Chris Carter and the environmental court

[miSTa]

Except for Toni doing the weather

Sorry, but I'd like Tony to be doing more than the weather

[Finn]

That's what you get with a centrist government

They only want you to think labour is a centrist government when in fact they lean far too much to the left. This stuff used to really piss me off. Now I just laugh at.

All this is doing is driving the message that you shouldn't try and do ANYTHING in this country as some needle dick homo or minority group will fuck it up for you. It's no wonder NZ's best have left the country.

[heavenly.talker]

They only want you to think labour is a centrist government when in fact they lean far too much to the left. This stuff used to really piss me off. Now I just laugh at.

All this is doing is driving the message that you shouldn't try and do ANYTHING in this country as some needle dick homo or minority group will fuck it up for you. It's no wonder NZ's best have left the country.

Finn I like your style...i'd send a green jewel your way but have given out too much in the last 24 yadi yadi yada.

[CLEAN CUT]

Hey guys can we keep his sexuality out of it...
What he has done has nothing to with his sexuality...


What I am interested in, is reading more stuff about the reason why he has done this and why the people are up in arms over it..
So can we stick to actual facts....

heavenly.talker - Thanks for your imput by starting the thread off...

I did watch some of it on Close up on TV1 at 7pm.

Yes, but he ( it ) also belongs to the ''band of liars'' If he was a school teacher he'd be getting his kicks going into the boys shower room. All the perverts congregrate mostly in the left wing parties.

[oldrider]

The government you voted for has spoken.

Good bye freedom, inch by inch we are loosing it.

Less government in our lives "PLEASE"! John.

[Timber020]

I have the misfortune of working alot with developers, most are scum that stretch every law until it gets to expensive to pay the fines. The guy who chainsawed the listed pohutukawa in auckland is typical of his trade.

A few years ago a developer got resource consent to put in 10 houses on a very large peice of land, including moving earth to make it suitable for puting the houses on. Instead the developer dug up the whole site (I believe it was for chalk or some mineral.)
Caused massive erosion, wrecked and silted up local streams, roads where wrecked by heavy earth moving machines, whole area became a dustbowl. No houses were put in, site was left as a bombsite. Developer just washed his hands of the whole thing, he hadnt broken any laws.

Yeah its such a pity we let new zealanders have a say in what happens to the nation around them. Since its such a problem, you should go to china where people get no say in what happens. Care for a river of poison running through your place?

[Velox]

Just a quick thought - talking about Chris Carter as the 'one-man force that undermines the whole resource consent / env court process' isn't quite right - it is a whole govt dpmnt behind him, he's just a their 'spokesman'. It's not like he hates wharfies and finally just thought 'ah stuff it, I'll show them'.

Btw - totally agree Timber.

[CLEAN CUT]

Just a quick thought - talking about Chris Carter as the 'one-man force that undermines the whole resource consent / env court process' isn't quite right - it is a whole govt dpmnt behind him, he's just a their 'spokesman'. It's not like he hates wharfies and finally just thought 'ah stuff it, I'll show them'.

Btw - totally agree Timber.

Chris Carter undoubtedly likes having men behind him, just like Elton. He should be burnt at the stake with all the other scumbags collectively known as the Labour party. Also known as the biggest jerks in history.

[SPman]

What a load of old shite, some people spout on here! Although I beleive in personal freedoms, with it, comes personal and community responsibility and unfortunately, when it comes to a LOT of developers, they lack it in droves.The recent case of the guy getting done for the tree - the guy is a manipulating arsehole who has a long history of doing this and then buying his way out of it.....agree with Timber on this.

Im not overly familiar with the Whangamata case, but, knowing several long term inhabitats of Whangamata - who are NOT surfies, lefties, tree huggers - your standard working class people, they were getting really pissed off with big money development fucking up the countryside and estuary for the benefit of wealthy outsiders, destroying many of the reasons most of them moved there in the first place. Turning every idylic spot, into a sanitised replica of what developers think people want - marinas and gated compounds, for more of their own and thinking the locals should be grateful for their"developments"

I dont agree with a minister interferring in the judicial process, but, it isnt the first time (its happened under National as well), and it wont be the last.........

