Going on the road for the first time

[varminter]

It was so much easier in my day, we had a man with a red flag to walk in front. That was after the tree hours getting the steam up.

[TheDemonLord]

Doesn't TheDemonLord go there though? It might not pay to mention that...

If my guess is correct - She would be the one that I helped with a counter-steering exercise - following her on my 'Busa - she started to get the hang of it

[koi]

If my guess is correct - She would be the one that I helped with a counter-steering exercise - following her on my 'Busa - she started to get the hang of it

That's me :~) Thankyou for that by the way!!

[eldog]

counter-steering exercise

I cant make it to NASS. Its too far away at present - time/license wise

I still got no idea about countersteering. I understand it, but i dont seem to do it.

maybe a bit stupid.

Any exercise in particular?

does it help if its a bigger bike?

suggestions

[Latte]

The road is dangerous, buy a pushbike, and an R1 for me, I'll let you know how it goes.

[Moi]

... I still got no idea about countersteering. I understand it, but i don't seem to do it... suggestions

Have a look at this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EFm3honeTQo

It might help.

[Reckless]

If my guess is correct - She would be the one that I helped with a counter-steering exercise - following her on my 'Busa - she started to get the hang of it

That's me :~) Thankyou for that by the way!!

Have a look at this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EFm3honeTQo

It might help.

Oh dear The counter steering myth at its very worst
So this guy is constantly counter steering right through every corner he takes?
Basically opposite locking, forcing the bike to do something un-natural in every corner that the bike goes round???

I hope to hell no one is teaching new riders to do that FFS

[Moi]

Oh dear The counter steering myth at its very worst
So this guy is constantly counter steering right through every corner he takes?
Basically opposite locking, forcing the bike to do something un-natural in every corner that the bike goes round???

I hope to hell no one is teaching new riders to do that FFS

We await your explanation of "the counter steering myth at its very worst"

and why not to teach new riders to do it?

[Reckless]

Mate I dont want to come across as a know it all and usually steer (pun) away from these debates on KB.
But teaching new riders whats in that vid as a normal way to ride imho is wrong.

A lot of typing I don't have time for but we all know you have to countersteer briefly to initiate a turn and thats the only countersteering that is generally required.

[eldog]

Mate I dont want to come across as a know it all and usually steer (pun) away from these debates on KB.
But teaching new riders whats in that vid as a normal way to ride imho is wrong.

A lot of typing I don't have time for but we all know you have to countersteer briefly to initiate a turn and thats the only countersteering that is generally required.

I haven't looked at vid just yet - got weekend for that stuff

I understand what you say about starting a turn via counter steering

So I am going to look elsewhere (KB & web) about what to do mid corner if I got the start of the corner wrong (noob all over the place at the moment)


I didn't expect to hijack the thread

[MisterD]

I still got no idea about countersteering. I understand it, but i dont seem to do it.

maybe a bit stupid.

Any exercise in particular?

does it help if its a bigger bike?

suggestions

It works for pushbikes just the same, and yeah things differ a bit there because the footpegs go round and the lycra brigade don't talk about "countersteering", but they do know that fast cornering is about putting your weight on your outside pedal and inside bar and it is countersteering that they're doing.

We await your explanation of "the counter steering myth at its very worst" and why not to teach new riders to do it?

Anyone who starts an explanation of countersteering without talking about gyroscopes doesn't understand what's happening.

[TheDemonLord]

Mate I dont want to come across as a know it all and usually steer (pun) away from these debates on KB.
But teaching new riders whats in that vid as a normal way to ride imho is wrong.

A lot of typing I don't have time for but we all know you have to countersteer briefly to initiate a turn and thats the only countersteering that is generally required.

So, then you agree, you need to Countersteer to turn the bike (because one cannot turn without initiating said turn) - although if we want to be pedants - you use countersteering to adjust the lean angle of the bike, and then the difference in circumference between the inner edge of the tyre in contact with the road and the middle of the tyre in contact with the road (because the tyre is curved) is what turns the bike.

[The End]

My understanding is, and has always been, that whether you are new to riding or have been riding 10 years, you know how to countersteer as there is no other way to turn a bike at speed.

Now, whether you are aware that you are countersteering or you know how to do it properly is another question.

[Reckless]

So, then you agree, you need to Countersteer to turn the bike (because one cannot turn without initiating said turn) - although if we want to be pedants - you use countersteering to adjust the lean angle of the bike, and then the difference in circumference between the inner edge of the tyre in contact with the road and the middle of the tyre in contact with the road (because the tyre is curved) is what turns the bike.

My understanding is, and has always been, that whether you are new to riding or have been riding 10 years, you know how to countersteer as there is no other way to turn a bike at speed.

Now, whether you are aware that you are countersteering or you know how to do it properly is another question.

Demon you have got it sussed and you are correct its the second part I don't agree with.
Correct also TheEnd.

I have to go down and put a new rear tyre on the road bike and do a bit on the race bike i'm building. Normally I stay clear of these discussions because there is really no completely wrong answer. I simply don't agree that learners need to learn to counter steer right through a corners as normal riding practice for many reasons. I dont agree that it is good practice for us either. But since I have opened this thorny subject when I have time I may write down my thoughts from what i have learned over 40 years of riding and superbike school etc. Mainly because I believe the over use of countersteering is not a safe way to ride and not a safe way to learn to ride.
But there is a fair bit of typing to put forward a logical well reasoned case for why not.

[MisterD]

So, then you agree, you need to Countersteer to turn the bike (because one cannot turn without initiating said turn) - although if we want to be pedants - you use countersteering to adjust the lean angle of the bike, and then the difference in circumference between the inner edge of the tyre in contact with the road and the middle of the tyre in contact with the road (because the tyre is curved) is what turns the bike.

The wheel is a gyroscope, and gyroscopes translate applied torque through 90 degrees, so counter steering isn't actually turning the wheel, the torque you apply to the bar, due to the gyroscopic effect, leans the wheel over.