The "didn't see you" idea

[vtec]

I've had a thought, and this comes up often. I always hear people's saying that they don't see motorbikes, and I've had experience of people taking me out, so I know how it works.

Here's my thought. I feel that they most often do see the bikes, but they just either don't register them as part of the traffic in their brains, or they can't judge our speed and treat us like bicycle's cause we are smaller. I reckon that its just a subconscious thing that goes on in people's heads. As we all know most of the time you are driving, its done subconsciously.

So what do you guys think? Do they see us but just (badly) misjudge the situation, or just not see us at all?

P.S. I've found riding bicycles people are way more likely to cut you off or try to take you out than on a motorbike, cause they are smaller again.

[M1CRO:Me]

...Do they see us but just (badly) misjudge the situation, or ...

I think the old saying is "Might is right" (or something like that). If your NOT BIG then you are no threat - so yeah, I vote for "misjudge"

[inlinefour]

I think that we live in a rights based society, where responsibility is forgotten or not considered important. I think they see us allright, have to do a sight test to get a licience. They just believe that their "right" to do something outweights anyone elses' "right", irrelevant of what they law might say of the situation.

[vtec]

My point for starting this thread, is that it feels like they are shifting blame back onto you when they use the "didn't see you" theory, and I think that's the only reason why they say it... most of the time. They'll use that excuse in every crash.

[DemonWolf]

Think Inlinefour is on to something here... Though it goes further than that.. the 'Didn't see you' is more likely 'I badly misjudged the situation and thought I could get through' .... People generally do not like admitting to their faults.. and the 'I didn't see you' shifts the blame off them... Yet they know that if they were in the wrong that they were actually in the wrong. Its just people do not own up to their responsibilities in this society... and yeah I'm as sure hell as guilty of that.

[Lou Girardin]

I didn't see you really means I didn't look properly.
Like the import who possibly saw the truck turning right next to me, but I didn't register. She couldn't have looked very hard though, because I watched her as she came into view and pulled out in front of me. She didn't look to her right once. She did look when she got an earfull of horn from a metre away though.

[Mental Trousers]

A few years back when me and a 2 others cobbled together a driving simulator for the Psych Department, one of the studies done was on this exact problem. They found that drivers do see motorcycles, but they don't recognize them as something to watch out for.

From memory, the reason was something to do with a motorcycle not being large enough to pose a serious threat to the driver combined with the riders head and face being covered by a helmet, the driver doesn't recognize the rider as being an actual person to watch out for.

For instance, a car is large and poses a serious threat to the drivers health and therefore they acknowledge it. Also, a person on a bicycle is recognised as being a person because the driver can see the cyclists head (even with a stack hat on) and therefore needs to be avoided so theres no injury to that person.

[FlyingDutchMan]

I recently got me a cage (I hate the damn thing!), and I've noticed it is really hard to be concious of everything on the road - its like it puts your brain to sleep, not to mention how much harder it is to see out with the damn pillars and restrictive seating. It takes serious concentration to be anywhere near as aware of things than it does on the bike.

[F5 Dave]

Further tests as MT above mentions (‘scientific studies have shown. . .’, love that ) made the same conclusion. People noticed a motorbike before a bicycle, a car before a bike, a truck before a car

. . . & above all a cop mounted on a motorcycle. He obviously posed the biggest perceived threat.

So they see you, they just don’t fear you.

[Beemer]

I think it's a combination of more than one thing - firstly a bike is smaller than a car, so they look for a car-sized object when they check to see if anything is coming and often a bike just doesn't register with them. Secondly, a bike isn't threatening like a truck, so if they don't perceive you as a threat, they tend to not worry about pulling out in front of you. It may be that they think "bike" and view it the same way as a pushbike - which definitely isn't a threat to them. And sometimes they bloody well did see you but figured they could beat you. When you hit them, they figured the easiest thing to do is claim they didn't see you, then it somehow won't be their fault.

And the other option is, they are fuckwits!

[F5 Dave]

Scientific studies have shown. . that people are fuckwits.
Has a nice ring.

[snuffles]

I believe in making myself as visible as possible, mounted additional spots under the main light and ride with High beam on all the time, also wear bloody bright rflecto jacket when riding alone or at night.

I'm a fairly big guy on a big bike, I'm just waiting for the shit head who knocks me off to say " I didnt see you "................ I will then be forced to insert whats left of the Bandit up his arse, hot bits first.

[Motu]

How many threads are we going to start on this one - there was one yesterday,one today - who want's to start tomorrows one?

Buy a big block Harley,get a Nazi helmet and get the missus to make you a Headhunter patch on her Jemone - then see if the car driver sees you as a ''significant threat''...

[Lou Girardin]

If they don't fear us, it can be fixed.

[Korea]

]...not to mention how much harder it is to see out with the damn pillars and restrictive seating. It takes serious concentration to be anywhere near as aware of things than it does on the bike.

So true... Riders enjoy a much greater degree of peripheral vision than cars - they don't have a bloody great big pillar blocking their view to either side.
Also, a rider scans further up the road, left, right, eyes scanning for the next threat that wants to run them off the side of the street.
Plenty of car drivers just switch-off behind the wheel like they're at a drive-in movie. KBer's with cars excepted of course!