Bloody yanks

[Drunken Monkey]

How fast you ride the bike can affect things, too.

LOL - niceone. ;P

[Two Smoker]

I think its great having a 250 or under restriction..... Its all up to the common sense of the rider what bike to get...... For instance im glad i got my RG150, and im still glad that even though im no where near full licence stage (although my riding ability says otherwise) i can still get a RGV/NSR/TZR and still be legal even though i will have 400cc performance......

I think i would most likely be dead if i had jumped on a 600........ but who knows..... i havnt riden anything bigger than a 150 (ive ridden only like 3 or 4 bikes )

[jrandom]

the weird attitudes some of them have, often combined with questionable intelligence.

Ah, yes. The 'questionable intelligence' thing. Seems to happen a lot with them merkin folk.

And the marine sniper dude came across in most postings as being sorta OK, but when he was talking about shooting people, and alluding to some of the assignments he'd had, he came across as a cold-blooded killer, lacking in compassion and some of the more admirable human attributes.

Hmmmph. "I shot a man in Reno, just to watch him die." There's that whole 'bravado' issue. In real life, if you ran into him when he didn't have a gun and you wanted a fight, he'd probably piss himself and run away, or have a little mental-instability moment, freeze up and start dribbling through the corner of his mouth. I tend to define that behaviour as 'cowardly', particularly when it's paired with a readiness to use guns in offense. Probably a good chance he was just full of shit, anyway.

At least he appreciated the VFR for the fine all-round bike it is. Like Merv.
A Top Bloke is Merv.

You guys should get together and share fluffy-slipper recommendations.

[Posh Tourer :P]

some of those 500cc European super scooters are quite sedate rides = why shouldn't a learner be allowed to ride one? All of you tall buggers know how difficult it is to find a comfortable <250cc bike...

MZ ETZ250 isnt that bad. Nice and tall, maybe not quite enough power though?

[Motoracer]

Was your mate's Aprilla RS250 more forgiving than say, a GS500 would be? Gotta compare apples with apples - not everyone is going to ride a sportbike. A mistake a lot of us sportbike riders make (myself included) is generalise that as the cc's increase, so must the speed of the bike -an assumption that the rider in question is riding a sporty - they may not be. Tourers of the same cc as a sport bike are not going to be as fast (cf a 70hp 1500cc harley vs a 140hp 750cc gixxer: double the power in half the cc).
Geometry effects twitchiness, not engine size. In a strict sense, a bigger engine will have more mass, thus more inertia and tend to not want to wobble about. Sportbikes wobble because of their extreme geometry - front wheel pulled back on a sharp angle, short wheelbase, etc....

Ok, I must say, its my fault for not mentioning it before but I was talking about sportsbikes only. The yank site I was talking about only has sportsbike riders in it.

Having a greater inertia may give you stability but when you over cook a corner in something big and heavy, it can't be corrected too easily. Think about steering a small boat in comparison to a big ship. You can steer away from danger in a small boat easily but in a big ship, it takes greater time and distance to make a similar turn. It is harder for some thing with a greater momentum to change direction. Even if the velocities might be the same, greater mass will give the two different bikes two different momentums. I am pointing out that, newbies on big bikes are more at risk of overshooting due to understerring on a bigger heavier bike than a small nimble little 250. I am talking about corner entry only here so power doesn't even come into it yet.

If you wana talk about power then yes, thats another danger aspect. The last thing on earth you want when you are learning is the ability to loose traction simply because of the incredible amount of power on the mordern sports bikes. A simple slip of the hand is all it takes for it to go from the good to bad.

If you 'reckon', then it is an opinion. However, in general, I, and most people with common sense, would agree with that statement.
Type of bike is still a big factor. The biggest factor of all is still how much you twist your wrist.

It WAS my opinion. I was just saying that I thought it also happend to be a fact.

[Big Dog]

[Edit: genuine question that just crossed my mind. Why is it 'scary' for people to be 'into guns'? I've never met anyone like that who would be a threat to society. It's members of the criminal class getting their hands on firearms that I find worrying, and the criminal mindset does not seem to coincide very often with the 'enthusiast' type that enjoy target shooting and hunting (and who sometimes feel that the use of weapons in self-defense is morally justifiable)]

Interesting that I find your edit more interesting than your post but here goes.

I don't own a gun because I have never had enough experience of them to know how to go about it.

I have enjoyed what experience I have had of them.

I have sic'ed a dog on an intruder before.

I would feel little or no remorse in slitting the throat of some one who threatened someone else who could not defend themself.

I think I would have an issue over murder for self preservation or just to protect property.

I would however have no compunction over putting a thief / intruder /rapist that I caught in the act in a wheelchair or coma.

