It happened AGAIN!!

[Sycophant]

I understand the backseat riding to some extent. I am not what I would call an experienced rider, but I am hardly a n00b either. I've been riding in peak time traffic for the better part of four years. I've ridden that same route every day for about a year and a half.

I always cover the brake on that road (and most other places). Yes, there were very possibly better options. Yes I probably did overbrake. Yes I have practiced emergency braking. But the reality as I saw it at the time, and the reaction I had was all I had at the time. I was traveling at a fair safe speed (45-50 max) in a clear and dry lane. I ride centre left in that lane so as to make myself more visible to the cars in the right lane, and cars turning right across the lane from the other direction.

The person who pulled our was practically stationary when he made his move in front of me. I can only presume he did not look in his mirrors well, as I shouldn't have been in his blind spot.

My riding attire is not perfect, but not completely reckless either, I wear sturdy shoes, good jeans and a proper jacket. The jeans are not ideal, but offer a good compromise for me. I will look at better clothing.

For what it's worth, the guy should never have been in my lane at all, it is for buses, bikes and 3+ occupant cars. He clearly didn't meet the criteria or he would have been in the lane from the start.

In practice, perhaps it should have been possible to stop safely in that distance, or even change direction, but in the distance and time I had to react I wasn't able, when push came to shove, affect any other option. The practice I've done, while reasonable is very difficult to call upon perfectly in a situation like that. I did everything I could in the time i had to stop safely, but it didn't work out. I did drop a fair bit of speed before the wheel locked and I went down, but in the end that's what happened.

I am not some jackass riding around in shorts and jandals and pulling monos while splitting through urban streets, I ride every day and I ride as safely as I can. Shit happens, and in this case, happened.

I'll take that I should have better pants, but as for the rest of it, I think i did reasonably well in a pretty rough situation.

[FROSTY:Me]

Hey dude don't panic.
By playin it back in your head its not about kickin yaself its about seeing what you can change to avoid it happening again.

Give Quasi on here a yeodle for a fantastic deal on trou.

Just a thought--Isn't that section of inside lane green painted--maybee slipppery??

[sAsLEX]

So more like 3 - 4 metres, not 30 - 40?

Don't ever sit to the left of a car that you're following... stay on the right...

I'm sure some of the Auckland Riding Training classes will teach you this: If someone jumps in, use the centre-line as your 'new' temporary lane, while you pass the bastard, while using your left hand to wave hello ...

Depends on the road, I would sit to the left a bit as on that road you are on the inside ie left hand side of the traffic that is stationary/ a hazard. It moves you in to a better visual range for the drivers, puts some distance between you and them and is just better.

[ZeroIndex]

Depends on the road, I would sit to the left a bit as on that road you are on the inside ie left hand side of the traffic that is stationary/ a hazard. It moves you in to a better visual range for the drivers, puts some distance between you and them and is just better.

Sounds like a badly designed road... yet another government roading screwup...

[sAsLEX]

Sounds like a badly designed road... yet another government roading screwup...

Not really , pointless having the bus lane on the right and making the bus push through traffic to get to its stops. In fact I thik you will find all bus/transit lanes are on the inside for this very reason.

There coud be some other illogical reason for it...... but I doubt it.

[Jantar]

Fark, what speed were you doing.
I have seen noobs stop in <8m from 50kph.

This does raise some serious issues.
1) You were going waaaay too fast for the conditions.
2) You really should get to RRRS on Sunday.
3) Exactly how long did you tell you GF your dick was?

Wow, Can you get those noobs to teach me their braking technique? And what tyres are they using?

50 km/h is 14 m/s, so they are decellerating at 12.25G and stopping in 1.14 seconds (without any reaction time). The very best braking results I have seen in any test is 0.9G, so these noobs are doing 15 times better than the experts. I just have to learn this technique which somehow rewrites the laws of physics.

