What is life without risk?

[fishb8nz]

I love riding to the max but I have to be VERY aware that my wife of 35 years would probably miss miss if I killed myself doing unsafe and dangerous manoevres, hell even if I was doing safe riding. We are a very vulnerable species.
I can remember being a party to to a plot to stop my dad getting back on a bike at the age I am, right now. Sorry dad! Never realised how much you enjoyed biking.
I got into a straight-line tankslapper on SH1 on Sat evening. Accelerated, coming out of the 70 km zone from Ngrauawahia towards Hamilton and got wheel-spin, followed by a huge snake. Only moving from 80 to 100!!

[swbarnett]

(Oops, here's today's headline "Cynical old fart escapes, offers opinion....")

I think most of us are at least "Cynical old farts in the making". It seems we have lots of company.

The "powers that be" will only listen to reason when they have no other choice. It's all about lining their pockets and protecting the cosy little life style. It's just human nature.

[swbarnett]

Only moving from 80 to 100!!

Exactly, what's supposed to be so safe about 100km/h anyway? It seems a pretty arbitrary limit to me.

[98tls]

Interesting read............life without risk would hardley seem life at all.........to me anyway you dont have to do warp speed to have fun....in fact straight roads are bloody boring,find a road like the one from fox to hokitika.....awsome,endless very tight corners going up and down the mountain........risk yes....warp speed not possible....feel alive......more than ever.

[Toaster]

I have no problem with people living - just don't kill or hurt anyone else while you are out there doing your living on the roads that we all share.

[moT]

i think that if the speed lmits were to be lifted then there should be stricter and harder drivers licencing tests not just your knowlage of the road code but tests of how to control oversteer, understeer, a spin, high speed manovering, brakeing etc then i think that would deacreae road tolls and make commuting hours shorter

[swbarnett]

I have no problem with people living - just don't kill or hurt anyone else while you are out there doing your living on the roads that we all share.

People die. It's a fact of life. You shouldn't stop living just because the odd person dies sooner than you think they should.

The problem here is that people are confusing two issues (even I do on occasion):

On the one had you have speed limits, an arbitrarily imposed cut-off. Higher speed limits (or none at all) lead to a lower road toll.

On the other hand you have outright dangerous driving at whatever speed. If someone is genuinely dangerous then the police have other laws at their disposal, they don't need speed limits.

Myself, I fall somewhere between plodding and hooning - probably wouldn't do much over 140 on the best of roads (given a vehicle capable of it). The way I ride I'm not killing anybody and I'm not putting anybody at undue risk so why should I be penalised for minding my own business?

[swbarnett]

i think that if the speed lmits were to be lifted then there should be stricter and harder drivers licencing tests not just your knowlage of the road code but tests of how to control oversteer, understeer, a spin, high speed manovering, brakeing etc then i think that would deacreae road tolls and make commuting hours shorter

This would be a good idea irrespective of the speed limit argument.

[98tls]

FWIW in my opinion anyway its not so much the speeding that kills its where they choose to do it,as long as theres motor vehicles people will die in em..no matter what the speed limit.......i chuckle when i read the road police bashing threads on here,on the road today i saw idiots speeding in the stupidest places........the cops must just sit and wait......munch munch another idiot for lunch.

[Toaster]

The way I ride I'm not killing anybody and I'm not putting anybody at undue risk so why should I be penalised for minding my own business?

I am not confused there lad.

Riding on publicly funded roads is never "our own business". We speed at our own risk (yes "our") - so we should not complain when we get caught. As a rider, I'd like to see higher limits on good roads too, but then there are a lot of people out there I wish were not on them. 5 times I have been taken out by other dickheads on the roads over some 20 years of sharing them with other road users. I suffered immensely from those experiences and am only alive, becasue each time I was in a car that saved my ass.

During the years when I was in the police, I attended fatal crashes facing the horrific sites that you have to deal with and also told relatives that their loved one is dead because either they were stupid or some other dickhead who thought they were gods-gift to riding/driving were stupid. I am glad those days are over for me.

All I can say is don't overestimate your own ability and don't assume too much. Quite simply, the faster you go, the longer it takes to stop and the more chance there is you will hit what ever it is that caught you out. I heard too many a time "I never thought it would happen to me!"

Good luck riding.

[Storm]

I'd agree with the statement that life without risk is no life at all, however, I also feel that too much risk will equal no life full stop!
My sig is a line I heard in a song that really struck a chord with me, and I reckon there's worse ways to look at things than that.
That said, I have a pregnant wife at home when I am out riding- I like to have a good time on the bike, but I'm conscious of the fact I want to make it home at the end of the day.

