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Thread: Speeding and Prostiution

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celtic_Sea_lily
    What the Justice system is supposed to do and what is does are 2 conflicting things I think.
    Partly b/c the people within the "system" are human and partly b/c they're mostly white middle class, middle aged men! I'm talking about the judiciary here, the guys that interpret the law.
    And the Chief Justice of New Zealand is a...?
    And the Prime Minister of New Zealand is a...?
    And the Governor General of New Zealand is a...?
    And the constitutional monarch of New Zealand is a...?

    This argument is a bit like saying that if women were in charge, that there would be no wars... The riposte to which is: Golda Meir, Indira Ghandi, Margaret Thatcher, Helen Clark...
    "Standing on your mother's corpse you told me that you'd wait forever." [Bryan Adams: Summer of 69]

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hitcher
    And the Chief Justice of New Zealand is a...?
    And the Prime Minister of New Zealand is a...?
    And the Governor General of New Zealand is a...?
    And the constitutional monarch of New Zealand is a...?

    This argument is a bit like saying that if women were in charge, that there would be no wars... The riposte to which is: Golda Meir, Indira Ghandi, Margaret Thatcher, Helen Clark...
    Nancy Reagan, Hilary Clinton. They weren't elected you say? Neither was George Bush and it hasn't stopped him.
    If a man is alone in the woods and there isn't a woke Hollywood around to call him racist, is he still white?



  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hitcher
    No, that's not quite right. Under the current law, if you are 15 and your girlfriend is 14, you are able to root each other senseless until you turn 16. At this juncture you then have to cease and desist from senselessly shagging the aforementioned object of your desire, until such stage as she turns 16. Do not pass "Go", go directly to jail.
    Aha! Not quite.

    Crimes Act 1961 (as amended), part 7 s134:

    "(1) Every one is liable to imprisonment for a term not exceeding 7 years who has or attempts to have sexual intercourse with any girl of or over the age of 12 years and under the age of 16 years, not being his wife."

    Right. So, starting position is, shag a chick under 16 and you're buggered. Figuratively speaking.

    Now, the section continues:

    "(3) It is a defence to a charge under this section if the person charged proves that the girl consented and that he is younger than the girl:"

    So, if she's between 12 and 15, but you're younger, shag away, baby!

    "Provided that proof of the said facts shall not be a defence if it is proved that such consent was obtained by a false and fraudulent representation as to the nature and quality of the act."

    ... but not if she only did it because you told her you wanted to play Doctors and Nurses.

    "(4) It is a defence to a charge under this section if the person charged proves that the girl consented, that he was under the age of 21 years at the time of the commission of the act, and that he had reasonable cause to believe, and did believe, that the girl was of or over the age of 16 years"

    And it might also be OK if you're under 21, and she had these ENORMOUS, you know... tracts of land, right, and she can hold two dozen Lion Reds without falling down, and... and... well, your Honour, let's face it - do YOU think she looks under 16?

    "(7) No one shall be prosecuted for any offence against this section, except under paragraph (a) of subsection (2) thereof, unless the prosecution is commenced within 12 months from the time when the offence was committed."

    Well, just look at you, you pimply little git. She wasn't exactly going to BRAG about it to everyone the NEXT DAY, now, was she?
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  4. #19
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    Well I hate spin doctoring 'wordplay', political correctness gone mad, and the facade that central and local Govt use to justify (legalfy?) their existence and placate the voters/ratepayers.

    Viva la revolution.
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  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deano
    Well I hate spin doctoring 'wordplay', political correctness gone mad, and the facade that central and local Govt use to justify (legalfy?) their existence and placate the voters/ratepayers.

    Viva la revolution.
    Hola!

    You can use my wall. I will supply the blindfolds compadre.
    If a man is alone in the woods and there isn't a woke Hollywood around to call him racist, is he still white?



  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deano
    Well I hate spin doctoring 'wordplay', political correctness gone mad, and the facade that central and local Govt use to justify (legalfy?) their existence and placate the voters/ratepayers.

