Petition for removal of L plate and 70km/hr limit????

**Hawkeye** · 10th September 2006, 17:06

Originally Posted by WarlockNZ

Based on the lack of response i'm getting i'm going to assume that most of you guys who winge about the 70k limit are not interested in doing anything but that ... winging!.

Should any of you actually have an interest in, at least trying, to do something about this stupid law, you all know how to get hold of me. to date i have sent out forms to 4 people and i'm informed that we currently have upwards of 200 signatures. we need a whole lot more people. time to put your signatures where your mouths are.

The problem I see here is that there is only a 6 month window for winging. Whilst in the window, the winging happens. Once outside of the window, with restricted in hand, it is no longer an issue therefore the 'I'm alright Jack' mentality kicks in.

**WarlockNZ** · 10th September 2006, 17:12

Originally Posted by SwanTiger

You're better off associating with BRONZ and using their established entity to acheive your desired goal.

People are more likely to support a voice than they are a piece of paper with signatures.

Also.

Getting angry at people and insulting them for their lack of support is pointless too, if you aren't getting attention with your petition then perhaps you need to change your approach to gain better results.

Here is an idea.

Why not make a pretty box, print out the forms and take them into every bike dealership you can find that will support your cause.

5 signatures per day x 5 dealerships x 6 working days x 4 weeks = 600 signatures in a month.

Already got that covered my friend

... it would seem to me that BRONZ have more important things to worry about than something as small as this and as for using an estiblished voice?? ... whats wrong with mine, i personally see something wrong with the current law and i'm excersing my democratic right to try and do something about it, it may only be one voice, but if people such as yourself (who i believe got pinged on thursday?) added your voice to mine, then i wouldn't be alone now would I ??. the typical kiwi attitude seems to prevail here... don't worry mate, she'll be right, someone else will short it out for me, well sorry mate ... that someone is me and i'm asking for your help. so i guess the balls in your court huh ... oh and by the way ... my offer to show at your court hearing still stands

**SwanTiger** · 10th September 2006, 17:22

Originally Posted by WarlockNZ

Already got that covered my friend

... it would seem to me that BRONZ have more important things to worry about than something as small as this and as for using an estiblished voice?? ... whats wrong with mine, i personally see something wrong with the current law and i'm excersing my democratic right to try and do something about it, it may only be one voice, but if people such as yourself (who i believe got pinged on thursday?) added your voice to mine, then i wouldn't be alone now would I ??. the typical kiwi attitude seems to prevail here... don't worry mate, she'll be right, someone else will short it out for me, well sorry mate ... that someone is me and i'm asking for your help. so i guess the balls in your court huh ... oh and by the way ... my offer to show at your court hearing still stands

I would've thought that BRONZ being the organisation they are would of jumped at the opportunity to support such an effort.

Yeah I got pinged on Thursday, however out dated laws and incompetent cow boy cops are two different things. You're welcome to come with me to Court, I'd apreciate the support.

I'll pledge my signature, however I don't have faith in a patition alone acheiving the desired result. So I'm keen to hear more about your ideas and goals.

**WarlockNZ** · 10th September 2006, 17:37

Originally Posted by SwanTiger

I would've thought that BRONZ being the organisation they are would of jumped at the opportunity to support such an effort.

Yeah I got pinged on Thursday, however out dated laws and incompetent cow boy cops are two different things. You're welcome to come with me to Court, I'd apreciate the support.

I'll pledge my signature, however I don't have faith in a patition alone acheiving the desired result. So I'm keen to hear more about your ideas and goals.

I would love to approach them, however being a newbie, i wouldn't know where to start. my goal is simple, to present a petition to parliment to raise the current L plate speed limit, nothing more. i, and i'm sure most newbies, find the fact that we are moving targets at 70k a serious problem and this is the only way i know of to try and do something about it. if you have other oprions, i'd be more than happy to hear them.

**LilSel** · 10th September 2006, 17:51

Originally Posted by WarlockNZ

I would love to approach them, however being a newbie, i wouldn't know where to start. my goal is simple, to present a petition to parliment to raise the current L plate speed limit, nothing more. i, and i'm sure most newbies, find the fact that we are moving targets at 70k a serious problem and this is the only way i know of to try and do something about it. if you have other oprions, i'd be more than happy to hear them.

To get media attention how bout an impromtu 'boobs on bikes' event?? lol...
ya know... to support the cause... (70kph down the motorway??)...

Im in favour of a raise to the L plate limit, not abolishment of a limit and still to retain the L plates (same as with a car). Would be nice to see L plate car drivers limited to the same however (being that 80 or 90kph).

**WarlockNZ** · 10th September 2006, 17:54

Originally Posted by LilSel

To get media attention how bout an impromtu 'boobs on bikes' event?? lol...
ya know... to support the cause... (70kph down the motorway??)...

Im in favour of a raise to the L plate limit, not abolishment of a limit and still to retain the L plates (same as with a car). Would be nice to see L plate car drivers limited to the same however (being that 80 or 90kph).

are you offering ??? ... i'm sure the boys would be more than happy to take you pillion, if you didn't want to ride your own bike .. HA HA

**LilSel** · 10th September 2006, 17:58

Originally Posted by WarlockNZ

are you offering ??? ... i'm sure the boys would be more than happy to take you pillion, if you didn't want to ride your own bike .. HA HA

LOL!!!!!! Ill lead on mine!! hahaha

**Skyryder** · 10th September 2006, 19:09

Originally Posted by SwanTiger

I would've thought that BRONZ being the organisation they are would of jumped at the opportunity to support such an effort.

