19 years old german w&t

**Ole8991** · 15th January 2018, 18:45

Hey there,
Im 19 years old and in Germany i am allowed to drive bikes up to 48 ps. The license is called A2. Which bikes can i drive in nz ? (I have got an international license too).
Also im looking for people joining me on my tour, starting in Auckland.
But before, where can i get a reliable bike for about 4000$ ? I heard about redbaron in auckland and specially the rebuy-option sounds very good.
Im already in Auckland and i would be thankful for any help.
Looking forward ti hear from you...

**AllanB** · 15th January 2018, 19:40

Buy this - fly down and ride back or ship it up.

Keep the change for decent riding gear and NZ hookers.

https://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/s...-lams-approved

**jellywrestler** · 15th January 2018, 21:15

Originally Posted by AllanB

Buy this - fly down and ride back or ship it up.

Keep the change for decent riding gear and NZ hookers.

https://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/s...-lams-approved

sold real quickly

**PeterNZ** · 16th January 2018, 09:49

I would like to give you this as a warning: German tourist had barely driven before NZ crash that killed his friend. No I don't want to be a spoil sport but I think you should read it.

Your post raises several questions to me. How long have you been riding a bike? Under what conditions? Are you aware we drive on the left hand side? Are you aware that driving in NZ is totally different to Germany? Oh by the way, I am a German living in New Zealand so I know what I am talking about. Rental companies usually don't give you a car unless you are at least 25. There is a reason for this! Do we need another dead tourist in New Zealand? (recommended reading: "German tourist killed on first day of two-week motorcycle tour of New Zealand" and "German tourist critically injured in Coromandel crash"

What happens when (not "if") you happen to be on the wrong side of the road?

Some more practical questions: The A2 license is limited to 35 kw which is 47 HP (PS = Pferdestaerke which translates into HP Horse power) and a max weight to power ratio of 0.2 kw per kg (0.27 HP per kg). How does this translate into our LAMS system? Is a 19 year old tourist allowed to drive any bike with 47 hp ignoring our LAMS regulations? Or is he allowed only to drive a LAMS bike?

Next question, insurance. What happens in the likely event that you not only injure/kill yourself but also someone else? What insurance in the world will pay out for a 19 year old learner driver who thought he can drive a powerful bike in a foreign country on the other road side under unfamiliar conditions?

And now I ask for a favor. Could you please publish your travel itinerary with times and days so that we can stay out of your way?

I am aware that I will get some oposing replies to this. But I believe that everybody with a functional brain would see that a 19 year old German with 1 year bike practice on totally perfect roads in Europe will pose a substantial risk to himself and others in New Zealand on a 47 HP bike. I personally think there should be a law against this to protect him (or is it her?) and others.

Now fire away....

Cheers

Peter

**EJK** · 16th January 2018, 09:56

Originally Posted by PeterNZ

I would like to give you this as a warning: German tourist had barely driven before NZ crash that killed his friend. No I don't want to be a spoil sport but I think you should read it.

Your post raises several questions to me. How long have you been riding a bike? Under what conditions? Are you aware we drive on the left hand side? Are you aware that driving in NZ is totally different to Germany? Oh by the way, I am a German living in New Zealand so I know what I am talking about. Rental companies usually don't give you a car unless you are at least 25. There is a reason for this! Do we need another dead tourist in New Zealand? (recommended reading: "German tourist killed on first day of two-week motorcycle tour of New Zealand" and "German tourist critically injured in Coromandel crash"

What happens when (not "if") you happen to be on the wrong side of the road?

Some more practical questions: The A2 license is limited to 35 kw which is 47 HP (PS = Pferdestaerke which translates into HP Horse power) and a max weight to power ratio of 0.2 kw per kg (0.27 HP per kg). How does this translate into our LAMS system? Is a 19 year old tourist allowed to drive any bike with 47 hp ignoring our LAMS regulations? Or is he allowed only to drive a LAMS bike?

Next question, insurance. What happens in the likely event that you not only injure/kill yourself but also someone else? What insurance in the world will pay out for a 19 year old learner driver who thought he can drive a powerful bike in a foreign country on the other road side under unfamiliar conditions?

And now I ask for a favor. Could you please publish your travel itinerary with times and days so that we can stay out of your way?

I am aware that I will get some oposing replies to this. But I believe that everybody with a functional brain would see that a 19 year old German with 1 year bike practice on totally perfect roads in Europe will pose a substantial risk to himself and others in New Zealand on a 47 HP bike. I personally think there should be a law against this to protect him (or is it her?) and others.