    Viva la revolution.
    Give us some examples. I could use a good laugh...
    "Standing on your mother's corpse you told me that you'd wait forever." [Bryan Adams: Summer of 69]

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hitcher
    after all it is hard to criminalise something that has no victim -- as long as people don't get their faces rubbed in it.

    Speeding is about road safety. It is a crime that can have victims and dire consequences. Society demands that something is done to address this.

    .
    Hmmm... I see a victims in prostitution. Victims from marriages, young people forced in to it to continue their studies and developing drug habits, Aids and all other manner of bugs and stuff. Young Asian woman put to work in this country because they have been lied to and it goes on and on. Very serious consequences as I see them.

    I think we are victims of societies demand. I hate the fines. they do not stop me speeding just make me careful about when and where. And to all the traffic cops out there I know you have a job to do and good on you but I get pissed off when there is no other traffic on the road dry and clear and you hide in the bushes to skin me. I would hope if I ever see you in trouble I still want to help. The down side is, all enforcement officers are being tagged with the same label and I wounder why people would help when the officers need it on the ground? Another question....When the traffic cop does the big U turn and starts to chase an offender do you all pull to the left so he/she can catch the vehicle they are chasing?? Why should we?? Anyway enough. That should get me flamed for the next few days>>>>>> <<<<<<<<

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hitcher
    Give us some examples. I could use a good laugh...
    Well, without mentioning names, but you may be able to guess.....

    Business Excellence and the Baldridge Award. An organisation I know has been applying for this award for the past few years. Staff got to review the application last year, and there were several items mentioned that supposedly occurred in the organisation, which showed how they were achieving Business Excellence.

    There were at least half a dozen points that staff new were not occuring - hence my comment about the facade that is out out there, simply to please the award scrutineers. These points were not picked up on by the award auditors.

    Auditing of HS&E and ISO systems. Staff are prewarned about a pending audit, so as to ensure that they are up to speed on what should be occurring in the organisation (correct answers etc) all year round.

    Auditors were also steered well clear of those staff who had issues with the 'facade' put forward by management, for fear the bullshit would be exposed.
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  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celtic_Sea_lily
    What the Justice system is supposed to do and what is does are 2 conflicting things I think.
    Partly b/c the people within the "system" are human and partly b/c they're mostly white middle class, middle aged men! I'm talking about the judiciary here, the guys that interpret the law.
    I think that the conflict comes from the publics expectations that justice will be done and the Court / Legal systems limitations in terms of proper legal function and due process.

    As for the judiciary, they are pretty much all from a defence lawyer background and have been sticking up for shitheads for the bulk of their working life. Doesn't matter whether they are middle aged men or not, they all stink of lawyer and thats the overriding conection to the conflict between justice done and due process. In my opinion at least.

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by bros400
    But they havent made speeding Leagal because it happens any way????
    Well, actually they did. Sort of. About sixteen years ago.
    Highway limit went from 80 to 100K because that was what everyone was doing, but in those days you would not have been ticketed for it, so it was legalised.
    Maybe one day the limit will go up to 120, but we will all be racing mobility scooters by then...
    ACC - It's where the Enron accountants all went.

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by What?
    but we will all be racing mobility scooters by then...
    Man - I already have plans for mine. I am going to put higher voltage batteries in it, tub the rear, put some low profile slicks on it, a momo steering handle, Sparco race seat, and a chopper flag...

    And I am going to paint it black with red tribal flames

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by spudchucka
    I think that the conflict comes from the publics expectations that justice will be done and the Court / Legal systems limitations in terms of proper legal function and due process.

    As for the judiciary, they are pretty much all from a defence lawyer background and have been sticking up for shitheads for the bulk of their working life. Doesn't matter whether they are middle aged men or not, they all stink of lawyer and thats the overriding conection to the conflict between justice done and due process. In my opinion at least.
    It would certainly be a lot more efficient to do away with all this due process and legal niceties. Just let the police get on with the job. After all, they know when someone's guilty. Why bother with an expensive trial, an overpaid judge and defense lawyers who abuse the system by getting their clients acquitted on some piddling technicality. There are much better ways. I can certainly appreciate your frustration, Spud!
    Age is too high a price to pay for maturity

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by jrandom
    Aha! Not quite.