[heavenly.talker]

I just read your sig. Its bloody funny!

thanks...I thought so!

[heavenly.talker]

The government you voted for has spoken.

Good bye freedom, inch by inch we are loosing it.

Less government in our lives "PLEASE"! John.

I didn't get the government I voted for

[HenryDorsetCase]

Ive had a think. Also had a look at scoop and re-read the stuff story. This isnt an area I practise in, so my opinion is that of a layman.

{now i start rantin... }

Heres the thing: I think Chris Carter just did what we pay him the big bucks to do.

It seems that the situation was that a developer wanted to put a "development" into this area. That persons motivation can only be profit. (Otherwise, why do it...?) Fine, the law allows for development and even provides a process. That process allows competing views to be heard. It appears that the resource consent process took place, and that the developer was successful in obtaining most of what they needed (presumably stuff like land use consents for excavation and drainage, stormwater management, yada yada.) The developer also needed separate consents from the Minister of Conservation to use part of the seabed that is owned by all NZ'ers. After (presumably) looking at the various options, the Minister, using the discretion afforded in the relevant legislation, made the call. And the call was "No". My personal view is that is probably a good thing. Think of all the flash fuckers driving their SUV's down there and over running the local pubs and eateries and driving the property prices up. soon you wouldnt be able to buy any beer at the bottlestore its all chardonnay and white shoes as far as the eye can see. Think Ponsonby luvvies with jaunty nautical caps .... shudder....

{I am ranting a bit, but hey, its the interweb, and its late.... }

So, in this circumstance I believe that the people of NZ, as represented by the Minister, made the call. I probably agree with him, but that isnt important.

it also doesnt look like a situation where due process, or the role of the Courts have in fact been usurped at all. And remember that the Ministers discretion might be open to judicial review.

Aspects of the process might not appeal to everyone, but it does seem as if the presently applicable process was followed.

Sure, lots of you dont agree with the outcome, Thats fine. You (and I) both get a chance to express our view in 2008.

I do know someone who works in the biggest most badass law firm in NZ, doing RM law. I might email him for the inside skinny (if its available...).

there ya go, thats my 2c

[Ixion]

I didn't get the government I voted for

Nor did I. Had I, such issues as Whangamata marinas would not be issues. Irrelevant in fact. Marina relies of capitalist developers exploiting the common estate for personal profit. My government, no developers. And if there were, no capitalist bourgeois to "buy" from them (ie disposses the proletariate of their common inheritance, the land).

All these solutions for just a few votes and the price of a case or two of bullets.

[oldrider]

All these solutions for just a few votes and the price of a case or two of bullets.

They had plenty of bullets in China and USSR but it still didn't work for them, even held together with a gun.

Freedom and enterprise seems to be winning but is that good? I'm still not sure!

The pendulum swings back and forth back and forth.:spudwhat: Who benefits? John.

[Finn]

I have the misfortune of working alot with developers, most are scum that stretch every law until it gets to expensive to pay the fines. The guy who chainsawed the listed pohutukawa in auckland is typical of his trade.

Developers are just playing the game and are trying to make a buck which of course you can't make money in NZ without upseting alot of the poor, non contributing people. Sure some of them are scum and the auck developer you're talking about has had a few run ins. However, I would tend to back him on this recent case. He owned that land and it was his pohutukawa tree. End of story. How about a compromise? Yeah sure cut it down but plant 10 or so trees somewhere else. He got fined $50k and some other shit. How about that fucking white maori that cut down the pohutukawa on One Tree Hill and got a slap on the wrist?

Sure we've got to have some balance but this is going over the top especially given the pohutukawa tree isn't even a native NZ tree.