Unnecessary exhibition of speed or acceleration

[Sanx]

To wander slightly off topic (inspired by Renegade though)...

Would any of the resident cops care to state how often they abuse their blues and twos priviliges? For example, to get home in time for an All Blacks test on TV, when they're busting for the toilet ... when they've heard over the radio that donut shop's running low on Vanilla Creams. That sort of thing.

I witness it quite often in Auckland. Cop waiting at traffic lights. Lights and siren go on. Cop drives through red lights or does a U-turn across traffic, then lights go straight off and they carry on at a completely normal speed, even to the point of waiting at the next set of lights.

[NordieBoy]

I asked about the "boy racer" slippery crap on the road thing (not exact words) and they sais that was for illegal drags, I asked why and they said cos people hit the oil and crash (true) so I said so this guys oil won't make people crash and the office person said "look, it's not up to me". Our coversation ended but whats the deal? Oil on the road is bad, if people get told they should fix it, if they don't they should get fined. Whats the deal?

It's the intent part.
Physically pouring slippery crap on the road VS slippery crap being poured on the road poss. without your knowledge.

[Renegade]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Renegade
Speed - exceeding posted speed limit by 11kph, after all we do have an 11kph tolerance.


No we fuckin don't. I have the paperwork to prove it. 111kph, eighty bucks, twenty points.

stink for you, every cops got his own figure, dont think i could bring myself to dish that one out let alone even bother to stop ya.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Renegade
Unnecessary - there was no reason to fang it in the first place (although we love it)

That might be your definition of unnecessary, but it's a purely subjective one.


yeah, it is, so, if you didnt have a reason to did it was unnecessary though wasnt it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Renegade
Acceleration - usually given away by the tyre squeal, how else can you judge it?

Who says you have to judge it? You can measure it. In metres per second squared or in kilometres per hour per second, it doesn't matter. Acceleration is measurable and quantifiable. Measure the speed at one point. Measure it one second later. The difference between the two speeds is acceleration. Hardly difficult, is it?

yip cos we are all geeky mathmaticians and carry that sort of equipment in the car, you HAVE to judge it dont you by what you see, hear and smell(rubber) at that time, usually these things happen when youre dealing with something else.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Renegade
Speed - exceeding posted speed limit by 11kph, after all we do have an 11kph tolerance.

Yes, we do. Except when it's not applied. Which is purely at the discretion of the officer.

yip but most of us like to sleep straight in bed at night so turn a blind eye when possible.

Remember, cops see all the smeared bodies and deal with the real scum to a degree where it would affect your judgement to a degree

yip and those images you never forget, and yes to sound like a broken record speed and a sudden stop does = dead, our bodies just arent tough enough.

[scumdog]

Driving under the speed limit in a sensible manner, even late at night, is not just cause for being pulled over. If Chilling_Silence is to be believed (and we have no reason not to), the Police even measured the vehicle ride-height. This does rather smack of a fishing expidition, no?

Maybe. Maybe not - the MX5 may have been/looked lowered.

"Anywhare - anytime" sunshine, driving in a sensible manner on a registered car with a current Warrant of Fitness is no guarantee you won't get pulled over.
"Just cause" went out with Mk4 Zephyrs and 80kmh speed limits, just like the cop having to put his hat on before he can arrest you/give you a ticket.

[scumdog]

To wander slightly off topic (inspired by Renegade though)...

Would any of the resident cops care to state how often they abuse their blues and twos priviliges? For example, to get home in time for an All Blacks test on TV, when they're busting for the toilet ... when they've heard over the radio that donut shop's running low on Vanilla Creams. That sort of thing.

I witness it quite often in Auckland. Cop waiting at traffic lights. Lights and siren go on. Cop drives through red lights or does a U-turn across traffic, then lights go straight off and they carry on at a completely normal speed, even to the point of waiting at the next set of lights.

You would be surprised the number of times cops get sent to "priority 1 violent domestic at xxxx happening right now" turns to a "stand down, it's only a verbal thing and both parties have gone off in opposite directions" etc etc.
Witnesses tend to get carried away at times.

[MotoGirl]

You would be surprised the number of times cops get sent to "priority 1 violent domestic at xxxx happening right now" turns to a "stand down, it's only a verbal thing and both parties have gone off in opposite directions" etc etc.
Witnesses tend to get carried away at times.