    Crimes Act 1961 (as amended), part 7 s134:

    "(1) Every one is liable to imprisonment for a term not exceeding 7 years who has or attempts to have sexual intercourse with any girl of or over the age of 12 years and under the age of 16 years, not being his wife."

    Right. So, starting position is, shag a chick under 16 and you're buggered. Figuratively speaking.

    Now, the section continues:

    "(3) It is a defence to a charge under this section if the person charged proves that the girl consented and that he is younger than the girl:"

    So, if she's between 12 and 15, but you're younger, shag away, baby!

    "Provided that proof of the said facts shall not be a defence if it is proved that such consent was obtained by a false and fraudulent representation as to the nature and quality of the act."

    ... but not if she only did it because you told her you wanted to play Doctors and Nurses.

    "(4) It is a defence to a charge under this section if the person charged proves that the girl consented, that he was under the age of 21 years at the time of the commission of the act, and that he had reasonable cause to believe, and did believe, that the girl was of or over the age of 16 years"

    And it might also be OK if you're under 21, and she had these ENORMOUS, you know... tracts of land, right, and she can hold two dozen Lion Reds without falling down, and... and... well, your Honour, let's face it - do YOU think she looks under 16?

    "(7) No one shall be prosecuted for any offence against this section, except under paragraph (a) of subsection (2) thereof, unless the prosecution is commenced within 12 months from the time when the offence was committed."

    Well, just look at you, you pimply little git. She wasn't exactly going to BRAG about it to everyone the NEXT DAY, now, was she?
    That's a disturbingly thorough knowledge you have on the subject JR...

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  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deano
    Well, without mentioning names, but you may be able to guess.....

    Business Excellence and the Baldridge Award. An organisation I know has been applying for this award for the past few years. Staff got to review the application last year, and there were several items mentioned that supposedly occurred in the organisation, which showed how they were achieving Business Excellence.

    There were at least half a dozen points that staff new were not occuring - hence my comment about the facade that is out out there, simply to please the award scrutineers. These points were not picked up on by the award auditors.

    Auditing of HS&E and ISO systems. Staff are prewarned about a pending audit, so as to ensure that they are up to speed on what should be occurring in the organisation (correct answers etc) all year round.

    Auditors were also steered well clear of those staff who had issues with the 'facade' put forward by management, for fear the bullshit would be exposed.
    Some of this could mean that an audit maintains knowledge and standards, even if it isnt quite to the standards that the auditors expect. Its not all bad. However, random unnanounced audits would be much better.

    If an organisation does not have in place all the schemes it claims to have in the application, then it is lying. If the schemes have been put in place my management but the staff are not complying, the organisation is not lying, the managers are just out of touch. If the organisation has the schemes in place but hasnt properly resourced them and knows it, again the organisation is lying. That isnt a perfect system by any means, but neither is it corrupt.

    There is also, related to this, the tendering system. Competitive tender has led to routine underquoting of true cost and subsequent budget blowouts, as to quote the true cost would be to lose the tender.
    Queiro voya todo Europa con mi moto.... pero no tengo suficiente tiempo o dinero.....

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hitcher
    And the Chief Justice of New Zealand is a...?
    And the Prime Minister of New Zealand is a...?
    And the Governor General of New Zealand is a...?
    And the constitutional monarch of New Zealand is a...?

    This argument is a bit like saying that if women were in charge, that there would be no wars... The riposte to which is: Golda Meir, Indira Ghandi, Margaret Thatcher, Helen Clark...
    Yeah, yeah but I did say "mostly" Mr H and women in leadership is a fairly new concept here and one that a lot of men find difficult to handle b/c the prime minister isn't some blonde bombshell with a great rack! :sly:
    My goal in life is to be as good a person as my dog already thinks I am.

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