I would have thought so too but instead they (BRONZ) seem to go after the popular issues (e.g.buslanes for bikes) in that this is where they will gather most support. It is ia fallacy to believe that numbers will win on the day. Not when it comes to changing Government policy and their minions the LTNZ. Numbers only allow the media to take notice of an 'event.' The media can and should be used as a tool to achive your objectives but if you have had no training in dealing with them pay someone to do it for you. Winning costs.

Whenever I have gone into bat for someone I have always asked myself two questions.
1 Can I win?
2 Am I right?

If the answer is yes to both I will go for it.

On the speed limitation on a restricted licence the answer is yes to both questions

There are safety issues here and this is the way it should be argued for a change.
Secondly there is no speed restriction for learners with vehicles so the speed restriction for bikes is one of disparity in law.

An infringment in this area could be argued for but again it costs and the sad thing about the law is that who has the most money usually wins.

Skyryder

**The Big J** · 27th September 2006, 15:43

Warlock,

I think you should speak to the admins here, create a new thread (sticky) and separate your petition from the debate over law changes here. If you want support on the forum making an unequivocal statement of what you're doing will attract more people. Also getting the wording of what people are signing in bold at the top.

If you are serious about doing this you will need to have a strategy and commitment to follow this through maybe for 1-2 years. Alternatively you may be happy to publicise the issue and hope someone takes it from there. Be realistic that it's a long shot. You can change the law but you have to commit to doing work to do it.

I would suggest,
- you speak to your MP about gaining their support
- You look around for an advocacy group to ally yourself with. Ideally any citizen with signatures should be able to acheive change to legislation but the reality is a lobby group holds sway even if they just agree with you rather than lobby on your behalf.
- on this note I would try to canvas Transit, LTSA, AA for their possibly boneheaded opinions. Try the websites find out who the chief executive is and call them. At least you'll get a PA who can steer you to who deals with policy. Do NOT speak to anyone in a call centre. Those people are employed solely to frustrate and distract and stonewall callers so that people who make decisions can get on with their work.
- try to find any evidence of the (obvious in my opinion) danger of motorcyclists riding at 70km/h. If there are studies to show to LTSA to back you up you will get a better response than a standard 'interests of road safety' line

I am happy to sign your petition. Would be happy to support you further but am leaving the country. I'll discuss with people on the KB ride on Sunday. I am a bit hesitant to represent bikers when I've only been riding a bike 6 months and don't know hardly anyone else who rides a bike!

**The Pastor** · 27th September 2006, 15:50

this is pointless.

The law is just like the law that makes your wear a helmet on a bicycle. No cops will pull a L plater over for doing 100 in a 100 zone.

L plates are fine but again they only come back to bite you if you are being a dickhead without one on.

Waste of time fixing somthing that isnt broken. Spend your time getting those cheese cutters installed in the propper way and not on the outside of bends(or somthing else that is important).

**placidfemme** · 27th September 2006, 15:59

Originally Posted by renegade master

this is pointless.

Waste of time fixing somthing that isnt broken. Spend your time getting those cheese cutters installed in the propper way and not on the outside of bends(or somthing else that is important).

Agreed. I think the law on this is a pain in the ass, but it does help save lives for newbies... Look at the laws in the US, 16 year olds hooning around with little to no experience and training... thats why they are called "organ donors"

**The Pastor** · 27th September 2006, 16:06

Originally Posted by placidfemme

Agreed. I think the law on this is a pain in the ass, but it does help save lives for newbies... Look at the laws in the US, 16 year olds hooning around with little to no experience and training... thats why they are called "organ donors"

I'd go as far as to say its not a pain in the ass.

You have your learners for what? 6 months? 6 months of not getting pulled over for doing 100 in a 100 zone. BIG HASSLE.

Sure the law is wack and should be changed, but I don't see why we the taxpayers should PAY for them to debate it (I'd like to see how many people in parlament actually went through the graduated driver system + ride a bike) when infact the law isnt enforced anyways.

**TLDV8** · 27th September 2006, 16:16

Originally Posted by The Big J

- try to find any evidence of the (obvious in my opinion) danger of motorcyclists riding at 70km/h. If there are studies to show to LTSA to back you up you will get a better response than a standard 'interests of road safety' line

From Page 11

Originally Posted by TLDV8

The 70 kmh restriction was set when the open road speed limit was 80 kmh so is out of date for the modern limit of 100kmh...

For those not quite getting it since you may not have held a license or even been born then. In the 1980's the open road speed limit was 80 kmh,the restricted speed was set at 10 kmh less at 70 kmh for whatever reason.Fast forward over 20 years,the open road limit rises to 100 kmh with the restricted limit forgotten about ... Obviously if the LTSA is truely interested in safety they will do something about it quicktime.You don't need to be the sharpest tool in the shed to see the danger in a 30 kmh open road speed differential.

**The Big J** · 27th September 2006, 16:51

Yeah big questions about whether it's worth the hassle, agreed.
I personally ride at 100 and make sure I don't go over 110. No problems.

Obviously if the LTSA is truely interested in safety they will do something about it quicktime.You don't need to be the sharpest tool in the shed to see the danger in a 30 kmh open road speed differential.

I'm sure the LTSA has no shortage of tools

**WarlockNZ** · 27th September 2006, 17:53

The fact remains tho ... that if they want to .. the cops can pull you over for riding over 70K, It's all well and good to say that "no cop will pull you over for doing 100 in a 100 zone" .. but thats bull shit. If you display an L plate and you exceed 70K the police, can, will and have pulled people over, myself included.

Sure i got off with a warning, but thats not the point .. the point is that the Law is out of date with current road conditions and limits and should be changed.

now