That must be the same reason why some speed and fail to indicate

[Sanx]

You would be surprised the number of times cops get sent to "priority 1 violent domestic at xxxx happening right now" turns to a "stand down, it's only a verbal thing and both parties have gone off in opposite directions" etc etc.
Witnesses tend to get carried away at times.

Sounds like a pretty good reason I hadn't thought of. Fair's fair.

[Pancakes]

One of my best mates dad's was a bike cop in the 70's & early 80's and he told me once that they would quite often get stood down and the policy then was to leave the lights & siren on and safely head down a less busy street to turn them off, saving the complaints of running lights etc.

What would your job be like without the perks tho eh? hehehehe

[Toaster]

You would be surprised the number of times cops get sent to "priority 1 violent domestic at xxxx happening right now" turns to a "stand down, it's only a verbal thing and both parties have gone off in opposite directions" etc etc.
Witnesses tend to get carried away at times.

Damn straight. I recall many a time get dispatched to P1 jobs only to get stood down part-way there.... I hated it because you always knew some of the public would make stupid assumptions about 'being late for doughnuts'.

[Renegade]

i love a cream and rasberry doughnut and the round cinnamin ones as much as the next guy but i REFUSE to buy one in uniform due to that dam american stereo type!!

[swbarnett]

speed and a sudden stop does = dead, our bodies just arent tough enough.

Exactly, speed alone is never enough, you need the sudden stop as well. Who are you to judge the likelihood of me having a sudden stop? Do you do a thorough investigation of my vehicle and my driving skills before issuing a speeding ticket? No, you just assume that everyone doing X km/h has the same chance of crashing. Some drivers that look perfectly safe shouldn't be on the road at any speed because they don't have clue what's going on around them while others are perfectly safe over the speed limit because they know what they, their vehicle, the road and everyone else in the vicinity are doing (and when they don't they know to slow down - often to way below the speed limit).

[JimBob]

Exactly, speed alone is never enough, you need the sudden stop as well. Who are you to judge the likelihood of me having a sudden stop? Do you do a thorough investigation of my vehicle and my driving skills before issuing a speeding ticket? No, you just assume that everyone doing X km/h has the same chance of crashing. Some drivers that look perfectly safe shouldn't be on the road at any speed because they don't have clue what's going on around them while others are perfectly safe over the speed limit because they know what they, their vehicle, the road and everyone else in the vicinity are doing (and when they don't they know to slow down - often to way below the speed limit).

So how would you tell which cars to pull over?

[scumdog]

So not only is the interpretation of 'unnecessary' entirely up to the officer involved, he has the power to seize and impound the vehicle - with immediate effect at the roadside - if he merely believes that the driver / rider commited the offence.

So who else is the copper meant to ask about the 'unnecessary' bit - the driver of said car/bike????

[scumdog]

Exactly, speed alone is never enough, you need the sudden stop as well.

So the new series of ads. will say : "Slow down, stopping kills"????????


Like nobody makes the association between speed and sudden stops??????

I don't think so Tim.

[Sanx]

So who else is the copper meant to ask about the 'unnecessary' bit - the driver of said car/bike????

You get me wrong, Scumdog. This isn't really the Police's problem; it's the the courts and ultimately the governments.

The Boy Racer act legislation was rammed through Parliament under urgency a couple of years ago. Margaret Wilson (you know, Attorney General) warned the government that the Bill could violate the NZ Bill of Rights. They didn't listen. The problem is the wording of the bill. It contains wishy-washy terminology like "unnecessary", "reasonable grounds", "may have", "believe".

Until such time as the legislation's wording is clarified and objective limits replace subjective definitions, the Police are going to be stuck trying to enforce a set of laws which are deliberately vague, and any enforcement of such is going to make the traffic cops even less unpopular than they already are - if possible.

The Police use the powers they're given. Whilst I believe that enforcement of law should be done with common sense and natural justice as the over-riding principles, it's hardly surprising that legislation like the Boy Racer act get enforced. Cop spots boy racer in vehicle being a bit of a dick. Loud music, raucous voices, etc. No proof or indication that they've done anything wrong, but hey - there was a bit of a drag away from the lights eariler, so let's ping 'em under the good old 'unnecessary acceleration' charge. No proof is needed; the cop has to merely believe the vehicle may have been operated in such a manner.

So, until the legislation is changed to introduce objective limits and to shift the burden of proof where it belongs - the Police - these incidents will keep on happening. The Police need to be given the tools to measure compliance with said limits. And the Police, no matter how unfairly, are going to keep getting the blame.