I am sure safety is a secondary consideration to keeping up with the leader.

How is it that the person in front is pressuring others to overtake??? Surely they can choose to overtake when they feel it is safe can they not decide that - if not then maybe they should think twice about being on the road ( Car or Bike), take some responsibility for their own actions - stop balming others into pressuring them

[Grubber]

This is a very valid point. I know from personal experience some vehicle combinations can stay within the lines all the way over and back. Some combinations can't. The sheer ignorance of some trucking firms sending combinations over that need one and a half lanes to negotiate the tighter corners simply pisses me off...maybe a bit more enforcement would make operators lean towards using the right vehicle combo for the Rimutaka Hill?

The big but is that on a road with centreline markings the law states something along the lines of travelling at a speed that allows you to stop within the lane visible to you...

So in some cases two wrongs end up in a prang.

I think we can all share the road quite well inmost cases.
I find it's usually when an arrogant car driver thinks hes entitled to anything and everything most times.
size of or type of unit has no bearing if we all just took some time to use roads accordingly with other users.

[Old Steve]

It wouldn't seem as if the claims that the Rimutakas is one of NZs most dangerous roads is supported by fact, or at least the facts as given in the original article. Or has the NZTA got it's nose up it's arse?

In responce to BRONZ's comments about road barriers, "NZTA's Wellington highways manager Rod James said neither of the two motorcyclist deaths on the Rimutaka Road in the past 10 years was a consequence of a rider striking roadside barriers".

Neither of the two motorcyclist deaths in the past 10 years? I remember driving over the Rimutakas years and years ago, and I remember feeling aprehensive then even on 4 wheels. NZTA's Mr Rod James has to have his figures wrong. Or did he mean that only two motorcyclist deaths in the past 10 years were due to a ride striking a roadside barrier? If so, two deaths are two too many.

[SPman]

Last time I rode over the Rimutakas, it was midweek, and there was barely a car or truck on the hill. It was so good, I went back to the top and came back down again......damn the torpedoes and enjoy myself....then I figured....banging down footpegs mid corner on a GSXR1000 without crossing the centre line was probably not a good idea....I must be travelling a tad to fast with crap cornering technique....and.......think about the children....so I sold the bike, moved country and got a nice safe electric pushbike....the roads in NZ must be safer all round........

[FJRider]

It wouldn't seem as if the claims that the Rimutakas is one of NZs most dangerous roads is supported by fact, or at least the facts as given in the original article. Or has the NZTA got it's nose up it's arse?

In responce to BRONZ's comments about road barriers, NZTA's Wellington highways manager Rod James said ... "neither of the two motorcyclist deaths on the Rimutaka Road in the past 10 years was a consequence of a rider striking roadside barriers".

"Dangerous" is not always death related. Injury accidents count as well ... and not ALL of those are reported/noticed in the papers (who has time to read them). Only deaths make the TV news ...

If the man said .... I guess that's what he meant ...

Hitting the road ... or another vehicle ... can cause death. With all the hate on WRB's ... how many bikers have actually died (Nationwide) from hitting them .. ???

True the resulting prospect of hitting them on (or after coming off) a motorcycle is not good. But a head on with a campervan is not recommended either ...

[oneofsix]

In responce to BRONZ's comments about road barriers, "NZTA's Wellington highways manager Rod James said neither of the two motorcyclist deaths on the Rimutaka Road in the past 10 years was a consequence of a rider striking roadside barriers".

amusing in that I think BRONZ was commenting on the NEW barriers put in during the road reconstruction in the last year or so, the ones that have been raised in height to allow for SUV's (largest new car market), not so good for bikes or smaller convertibles like hairdresser/midlife crisis cars. So what does the last 10 years have to do with barriers installed in the last year or so? How come overseas prove isn't relevant when it comes to protecting bikers but can be used to promote hi-vis and WRBs etc?

[Ocean1]

"Dangerous" is not always death related.

Yeahyeah, but Steve's got a point. A lot of carnage, no doubt to be labelled one of the nation's most dangerous roads. But just 2 bike fatalities? I can't remember hearing of more than that. Well, not for years.

Are the Rimutakas in fact a statistically safe bike road in spite of the rhetoric? Or am I missing sommat? Again.

[Ocean1]

How come overseas prove isn't relevant when it comes to protecting bikers but can be used to promote hi-vis and WRBs etc?

Just 'cause. OK?

[oneofsix]

Just 'cause. OK?

you split the question. Where ix the just cause in using overseas in one case but not another?

[FJRider]

... How come overseas prove isn't relevant when it comes to protecting bikers but can be used to promote hi-vis and WRBs etc?

Show me a Barrier that "Protects" bikers when they hit it ... ???

The cause listed in a large number of Biker accidents is seemingly .. "Lost control in a bend" ... show me a "barrier" that will save his ass when that happens ...

[FJRider]

Yeahyeah, but Steve's got a point. A lot of carnage, no doubt to be labelled one of the nation's most dangerous roads. But just 2 bike fatalities? I can't remember hearing of more than that. Well, not for years.

Are the Rimutakas in fact a statistically safe bike road in spite of the rhetoric? Or am I missing sommat? Again.

So ... if you don't die. Your result is with just a seriously mangled body ... it wasn't dangerous after all .. ???