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Thread: Private vs public schooling?

  1. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim2
    Yes, "forcing" Maori culture is appropriate in NZ. Spend at least a year overseas and you'll be shocked at how much Maori culture is an integral part of your daily life in NZ.

    It should be compulsory, it shouldn't be onerous. I haven't seen an argument that isn't couched in fearful terms. You'll lose nothing. You won't change sexuality. You'll gain a set of tools that allow you to learn another language, and another, and another. My Norwegian Sister-in-law is conversationally fluent in 3 Germanic languages and two romance languages, because it was compulsory during her schooling, and valid for the territory in which she lived. European languages have no immediate worth for Kiwis. Maori is an Asia-Pacific language and has more in common with SE-Asian languages. Surely that's an important building block in learning the regional languages of the region we live in?

    I'm disgusted that young Kiwis are still ashamed of the cultural make up of NZ and see no Irony in continuing the bigoted practices of a Colonial power that collapsed in a heap in 1947.

    So who has the greater content of Maori? Private or Public schools?
    Thanks Jim, I haven't laughed so hard in a long time. I liked the one about being shocked at how much Maori culture is an integral part of your daily life in NZ.

    Brilliant stuff mate. You almost had me.

  2. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by Finn
    So what's your excuse for chopping wood for a living?

    No excuse, I happen to love my job. Wouldnt do anything else. I get to use alot of the skills I got from my university qualification (not tree related, I went to management school). I get to do something that is scary, hard, dangerous, challenging and different every day. I do something that most people wouldnt have the balls to do and I get to work with something as beautiful as trees. Which I spend more time saving than felling. Im my own boss and make alot of people very happy with the work I do. And by Christ I have fun doing it.

    I went to the same primary and high school as whetu tehiko, the guy who killed the teacher in toke. I knew him since he was preschool, and all his brothers (who I fought with), sisters and a few cousins and uncles to boot. Same teachers, same school. Much different results.

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    I, for one, want no part of Maori culture.
    If that culture didn't feature aggressive war dances as 'welcomes', throat sliiting as a sporting challenge, the demeaning of women, and disproportionally featuring in all the negative crime and health statistics in NZ, I may feel differently.
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  4. #109
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    Ko te reo te taikura o te whakaao maarama.

    That being said I dont think maori should be compulsory, and I work for a maori institute and am currently learning te reo.
    .

  5. #110
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    I didn't learn any languages at school, in fact I learnt bugger all at school and left at age 15.
    At age 40, living in Switzerland, I bacame very interested in German and learnt a bit though not fluent I can pick up on a conversation and read a little. A year or 2 later I was living in Indonesia, as the only foreigner working for that company and being away from my family who were in Australia, I became completely immersed in their language learning it well. I learnt it colloqually with a lot of encouragement from my Indonesian colleagues. After 6 months or so the only time I spoke english was when phoning home and even now, for some reason, I still often see or think numbers in Indonesian for which I had origionally struggled with.
    A later contract in Tonga proved that the base of their (Austronesian) language has come from the west, arrived with the wind one could say, and now listening to Maori language on TV I pick up on a bit and am sure that I could learn it if I put my head to it. I fully intend to learn Te Reo at some stage. The Indonesians can understand the words of the Haka (the old one) when they see it on TV. learning another language is not all about comercial value as I often hear people imply. It is about gathering or improving ones own intelligence and internal worth. Its a personal challenge that opens a part ones mind that has remained closed or unstimulated by "practices of colonial power" and a one eyed view of what we really are or should be as NZers. Lias, as our resident Nationalist, welcome to another language, a New Zealand language. Bling to you..
    Last edited by terbang; 10th August 2006 at 12:07.
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  6. #111
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    The issue though, is not whether learning maori (or any other language) is a Good Thing or not, but whether it should be compulsory.

    I'm against all compulsion, unless overwhelming need can be shown. I don't see any reason why necessity , either of state or of the individual, should be invoked in this case to override the basic right of people deciding for themselves.

    Compulsion is always bad, though sometimes necessary because the alternative is worse. In this case the alternative (letting people do it if they want to) is not worse.
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  7. #112
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    Ixion I agree there.
    Our worth has always been judged by how well we did at school and lets face it if you arn't any good at the compulsorys of maths or say English then the chances of being seen as uneducated and dumped on the scrap heap are high. Our brains all develop differently and some of us are more disposed towards the arts than those of the compusory English and maths. Thankfully things are changing and I noticed that when In Australia my daughter could drop maths in favour of music. Think how many people in the past, perhaps artistic people, who have been cast onto the scrap heap because they couldn't grade high enough in the compulsory subjects when at school.
    Whilst I support the Idea of Maori language being taught in NZ schools, I dont think that it should be compulsory.
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  8. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim2
    Why? What threatens you about bi-lingual kids? It's the NORM in most civilised countries (except the UK). Languages are desperately important in brain development, and ongoing social attitudes....
    Hear, hear. My outlaws are Dutch, so my girls are learning that when they stay with them (and now I can swear a little in Dutch, so it's a learning experience for me). Likewise, they get taught a little Maori at daycare, so I'm starting to swallow my pride and go with the flow there, taking up the Maori learning with them in their home education.

    Conversely, I refuse to stand up when our anthem plays until they start the English verse. That was the result of one reactionary woman who wanted to make a political statement, and damned if I'm going to act like an idiot mouthing something I don't know. Why the hell should we be the only country in the world who needs subtitles for their own anthem anyway?

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  9. #114
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ixion
    I don't see any reason why necessity, either of state or of the individual, should be invoked in this case to override the basic right of people deciding for themselves.
    Ahh see, there's a little bit of Capitalism in all of us.

  10. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by cowpoos
    ...and montessori schooling is brillent for learning impared children...I don't think there is anything in place in NZ that can match it....
    Now heres something a bit weird. We had an interview with Corran School about getting the girls in there and mentioned we were looking at sending them to Montesori in Mt Eden. The reaction we got was slightly negative in that anecdotal evidence pointed towards the fact that Montesori kids were taught to do activites as a group and when they got to another shcool, they had trouble adjusting to a more individual mode of learning. Too much hand-holding?
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  11. #116
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    It's interesting that NZ'ers always rant on about Maori culture. Could someone please explain to me what this is exactly? And not a guilty white mans interpretation. The truth please.

  12. #117
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    what the fuck is montessori?

    I thought they made trials bikes?

  13. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by Finn
    It's interesting that NZ'ers always rant on about Maori culture. Could someone please explain to me what this is exactly? And not a guilty white mans interpretation. The truth please.
    Apparently it's being able to discharge firearms in public places, make wild claims of natural resources that couldn't have been exploited in millions of years if caucasians hadn't arrived (like broadcasting frequencies) and being able to put on the bash if eggs aren't arriving forthwith.
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  14. #119
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  15. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ixion
    The issue though, is not whether learning maori (or any other language) is a Good Thing or not, but whether it should be compulsory.

    I'm against all compulsion, unless overwhelming need can be shown. I don't see any reason why necessity , either of state or of the individual, should be invoked in this case to override the basic right of people deciding for themselves.

    Compulsion is always bad, though sometimes necessary because the alternative is worse. In this case the alternative (letting people do it if they want to) is not worse.
    Just to stir th9ings up a little, is the compulsion to drive on the left hand side of the road a bad thing?
    Or the compulsion to wear seat belts in cars and helmets on bikes?
    Or the compulsion to attend school?

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