Law makers/breakers

**k14** · 21st July 2004, 12:37

Originally Posted by spudchucka

1 hour?? I see the birth of another urban legend. Check the report I think you will see a time slightly longer than that.

Read what I said properly spud, I was talking to cajun, not commenting on the clark convoy.

**Posh Tourer :P** · 21st July 2004, 14:27

Yes well... I suppose now that the politicians and police are prepared to kill me (speeding) I can apply for refugee status in...ummm.... lets say... Germany?

Response heard on the radio this morning.. misquoted... "A police car overtook me along xyz road and I followed him all the way down at 65kmh" These people are ignorant of the underestimation of speedos, so there could be another reason.

So, what speed does a screaming engine in top gear of a Commodore/Ford Fairlane do? I dont think they actually scream at all in top gear due to electronic limiters right? So was it just that the patrol cars/motorcade were flying along on the revlimiter in first gear??

**riffer** · 21st July 2004, 14:30

More likely a bunch of bored ignorant folk speculating.

Absolute bollocks without an actual reading of speed.

If you are walking its very easy to overestimate a car's speed I reckon.

They were more likely doing 90km/hr.

The noise was more likely tyre howl on our shitty roads

**merv** · 21st July 2004, 14:40

Helen's car would be an LTD and I doubt you could hear the engine much. Bystanders claim was the first Police vehicle was some sort of 4x4 and again I doubt it would be that noisy let alone sound like it was revving hard.

**riffer** · 21st July 2004, 15:14

Originally Posted by merv

Bystanders claim was the first Police vehicle was some sort of 4x4.

Definitely tyre howl then...

**sAsLEX** · 21st July 2004, 15:23

just put this to see peoples opinions, having driven down there a few times I know that the roads can cope with higher speeds easily, but in a 4x4?? And isn't this country all about storms in teacups, what would the news do if helen wasn't ripping off paintings or the like?

Also the phrase 'practice what you preach' comes to mind. The current series of adds and anti-speeding campaigns would suggest that this is one of their major issues they are trying to get us to swallow, a bit hard when they themselves dont take their own medicine.

If helen hadn't help deplenish our defence forces a plane/helo could of gone down to pick her up or she would have her own (we have little twin engine 15 odd passenger aircraft we train hercules pilots on, why dont she have one of them to cart her round??)

**Wenier** · 21st July 2004, 16:19

the fact is that the bystanders really didnt no wut speed they did and over exagerated by a huge amount. 140-150 doubt it in a 50k zone maybe 70-80 in reality. All they wanted was their 15secs of fame, i mean shit one guy was gonna ramble on about all the events leading up to it and holmes had to stop him and tell him none of that matters only the bits where they saw them mattered. I reckon they probably travelled at about 20-30k of the posted limit if anything and that would b sufficient to do the trip in 2hrs.

**rodgerd** · 21st July 2004, 17:55

Originally Posted by celticno6

If you are walking its very easy to overestimate a car's speed I reckon.

Definitely, and perception can make a huge difference - my riding instructor warned our class that if we ever have an off, peds would swear black and blue we were speeding, no matter whether we were or not. He backed this up with tapes of a TV2 doco that showed the police investigation into a motorcyclist's death.

All the witnesses swore blind the guy was speeding. The police forensic evidence proved he'd be travelling around the speed limit.

**Ghost Lemur** · 21st July 2004, 20:52

All I can say is WTF

I think it's offical. New Zealand is now a state of winjing(sp?) hillbillies.

Since when has anyone had a problem with a diplomatic car with diplomatic plates and police escort breaking the law. In fact it's not even breaking the law, as the law states vehicles with dip plates or under police escort do NOT have to obey the road rules.

Common people, even us bothering to discuss this is playing into the media's little game. I don't know what the purpose of their game is, but it's seriously pathetic and I really hope the international media doesn't pick up on the story.

**Two Smoker** · 21st July 2004, 21:13

Originally Posted by Cajun

the 1 hour 30 in a car wasn't speeding that much we sat at 120km/h all the

okay it was night and no traffic on the road.

Cajun Mate i think your talking a bit of shit there mate..... I did North Shore to wellsford and back down SH16 to the Westgate in 95 minutes, that worked out to be an average speed of about 102kmh, and i can tell you i wasnt completely thrashing my car, but coming close to it....... My speeds were more around the 140-150 mark (average not top)

As for this, i know that when the police car is on official business (ie a car chase) they are allowed to travel upto 30kmh above the posted speed limit (unless the person being chased/incident area is a danger to Civilian life)

I dont see any major problem with what happened, its not like you couldnt here the cars coming (due to sirens) or see them coming (due to flashing lights......)

But there is also the arhuement that there is a staunch view that speed kills by the current government.....

**jimbo600** · 21st July 2004, 21:17

Originally Posted by sAsLEX

Seeing aunty helen's motorcade breaking the law on the news this morning reminded me of another instance down south when an MPs cars overtook us when we were travelling above the posted speed limit.

Now what repurcusions sp? will come of this? Shouldn't this sort of person be setting the example to NZ. What am I now to think, if I am running late for the airport it is ok to speed, even through built up areas?

I had a police escort once. Only thing is was that they were all behind me with lights and sirens going. Lost them at some stage though.

**scumdog** · 21st July 2004, 21:51

The public are hopeless when it comes to judging speed, they depend heavily on noise to get their idea of what speed a vehicle is doing.
Have you noticed what noise the fan makes on some 4X4s? sounds like the engine is getting a right caning at about 3000rpm.

The people who whinge at length about this episode have a sorry life - get a motorbike and go for a ride and get a life

**Mr Skid** · 21st July 2004, 23:59

Originally Posted by Ghost Lemur

Common people, even us bothering to discuss this is playing into the media's little game. I don't know what the purpose of their game is, but it's seriously pathetic and I really hope the international media doesn't pick up on the story.

err.. sorry to be the bearer of bad news but a quick google turns up quite a few international news agencies carrying the story..
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/3913107.stm
http://www.iol.co.za/index.php?set_i...0395180347B241
http://afr.com/articles/2004/07/21/1090089198325.html
http://www.sky.com/skynews/article/0...161351,00.html
http://www.news24.com/News24/World/N...560333,00.html

Although at this point it appears to be conjecture what speeds they were doing, I think sAsLEX's argument about 'practicing what you preach' is valid.

Whether or not they have carte blanche to speed, it was a government motorcade, and that government has been financing an advertising campaign to promote the message that speeding is dangerous and immoral http://www.ltsa.govt.nz/media/2004/040419.html

So regardless of the legality of their speed, I do have to question what the PM's drivers are doing engaging in behaviour that her government's agency has defined as dangerous and immoral..

It does sound like a case of 'do as I say, not as I do'..

**spudchucka** · 22nd July 2004, 00:07

Originally Posted by paparazzi

While I'd dearly love to see Helen in grief over this one due to her government's prescriptive approach to road safety, I have strong doubts in the veracity of these bystanders claims.. They're probably angry Winston First voters out to topple the government..

Waimate is former Jenny Shipley country isn't it??