Auckland Road Tax - Lets Do Something About It!

[Squeak the Rat]

Hi all,

Apologies if this has been done to death. It has been discussed on a separate thread under the Off Topic section http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/sh...highlight=toll, but I think it needs to be highlighted again to encourage every one to make a submission to at least get them to consider bikers.

If case you've been living in a cave, there is a proposal to charge motorists $6 to travel into / out of / around the city. This is bad news because:

• it's going to cost a packet and we've paid enough in tax to have this sorted already
• It's setting a precedent for other cities
• It'll stuff Aucklands economy
• Public transport is not up to the required standard to facilitate this
• Aucklanders will start moving to Wellington, Christchurch, Dunedin etc ( PAY ATTENTION NON-AUCKLANDERS!)
• And importantly, there is no exemption or discount for bikes!

I know most of us are cynical about changing what gets done to us in this country, but we have an opportunity to voice our opinions. Sure we might not get listened to, but it's better to speak up now than to complain once it's implemented. Personally I can't see this happening - more likely it's designed to get people used to the idea that something needs to be done, so that we accept the next "softer" option. But damned if I'm going to do nothing and then get surprised with it. At the very least get them to think about bikes in other options.

I have filled in the submission on the transport website - it's fairly simple, but you do need to give them your name etc. I won't put my answers here, but I made the point that it's a bad idea, and that bikes contribute significantly less to congestion so should not be treated the same as cars (in fact they should be encouraged). If we can get a lot of people to do this then there might be a chance of being considered as a group on this or whatever future plans they can come up with. Please do the same and get as many people as you can to follow suit.

The website with all the information and the submission links is http://www.transport.govt.nz/business/land/arpes/

The email address is:
arpes@transport.govt.nz

Cheers
SRT

[madboy]

So you're saying that if you Aucklanders get taxed directly, less subsidies will be paid by the rest of the country, and possibly some of you guys might have to move down here which will put increased pressure on housing prices making the values go up even further? OMG - this is terrible for a home owner who bought a few years ago and isn't planning on moving anytime soon like me!

I'm gonna be crying all the way down to the bank to buy those three investment properties I've been talking about for a year or two now...

Seriously, though, I don't know if direct taxation like this is appropriate given that the alternative options are so limited in Auckland. I fully support it in London where there is an efficient public transport system operating between bombings. But in Auckland? I hate visiting the place, I can only imagine your pain in living in that traffic.

I think your suggestion that this is a softening action rather than a serious option is likely the correct assessment. What is the next option? You don't seriously think they're gonna now invest the billions needed into an efficient public transportation system? There's more voters that need benefits than need trains.

[WickedOne]

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/section/st...ectID=10374961

[Hitcher]

Speaking as a resident from the Country Outside Auckland, who already contributes to Auckland roading costs via special fuel taxes:

"Stop moaning, pay the fucking tax or go and live somewhere else."

[ManDownUnder]

Speaking as a resident from the Country Outside Auckland, who already contributes to Auckland roading costs via special fuel taxes:

"Stop moaning, pay the fucking tax or go and live somewhere else."

I'm trying to read between the lines on that one - not gettin' any clues... what you on about Hitch? :spudwhat:

Actually - as one who lives here and will be affected - I agree.

[Albino]

Speaking as a resident from the Country Outside Auckland, who already contributes to Auckland roading costs via special fuel taxes:

"Stop moaning, pay the fucking tax or go and live somewhere else."

Fair enough on the user pays aspect, but are you saying that you agree with bikes being taxed the same as cars??? Bizarre.....

[Momentum]

putting user pays on old roads stinks. But I am all for them putting a user pay system in for new roads. They should look at the ezypay set up they have in the sates too, speeds things up alot. If you have an ezypay unit in your car you dont have to wait in the huge cues. All you have to do is slow to 15mph and a scanner picks it up and sends the bill to you mastercard.

I am sick of paying for dorklanders roading myself. I pay enough tax as it is

[Blackbird]

I guess that a reduction in the tax for a 2 wheeled - vehicle would send a good message but that assumes that city councillors are imbued with common sense.

