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Thread: ACC proposals on motorcycle levies

  1. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by cassina View Post
    You sound like you do not want to improve road safety by wanting all taxpayers to pay whether they are at fault or not. With an at fault based fee structure there is incentive for better road safety is there not ?
    you're Retarted.

  2. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by cassina View Post
    So then to use an analogy the fact you can get a fine if you are caught over the speed limit is no incentive to keep to the speed limit? People without registration through having no money still have to pay eg community service vehicle confiscation. So there is no escape if you cant pay. Most people can, otherwise the registration fees would definitly drop.
    nope, because the people who can't pay don't make the rules, over paid rich farts make the rules People who cant pay, don't pay, don't turn up to community service unless a group of their mates will be there also. Vehicle confiscation just means they can't get a job even if they wanted to so can't pay taxes, can only cost. Yep really sounds like a win win.
    Great minds discuss ideas, average minds discuss events, small minds discuss people. --- Unknown sage

  3. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by cassina View Post
    Out of all the members of this site very few have posted in this thread and some of those who have, have attacked my idea of shifting the higher motorcycle cost to those who are actually at fault.
    Have you ever actually stopped to work out who is usually at fault in a motorcycle crash?

    I hate to be the bearer of bad news but when you combine single vehicle crashes with multi-vehicle crashes, the motorcyclist carries the whole, primary, or partial blame more than 60% of the time.

  4. #49
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    And furthermore, in the multi-vehicle crashes where the motorcyclist (supposedly) carries none of the blame there is probably a fairly high percentage that can be attributed to the motorcyclist not concentrating sufficiently on what they're doing.

  5. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Katman View Post
    Have you ever actually stopped to work out who is usually at fault in a motorcycle crash?

    I hate to be the bearer of bad news but when you combine single vehicle crashes with multi-vehicle crashes, the motorcyclist carries the whole, primary, or partial blame more than 60% of the time.
    Agreed.

    Quote Originally Posted by Katman View Post
    And furthermore, in the multi-vehicle crashes where the motorcyclist (supposedly) carries none of the blame there is probably a fairly high percentage that can be attributed to the motorcyclist not concentrating sufficiently on what they're doing.
    And agreed. Just motorcyclists and their loved ones don't want to hear this. Saw someone's partner of a member on here stating on FB that over 80% of motorcycle accidents were the fault of car drivers...

  6. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by oneofsix View Post
    nope, because the people who can't pay don't make the rules, over paid rich farts make the rules People who cant pay, don't pay, don't turn up to community service unless a group of their mates will be there also. Vehicle confiscation just means they can't get a job even if they wanted to so can't pay taxes, can only cost. Yep really sounds like a win win.
    What he said ... plus ... the poor hurting motorcyclists that these pricks run into ... need their bills paid.


    AND ... as I asked you earlier ... WHO PAYS THEN ..???? I'm guessing the tax payer.
    When life throws you a curve ... Lean into it ...

  7. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Katman View Post
    And furthermore, in the multi-vehicle crashes where the motorcyclist (supposedly) carries none of the blame there is probably a fairly high percentage that can be attributed to the motorcyclist not concentrating sufficiently on what they're doing.
    Maybe they should be sent to concentration camp.

  8. #53
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    Case dismissed.

  9. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Katman View Post
    And furthermore, in the multi-vehicle crashes where the motorcyclist (supposedly) carries none of the blame there is probably a fairly high percentage that can be attributed to the motorcyclist not concentrating sufficiently on what they're doing.
    I agree ... But plain and simply ... even the most skilled and experienced motorcyclists are still at risk from those motorists (on two wheels AND four) who have no regard whatsoever for the interests and safety of any (other than themselves).

    And even those motorcyclists can be the subject of circumstances beyond their control. I believe it would be ignorant to claim that motorcycling is (and/or .. should be [in legislation]) free of the risk of injury.