[Big Dog]

I personally have no problem with either system.
For CC restriction. The fact that I was sensible in my aproach to learning is probably why I'm here to tell the tale, not being the most co-ordinated guy and all.

When I go to license my children I won't have to fear them buying a R1 GSXR1000 etc.



The argument against cc restriction.
The fact that I was sensible in my aproach to learning is probably why I'm here to tell the tale, not being the most co-ordinated guy and all. being a sensible dude I would not have got straight on a performance bike anyway.

All but one of my accidents would have been less probable on a bigger bike (Due to my size).

Different people develope at different rates I could handle a 1000cc long before my learners was done with because I rode every day, and in that first year I covered 40,000 kms. some people have only done their tests on the 250 or less then never ridden again until their full came through.

There would be no more ignorant wanker bikers left in NZ as on our roads they would all be dead or scared silly before their license came through. Learner + R1 = natural selection.

[k14]

I read this on a forum a few weeks ago:

This actually turns out to be kinda sad...yet its funny, saw it over @ Quake 3 World, it is from a site with a review of the Suzuki GSXR 1000....

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Post 1
--------

"
Bike: Suzuki GSXR 1000
Name: Zuby
Year Of Bike: 2001
Miles: 2100
Rating: 10
Mods
List the modifications on this bike stock, excpet full Yosh exhaust

Carberation
Amazing, I only weigh 150 and I cannot possibly floor the Girl in anything but third gear and still I cant keep the front end own all the time. Have brought the ah ah ah ........... up to 190 kph in second gear!!!! Love it more than my Girl

Brakes
Brakes are great but squeeling in the rear is annoying. Stoppies took a while to learn but now I can do them at 80kph. and I've only been riding for 6 months. This is my first bike!!

Handling
Great. Turns, stops, boots like a god, I cant get over it. Everytime I bring it home I want to take it out again.

Comments
Firstly this is my first bike I have owned and so although I cant compare it I know it is amazing compared to others. I have only been riding for 6 moths and the power is very managable. All those fags out there who say its not a begginners bike cna fu** off. They just dont want the bike to become as common as an F4i. For all the beginners out there, don't settle for anythign but the best. If you are willing to spend enough for the bike, dont be chaep. spend the extra 1 or 2 g's and buy this machine. It is too good to be true, and any of you fags out there that dont believe me email me at zuby_95@hotmail.com and I will drive out to wherever you are and show you that a novice can be the sh*t out of anyone out there. Mind you I weigh 150 pounds, but that doesnt matter, I will accelerate, turn and stop better than any of you boys out there . Email me though if you have any questions about anyhting though, it would make me happy. LAtes P.S The girls will follow you around for a ride, and you will be the happiest person in the world."

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Post 2
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"
Bike: Suzuki GSXR 1000
Name: Kevin
Year Of Bike: 2002
Miles: 12
Rating: 1
Mods

Carberation

Brakes

Handling

Comments
I am sorry to announce but as you may have read, Zuby has died in a motorcycle accident off the 401 in Toronto. He was racing and crashed at an estimated 310 km/h. Please ride carefully, and wear protective clothing at ALL times.It could save your life."

Dunno if it is true or not, but shows a point of why GSXR1000's are the best bike for learners to learn on.

[Two Smoker]

I read this on a forum a few weeks ago:



Dunno if it is true or not, but shows a point of why GSXR1000's are the best bike for learners to learn on.

Well it is natural selection and his attitude sucked.....

[RiderInBlack]

Another factor is the obvious weight difference. When you are on a 250 or less cc bike, less mass means less forces (not as in less number of forces but less amount in Newton of each force) working against you when things go wrong.

Spot On MR In My Opinion (and I own it as mine), I feel the the weight difference is a major contributing factor. The effect of an increase weight from changing from the VFR750 to the CBR1000 has been the most difficult for me to adjust for. The power differience has not been that difficult for me to adjust for. I would not like to contemplated what would have happen to me if I had tried to go straight from the GSXR250 to the CBR1000. The combination of the power and the weight differience would have been deadly. Starting on the CBR1000, your kidding (see the tread titled "How To Kill Your Wife"). The GSXR250 save my learner's arse on many occasion just by being lighter (I'll bore you with a few stories some other day)

Oh and Jrandom, I liked my fluffy-slipper. It would have kicked your little FXR's arse (come to think about in so would have the GSXR250) So I took your bait, but you'll end up in the water
"If you are fishing for snapper, be prepaired to catch the odd shark" RIB

[Skyryder]

Spot on Motoracer. I've been riding most of my life but before the Guzzi I was riding 175's 250' etc. My first bike was a 500 but that was when I was in my late teens. In effect I came from a 250 straight up to a 1100 and it was the weight: my Guzzi weighs 257.0 kg's that was the hardest to get used too. Enter too fast and the weight of the bike will carry you over the centre line and into deadman territory. And although I do not like to admit it this has happened a couple of times. Not recently as I now approach corners with a little more respect.