Personally, I think Auckland residents are sufficiently punished by actually having to live there

[Lou Girardin]

"Stop moaning, pay the fucking tax or go and live somewhere else."

You mean take a 50% pay cut, live in a grass hut and shag our sisters. Like the rest of Appalachian NZ.
We pay good money for the right to whinge.

[ManDownUnder]

Fair enough on the user pays aspect, but are you saying that you agree with bikes being taxed the same as cars??? Bizarre.....

I have no problem with bikes being taxes on a pro rata basis with cars.

I.e. if the average car has one person in it, and the average bike has 1 person on it - any costs accrued by that person being in town will be the same - charge the same.

Carparking's a fun one though. I can easily get 3 (big) bikes into my carpark here at work. So I should be charged 1/3 of the cost of the carpark (or 1/2 if I chose to only have 2 bikes - or the full whack if I keep it all to myself)

Likewise fuel, carbon emissions, road damage etc etc etc.
MDU

[sAsLEX]

Speaking as a resident from the Country Outside Auckland, who already contributes to Auckland roading costs via special fuel taxes:

"Stop moaning, pay the fucking tax or go and live somewhere else."

Look at the places that have implemented a tax similar to this, IE the congestion charges to get in to London, Do bikes pay over there? No they dont as they dont contribute to congestion, but here they do as this is not to reduce congestion as was stated but to earn tax to feed our social welfare dept.

[Ixion]

Speaking as a resident from the Country Outside Auckland, who already contributes to Auckland roading costs via special fuel taxes:

"Stop moaning, pay the fucking tax or go and live somewhere else."

Uh, no you don't. Or, at any rate, Auckland contributes more to yours than you contribute to Auckland's.

Even with the latest changes, Auckland receives back much less of the "take" than it contributes.

It's just that for years Auckland contributed heaps and received back bugger all. It mostly went to the South Island. Most of the roads in the South Island would not exist at all, even as clay tracks, if the take was divvyed up according to contributions.

Auckland subsidises the rest of the country , always has, always will, just not quite as much as in the past.

[BM-GS]

It looks like this is being gone over in a couple of places in here, but some points nobody's mentioned yet:

If it happens in Auckland, it'll spread to other areas. Inventing a new tax and making it stick is the hard part. Making it apply to more people is really easy, as it making it go up & down, to suit the applicable politician. Anyone who thinks congestion can't be invented by re-phasing traffic lights has been asleep for a long time... or not lane-splitting enough.

So, who lives in Hamiton, Wellington or Christchurch and want tolling there?

Apart from the JAFAs moving out to other parts and nicking your jobs, where does most of the money come from in NZ? If people here start leaving (and there are a lot moving overseas, Muldoon's approval or not) then there could be less money to go round.

Sorry for the funny approach to this, but I like it here, for now.

[sAsLEX]

I have no problem with bikes being taxes on a pro rata basis with cars.

I.e. if the average car has one person in it, and the average bike has 1 person on it - any costs accrued by that person being in town will be the same - charge the same.

Carparking's a fun one though. I can easily get 3 (big) bikes into my carpark here at work. So I should be charged 1/3 of the cost of the carpark (or 1/2 if I chose to only have 2 bikes - or the full whack if I keep it all to myself)

Likewise fuel, carbon emissions, road damage etc etc etc.
MDU

I can get along the MW legally, when all three lanes are grid locked, How do I add to congestion which is what this charge is trying to tackle?? If the average car has 20 % occupancy they are wasting 80% of resources that could be used to reduce congestion, if a bike is 50% occupied then it is wasting 30% less.
Bikes do less road damage, use less fuel than driving your car therefor less carbon.

[The Stranger:Me]

Speaking as a resident from the Country Outside Auckland, who already contributes to Auckland roading costs via special fuel taxes:

Always has to be one doesn't there.

Wake up and stop smelling the fumes.

Until recently spending on roading in Auckland has lagged the rest of the country, despite Auckland having the largest population base and contributing the most toward petrol levies and taxes.

Get over it.