    At best we can reduce the risk of injury ... or be prepared to take responsibility in the times we don't.
    When life throws you a curve ... Lean into it ...

  10. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by cassina View Post
    Or to simplify what you have just said you are happy with the current ACC postion that the motorcyclist should pay more for the simple reason its their own silly fault for owning a motorcycle and not a car, irrespective of who is at fault. I bet your thinking and the thinking of a few others on this MB would change if you were knocked off through the fault of someone else but whoever that someone else is you could likely let them off by saying you were not concertrating too eh?
    Cherry picking much?

    All he said was that motorcyclists are not infallible. Even when we arent directly responsible, there are a number of indirect variables that could be placed on the shoulders of the motorcyclist that contributed to the accident.

    Please reconsider retaking English comprehension classes. You're obviously terrible at it.
    I never get lost. I go on adventures

  11. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by cassina View Post
    Or to simplify what you have just said you are happy with the current ACC postion that the motorcyclist should pay more for the simple reason its their own silly fault for owning a motorcycle and not a car, irrespective of who is at fault.
    Few own a motorcycle and not risk health and lives by riding it. Simply owning a motorcycle is not the cause of ACC policy. It's just the end result of how many have ridden in the past. And still do.

    Quote Originally Posted by cassina View Post
    I bet your thinking and the thinking of a few others on this MB would change if you were knocked off through the fault of someone else but whoever that someone else is you could likely let them off by saying you were not concertrating too eh?
    Many have and will give up riding for this very reason. If you can't take the risk ... I might suggest you do the same.

    For our safety at least ..
    When life throws you a curve ... Lean into it ...

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    Quote Originally Posted by cassina View Post
    And you think its fair we pay more as a result of indirect variables? That would be like when one car hits another car and despite only one car being at fault the driver of the other car is charged too due to "indirect variables" While I dont doubt that in accidents fault can be attributed to both parties generally speaking for the majority this is not the case and you are just being semantical.
    An indirect variable can be ... when a vehicle pulls out in front of a motorcycle on a wet day. Reduced braking ability meaning the bike cannot stop in time. In the dry they might be able to. Is the biker still at fault ..???

    Poor decisions kill ... be it your decisions ... or another's ... fault is not as cut and dry as you often suggest.
    When life throws you a curve ... Lean into it ...

  13. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by cassina View Post
    Or to simplify what you have just said you are happy with the current ACC postion that the motorcyclist should pay more for the simple reason its their own silly fault for owning a motorcycle and not a car, irrespective of who is at fault. I bet your thinking and the thinking of a few others on this MB would change if you were knocked off through the fault of someone else but whoever that someone else is you could likely let them off by saying you were not concertrating too eh?
    Your keyboard seems to be running out of full stops, I'll donate you some of mine.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cassina View Post
    I get you message sport either pay up or give up. What I dont know though is how many other motorcyclists out there think the same way as you and the few others who have entered into the debate.
    The ACC policy is (currently) the only game in town. And seems unlikely to change any time soon. My advise is get your own private health insurance. If you NEED medical assistance ... you get it NOW. NO waiting lists ... NO delay. And back on the road sooner.

    ACC policy is based on the financial drain on the countries medical resources by motorcyclists (or risk thereof) ... reduce that drain ... and ACC might change their policy.

    That change may also come about by the change of attitude by all motorcyclists ... be careful where you point the finger of blame. And don't be too quick to point the finger either .... blame can be a double edged sword.
    When life throws you a curve ... Lean into it ...

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    Quote Originally Posted by cassina View Post
    So by your warped sense of justice you would fine both the car driver and bike rider an equal amount then? In case you didnt know cars do not have as much traction in the wet either so if it was car v car I guess it will still be equal blame by your thinking too.
    Best you google indirect variables. Car vs car or car vs bike ... similar result. In a car vs bike ... the result is seldom equal. Even a thick bitch as you appear to be ... would understand that.


    And is English your second language .. ???
    When life throws you a curve ... Lean into it ...

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