Unexpected throttle twist??
Some time ago a girl was killed in one of the carparkes here in Chch. Am not privy to all the details but this lass was an experianced rider. I recall that she was taking the bike home becasue the owner got to drunk to ride. From what I remember she hit a brick wall. Have heard the odd story that as she released the clutch it slipped throwing her back which in turn caused an uncontrollable throttle accealeration as she was thrown back by the clutch grab. Big bikes can be dangerous for the unwary.

Skyryder

[merv]

You guys should get together and share fluffy-slipper recommendations.

Thanks for the vote of confidence guys, you must be top blokes yourselves. I guess that's why people call me a hothouse flower and I don't do rallies and tents and stuff. Nice warm bed that's me. Wife agrees but she doesn't like it quite as warm as me - individual controls on the electric blanket sees to that though.

Anway what's this got to do with Yanks?

You've heard me say before I have been to USA a bit and did time at Michigan University in Ann Arbor, and I can assure you that on average the Yanks I met do not have the good old all round balance that Kiwis have, so they come across as rather dumb. Top executives not capable of driving a simple calculator for example let alone a PC because that's their secretaries job to do that.

Also the guns thing is scary - I used to chat a bit to people on Motorcycle Online and a few were armed forces guys - and there attitudes were amazing, I would not trust meeting them in the wrong circumstances. No different than some of the good old boys I've met out in the sticks there, they behave just like the kinda cops that John Rambo had to deal with in the movies - pig ignorant.

The racial prejudices were embarrassing to me too - listening to anyone South of Washington DC talking about the blacks. Damn down South of the Mason Dickson line I spent time in Georgia, Alabama and Florida and the way the whites talked still 30 years after the riots was scary. Went to a bar and the band was called "Dave Calhoun and the Trashy White band" and they sung anti black songs FFS.

Kiwis definitely have that edge because of the self help kind of lives we have to lead.

As for slippers I've got the Hugh Hefner kind of plain looking ones but no silk pyjamas - is that VFR enough? and I don't smoke, never have, never will.

[Motu]

You guys are talking about unlimited bikes for learners as if it's an irresponsible act for our leaders to let happen - but that's how it was when I learnt to ride,I could have ridden anything I wanted,no questions asked.

But young guys couldn't afford big bikes so we started out small and worked our way up,learning as we went,by ourselves,not having our hand held all the way.At 16 I got my first big bike,a 1950 BSA B31,that's a 350 single weighing nearly 200kg - I couldn't start it and after I stalled ended up pushing it most of the way home.When my older brother wanted to get a bike we went out looking and I picked him out a nice Triumph T110 with a full Bonny upgrade that had been raced at Puke - this was his first bike.He's still alive and kicking in Canada and rides a Suzuki Turbo.

I guess it all changed when the superbikes appeared along with rich daddies,kids were getting over their heads and we got the learner system.I like the learner system and think it's a good thing,but it was fun being able to ride what you liked,even if you never did.

[Big Dog]

I guess it all changed when the superbikes appeared along with rich daddies,kids were getting over their heads and we got the learner system.I like the learner system and think it's a good thing,but it was fun being able to ride what you liked,even if you never did.

You also seem to be talking about a time when 80 bhp was phenomenal performance, much the same way we view a 184ps Zx10

I remember in the late seventies hearing people talk with pride about their 60bhp bikes.

[bgd]

Unexpected throttle twist??
Some time ago a girl was killed in one of the carparkes here in Chch. Am not privy to all the details but this lass was an experianced rider. I recall that she was taking the bike home becasue the owner got to drunk to ride. From what I remember she hit a brick wall. Have heard the odd story that as she released the clutch it slipped throwing her back which in turn caused an uncontrollable throttle accealeration as she was thrown back by the clutch grab. Big bikes can be dangerous for the unwary.

Skyryder

I remember this one. Assuming we're talking the same case the girl rode old British bikes. The coroners comment was something to the effect that her lack of experience on modern sports bikes was a contributing factor to the accident.


When I did my training (in the UK) I did the direct access course which, on completion, allows you to ride any bike. Day 1 (CBT) was on a CG125 (this was the first time I had ever ridden) and then days 2-4 were on a CB500. I found the 500 much easier than the 125. The handling, quality and power just seemed the make the whole package so much easier.

To do the direct access course you have be 21 or over otherwise you are restricted by power (not cc) for 2 years. You can buy and ride any bike but if you don't have a full licence then the machine must be restricted. That's probably why I haven't heard of many of the 250 bikes that seem to be popular in NZ.

The direct access course was good for me but I bought a sensible bike. I could have bought an R1 but I'm sure I wouldn't have enjoyed the riding experience.