Now fire away....

Cheers

Peter

Wow that's a really tasty bait.

Throwing out the baby with the bath water much?

**PeterNZ** · 16th January 2018, 10:47

Originally Posted by EJK

Wow that's a really tasty bait.

I know, I know.

Originally Posted by EJK

Throwing out the baby with the bath water much?

I am not getting your second comment, sorry.

Just a reminder, the same driver as the OP would have a restricted license in NZ. These are the restrictions:

You can drive on your own between 5am and 10pm.
You must not carry any passengers on your motorcycle or moped or in any sidecar.
You must not tow another vehicle.
You must only ride a LAMS approved motorcycle.

Do they apply to tourists as well? If not, why not?

The one link I posted in my previous post where the German 19 year old killed his friend on Coromandel would have been illegal in NZ. He would have had a restricted license and wouldn't have been allowed to drive from Hamilton to Coromandel with a passenger. Maybe, just maybe the girl would still be alive. Imagine that!

Cheers

Peter

**Ole8991** · 16th January 2018, 14:32

Hey there.
First of all, i understand everything you say. Biking is dangerous and even more for beginners like me. But think further. When and where should i learn how to pay attention to the throttle then in new zealand. It is not just a beautiful landscape to ride through, but also a great chance to improve my riding. Its a foreign country and foreign rules so i asked you to help me. You dont know me and my driving skills, but i am totally aware of all danger and would never take another soul with me unless i know the road and stuff. Trust me when i say, that i will be absolutly careful on my way for my and everybodies lives. Thats why i repeat my wish for another foreign or native biker to come with me or support my tour with helpful comments.
Thanks a lot also for the warning. I will keep that in mind for everyones secrurity.

P.S. red baron told me about lams and together we found 2 bikes. A cruiser with about 200ccm and an old honda also 200ccm which, they told me, i will be allowed to drive. Do somebody know a service station in Auckland, where i can bring them and they just do a quick check for low money ?

**OddDuck** · 16th January 2018, 15:33

Just in (mild) support of what PeterNZ said...

I spent a month in Germany about, oh, eight years ago? I was amazed at how neatly everything ran, how people obeyed the rules, how drivers were courteous and considerate.

Then I came back to New Zealand. The comparison was quite a shock. It was like coming home to the Wild West, anything goes!! Except 160 Kph+ on the motorway. Dammit.

I wouldn't say don't do it. This is one of the greatest countries on earth to be a biker.

I would say, have a rest after the flights, get yourself a place roadside somewhere, watch traffic for a bit before riding. See how people drive here, see what the culture around vehicles is.

Hazards to expect while touring away from cities:

1) livestock in the middle of the road

2) vehicles stopped in the middle of the road

3) gravel sprayed across the road from driveways, side areas etc

4) rough, uneven roading surfaces - big potholes and bumps

5) very big trucks on very narrow country roads

All of these could be just around the next corner. Everything I've listed above is from direct experience, I've had every single one of these over the years. And...

6) the biggest: you. Fatigue, dehydration, hunger, racing the clock, etc etc, if you catch yourself starting to make mistakes, think very seriously about pulling over and taking a break, even just for a minute or two.

and less dangerous but still a touring reality:

Lots of the country still closes at about 6 - 7 pm. 24 hour petrol is possible in the bigger country towns but in the interesting / pretty bits of the country, it can't really be counted on. If in doubt, gas up at 5 or so. If unsure about whether there's petrol ahead, ask a local or check the internet, don't take it for granted that because there's a placename, there's a petrol station.

Slow drivers. Lots of these. If you're on a small capacity bike, take your time, wait for a passing lane or clear roads. Don't chance it with overtakes, whatever's coming the other way may be moving much faster or be much wider than expected.

Weather. NZ weather can be very changeable, keep an eye on the forecasts, be prepared to buy gear if you don't already have it. See above note about petrol stations, the shops in most of small town NZ are worse, everything closes at 5-ish or maybe 6 if you're lucky.

Distance. It can take a surprisingly long time to get from A to B, the better petrol station maps have suggested allowed driving / riding times, allow for this in your travel plans. A lot of our main roads pass through towns with 50 kmph speed limits and normal urban traffic, this can really add to the travel time.