Bit disjointed sorry, but thats my 2 c for today

[swbarnett]

I am not confused there lad.

Did I say you were? How old do you think I am?

Riding on publicly funded roads is never "our own business".

When I say "my own business" this includes looking out for and respecting the rights of other road users. I am an individual but am also part of a society. My respect for others extends far beyond the road.

We speed at our own risk (yes "our") - so we should not complain when we get caught.

I don't complain if I get caught. I understand that whether I like it or not speed limits are there.

... am only alive, because each time I was in a car that saved my ass.

I don't accept that a car is safer than a bike. I've had near misses where I only avoided the accident because I could squeeze through a gap or accelerate away.

All I can say is don't overestimate your own ability and don't assume too much.

I actually drive more cautiously than this thread would suggest. No, I'm not slow but I do exercise caution when driving. I'm aware of what's in front, behind and to each side of me.

Quite simply, the faster you go, the longer it takes to stop and the more chance there is you will hit what ever it is that caught you out.

At the same time someone travelling at the speed limit that is not paying attention to everything around them is a damn site more dangerous than someone over the limit and fully aware.

I heard too many a time "I never thought it would happen to me!"

I am aware that it could happen to me. Maybe this is why, in 26 years of driving, it hasn't. As soon as you lose site of your own human fallibility you're in deep trouble (not just on the road).


It has been shown that higher speed limits lead to lower road tolls. Check out http://www.fastandsafe.org.nz/Pages/factsAndMyths.htm

[swbarnett]

I'd agree with the statement that life without risk is no life at all, however, I also feel that too much risk will equal no life full stop!

Agreed, the question is when is that level reached? You can only answer that for yourself.

[scumdog]

Another thought:

The only reason that we have speed limits in the first place is that the police are lazy and the population at large do not want to pay for a fairer law. Without speed limits the careless/dangerous driving laws would have to be used instead for people out driving the conditions. This would involve more face to face policing instead of cheap, revenue gathering, speed cameras.

The reason we have speed limits is that a fair percentage of drivers are day-dreaming fuckwits who would drive through the middle of town at 95kmh without even thinking about it if it wasn't for speed limits - or drive down the motorway in their blinged-out night-club-on-wheels at 190kmh and weaving through the 'slower' cars while txting their mate to make sure they'll meet at Maccas in ten minutes.

YOU might be a good safe driver but you are paying for those that aren't - you may also be able to drive well with a breath-alcohol level of 680 but you are paying for those that can't......yadda..yadda..yadda..

More "Face to face policing"? - I hope you would be satisfied with the (a) increase in tax (and/or huge fines/costs) to pay for this or (b) put up with less money going into schools/hospitals/social services etc to pay for this.

[Sanx]

All I can say is don't overestimate your own ability and don't assume too much. Quite simply, the faster you go, the longer it takes to stop and the more chance there is you will hit what ever it is that caught you out.

Whilst it's true it takes longer to stop when you're travelling faster, there's no conclusive evidence that higher average speed equates to more road fatalities; despite various western governments having spent millions on research with the intention of showing a causal link. In fact, there's plenty of evidence that suggests precisely the opposite from the US; one of the very few countries to have raised speed limits in the past twenty years or so.

When the US government repealed the 55mph maximum on all Interstate highways, they devolved power to set speed limits to the individual state legislatures. Despite various anti-speed pressure groups predicting carnage and destruction, the precise opposite was seen. Where states raised the limits, the road toll fell when compared to those states that left them the same. There was even a proportional link evident: the higher the speed limit, the greater the fall in fatalities.

Britain's motorways are another good example. Even the UK Police, usually gestapo-like in their application of speed limits, have given up issuing tickets for less than 80mph (the limit's 70mph). My nightly journeys from London to Oxford often saw average speed in the outside two lanes of more than 90mph. No action ever taken. Why? Quite simply, it was demonstrably safer. The higher the speed, the more people kept their distance. With a higher speed differential between lanes, there was more opportunity for people to change lanes safely, rather than having to force your way in as is often the case here.

None of this changes the fact the speeding is illegal. No point whining when you get caught because you know it is. However, it is worth whining about enforcement or the limits in place. In many places, they're ridiculous and counter-intuitive. However, until such time comes when overwhelming evidence that higher speed limits equates to fewer road deaths, then the mad mullahs down in Wellington will continue to impose slower limits and stiffer penalties and raise more revenue, all while claiming it's for our own good.