"Cans" Vs Bikes

[RiderInBlack]

Just Shit Stirring Here, But was reading the NZ Motorcycle Trader which stated that the Production Superbikes were 5 seconds faster per lap than the V8 Touring Cars at the last meeting on Manfeild .

This got me to thinking if (like some on other forums claim) "cans" corner better than bikes and can go as fast as bikes, why are the bikes doing better time around our tracks?

Is this true for other tracks around the World?

PS: Could replies to this quote track times (on what track, including track distance) and class of vehicle (Formula Ford, V8, Superbike, 600cc Sports Production, etc.).

[pete376403]

You'd have to analyze each section of the track seperately, but I think it comes down to there are more straights than curves. There is no denying that bikes have far superior acceleration to cars - even V8 supercars, and even or better top speed. So the cars "average" speed around the track might not vary as much as the bikes, but the bike makes up the cornering speed difference a lot quicker, ie gets back up to speed sooner. Braking I'm not sure about, don't know if the cars can brake later and harder or not.
My theories anyway, based on the fact I have never ridden a really fast, late model bike on the race track (or the road, for that matter) !

[Motu]

It's been proved countless times before - a bike just can't match a car with 4 huge feet for braking,corner speed and exit,regardless of down force.Bikes will generaly pull more top end and may get there quicker,if down force comes into it the car pays a huge price,it takes HP to push that down force.The F1 cars can do much higher speeds than you see,but are so light they would have no corner speed with the wings taken off.

[Devil]

Just recently had the chance to fly around pukekohe in the passenger seat of my mates racecar (see attached, pre-signwriting). With slicks on, the harness isnt just in there for accidents! The brakes/grip/cornering is insane.
FYI, this car has bike rotors on it

This thing should be heading round pukekohe around 1.04s when its all sorted.

[merv]

[font=Comic Sans MS][size=3][color=blue]Just Shit Stirring Here, But was reading the NZ Motorcycle Trader which stated that the Production Superbikes were 5 seconds faster per lap than the V8 Touring Cars at the last meeting on Manfeild

Don't know the numbers but V8s at Manfeild are only the NZ version and are fairly low spec versus the Aussie V8s that are about to hit Pukekohe.

At the highest levels of the sport whether we like it or not cars are generally quicker e.g. F1 versus MotoGp.

[Wenier]

You might find that the V8 Supercars are slower because they are quite large (whale like if you will) and lose traction out of corners easily, whereas if it was say the GT3 or GT2 porchse or a Ferria the bike could easily get done over.

[Skunk]

Don't know the numbers but V8s at Manfeild are only the NZ version and are fairly low spec versus the Aussie V8s that are about to hit Pukekohe.

At the highest levels of the sport whether we like it or not cars are generally quicker e.g. F1 versus MotoGp.

One of the F1 drivers (forget who) was watching the MotoGP in Italy and said that the bikes were much quicker between corners. Overall lap times were about the same but the F1 cars had 30+ kph on the straights.

Also said the bikes were more interesting to watch...

[Coldkiwi]

yeah, its an interesting topic. You're right about the top speeds because the ducati GP bike was only 1mph off the fastest F1 cars top speed at Catalunya a few months ago during a test.

a balanced/lightened car should brake quicker than a bike too.
so all in all, if you're racing a car, make sure you get to the braking zone well ahead and hog any form of line thats available before buggering off to the next corner

[RiderInBlack]

This thing should be heading round pukekohe around 1.04s when its all sorted.

Big deal, Ray Clees does Puke in 57 sec

[RiderInBlack]

if it was say the GT3 or GT2 porchse or a Ferria the bike could easily get done over.

OK, but have you got stats on that? I like some facts here not just talk. Porchse race on our tracks. There has to be some times. Formula Fords will beat a Porchse around our tracks (have seen a demo). What are their track times?

[RiderInBlack]

Formula 1 are built only to race. They are not production vehicle. Would have to compare them to something simalar in bikes (a Britten for example).

[Two Smoker]

I saw this car on the 17th???? of march doing testing at puke, looked fast, wasnt pushing it hard though, fucking loud as....... With Puke hasnt Stroud broken into the 56's?????

[Motu]

Formula 1 are built only to race. They are not production vehicle. Would have to compare them to something simalar in bikes (a Britten for example).

Isn't F1 and MotoGP close enough for you? As Merv and I have pointed out cars just cream the bikes,it comes down to how many wheels,simple as that.They reckon the MotoGP bikes are capable of putting out 300hp,but they would be unridable.How about drag racing? no corners,downforce or any of that crap - just go for it for a few hundred metres....uh uh,cars again.

Lets just be satisfied that the bikes can get to the corners faster.

[RiderInBlack]

Ok Motu. But drag racers are no good around the track. My queiry was if "cans" are better at cornering and can go faster, why are bikes doing better track times?

Do you know track times for F1, V8, etc vs GP, Superbikes, etc?

By the way, do not the GP in MotoGP stand for General Production?
F1 is not General Production.

[Motu]

This subject has been discused on every board around the world.

http://forums.atlasf1.com/showthread...threadid=67674

MotoGP is a new formula,the GP stands for Grand Prix I would think.It's very hard to compare cars and bikes from different formulas,but F1 and MotoGP are the pinacle of 4 and 2 wheel.I mentioned on another thread how they tested a WSB Ducati and Wayne Gardners Commodore on 6 Aussie tracks and got a 50/50 split,the bike faster on the high speed tracks,the car faster on the tight tracks.