People can go on a bit about dodgy Kiwi driving and / or tourists... it's real but it's overstated. Stay alert and be nice to people and you should be fine.

Sounds like you'll have an adventure, hope it works out!

**YellowDog** · 16th January 2018, 17:36

The warnings are valid.

The main roads will not be a problem, as there are other vehicles to act as a guide.

When you are on country lanes, with no other bikes, your brain will pull you over to the right (not left) side of the road.

This can kill you, so do be cautious at all times.

I have driven throughout Europe. It is easier in a left hand drive car, but on a bike and with no other cars, it is very easy to lapse.

VTNZ have facilities to test a vehicle for you, before you buy. They are all over NZ, so ask for a pre-sale inspection to be done.

Good luck and ride safe

**neels** · 16th January 2018, 21:32

Originally Posted by Ole8991

P.S. red baron told me about lams and together we found 2 bikes. A cruiser with about 200ccm and an old honda also 200ccm which, they told me, i will be allowed to drive. Do somebody know a service station in Auckland, where i can bring them and they just do a quick check for low money ?

200cc is a small bike for open road riding in New Zealand.

If you have equivalent to a NZ restricted licence then you can get a wide range of bikes up to 650cc, check the LAMS list.

As per the above comments, NZ roads are different (and in a lot of cases of much lower standard) than the rest of the world, but at the same time a great experience on a bike. Keep your mind on the job and stay aware of the other road users and you will enjoy.

When I was driving in France I avoided the motorways wherever possible and used the N roads as they were the same as driving on NZ roads, the traffic was more challenging but the scenery over what a motorway would show you was worth the extra effort.

**PeterNZ** · 17th January 2018, 16:14

Originally Posted by Ole8991

Hey there.
First of all, i understand everything you say. Biking is dangerous and even more for beginners like me. But think further. When and where should i learn how to pay attention to the throttle then in new zealand. It is not just a beautiful landscape to ride through, but also a great chance to improve my riding. Its a foreign country and foreign rules so i asked you to help me.

Umm, really? It is better to get riding practice in a foreign environment with foreign rules and foreign driving behaviour? Please allow me to disagree.

Originally Posted by Ole8991

You dont know me and my driving skills, but i am totally aware of all danger and would never take another soul with me unless i know the road and stuff.

Fact is if the New Zealand rules apply to you (which I hope) you are simply not allowed to take someone with you, no matter whether you "know the road and stuff" or not. Let me spell it out in capitals again: "NO PASSENGERS FULL STOP" if you are on a restricted license. This already tells me that you don't seem to know the rules here.

Originally Posted by Ole8991

Trust me when i say, that i will be absolutly careful on my way for my and everybodies lives. Thats why i repeat my wish for another foreign or native biker to come with me or support my tour with helpful comments.
Thanks a lot also for the warning. I will keep that in mind for everyones secrurity.

Where have I heard this before? I am sure others who are not with us anymore thought the same, that they are absolutly[sic] careful . Would I take the responsibility to look after a 19 year old tourist with almost no riding practice? Probably not.

Don't get me wrong, I don't want to spoil your holidays. I even know how you think because me too was once 19 and rode a bike. Now I am over 50 and I worry about you. Maybe let's agree to take a mix of the two of us, Me being worried and you being self-confident. Just take it easy and be relaxed but still awake and attentive. Please read the other answers here, there are some brilliant points raised. ALso this post on the forum is recommended: It Won't Happen To Me, I don't need to change.

Cheers and have a great holiday.

Peter

**FJRider** · 17th January 2018, 17:32

Originally Posted by PeterNZ

Umm, really? It is better to get riding practice in a foreign environment with foreign rules and foreign driving behaviour? Please allow me to disagree.

Fact is ... most of the riders here don't obey the rules anyway. And ... many of the other motorists are foreign and are unfamiliar with the rules too ... and some of them are probably his countrymen.

WE have ACC ... no need for him to have medical insurance ... as we would in Germany ...

**PeterNZ** · 17th January 2018, 17:35

Originally Posted by FJRider

Fact is ... most of the riders here don't obey the rules anyway. And ... many of the other motorists are foreign and are unfamiliar with the rules too ... and some of them are probably his countrymen.

WE have ACC ... no need for him to have medical insurance ... as we would in Germany ...

Ahh well then....

I was actually talking about injuries/damages/death of others. ACC doesn't pay for that. And yes, ACC pays wheelchairs, great! That's a relief, isn't it?

Cheers

Peter