[sAsLEX]

Wow, Can you get those noobs to teach me their braking technique? And what tyres are they using?

50 km/h is 14 m/s, so they are decellerating at 12.25G and stopping in 1.14 seconds (without any reaction time). The very best braking results I have seen in any test is 0.9G, so these noobs are doing 15 times better than the experts. I just have to learn this technique which somehow rewrites the laws of physics.

2g would be ~18m/s/s yes?

14/18 = 0.7 seconds so travelled less than 14m


I think your math might be suspect? 12g would have you stoped very very short distance.

EDIT: some rough working at what I thiknk the G is.....

[Jantar]

2g would be ~18m/s/s yes?

14/18 = 0.7 seconds so travelled less than 14m


I think your math might be suspect?

EDIT: some rough working

V^2 = U^2 + 2 f s
V=14
U=0
s=8

So 14^2 (196) = 2 f 8
or f = 196/16
f = 12.25 m/s

So you are correct, I labled this as G rather than m/s. Its actually 1.24G which is still far better than I've seen in any braking test.

[sAsLEX]

V^2 = U^2 + 2 f s
V=14
U=0s=8

So 14^2 (196) = 2 f 8
or f = 196/16
f = 12.25 m/s

So you are correct, I labled this as G rather than m/s. Its actually 1.24G which is still far better than I've seen in any braking test.

But say 10m might make it fall in to the reals of possibility?! CAnt be arsed doing that again, not without a pen and paper and a decent calc.

[Jantar]

But say 10m might make it fall in to the reals of possibility?! CAnt be arsed doing that again, not without a pen and paper and a decent calc.

With a 0.5 sec reaction time, I'd say more like 14m. Which is close to the 15m given in the road code.

[FROSTY:Me]

Now heres the difference between the old aproach and todays generation--
My generation--we'd Mark a start point and see how long it took us to stop.

[Macktheknife]

With a 0.5 sec reaction time, I'd say more like 14m. Which is close to the 15m given in the road code.

Jantar PM sent.

I train riders every week who manage to stop from 45-50 kmh in under 10 metres, 15 is taking it easy.

I am glad to hear the rider concerned is not badly injured but I really believe this is a serious issue for many riders. Misjudging what is the best course of action gets many of us into difficulty simply because we misread the situation and respond in ways which are not always best for us.
No-one is so good they cannot learn from going over the basics again, and I highly recommend doing so every year.

Sycophant, please feel free to make use of one of the site mentors who will give their time and knowledge to you (free of charge) and maybe help you avoid this situation repeating.
Best of luck,
Mack

[Jantar]

Jantar PM sent.

I train riders every week who manage to stop from 45-50 kmh in under 10 metres, 15 is taking it easy.

I am glad to hear the rider concerned is not badly injured but I really believe this is a serious issue for many riders. Misjudging what is the best course of action gets many of us into difficulty simply because we misread the situation and respond in ways which are not always best for us.
No-one is so good they cannot learn from going over the basics again, and I highly recommend doing so every year.

Sycophant, please feel free to make use of one of the site mentors who will give their time and knowledge to you (free of charge) and maybe help you avoid this situation repeating.
Best of luck,
Mack

This is where the quadratic nature of accelleration comes into play. Stopping in 10 m from 45 km/h is only 0.8G and is easily achievable even on poor tyres. The same stopping distance at 50km/h is almost 1 G. With the right teqnique and on a good surface this should be achievable providing there is no reaction time. Notice that a 10% increase in speed is a 21% increase in the decelleration required.

[FROSTY:Me]

Have you factored in the friction coeficient of the road surface?

[Jantar]

Have you factored in the friction coeficient of the road surface?

No, here we are simply discussing the distance required to stop. The Cf of the road in itself is not that important, its the combined road/tyre Cf that can make a difference. ie poor tyres on a good road surface or good tyres on a less effective road surface would both result in greater chance of losing traction. Poor tyres on a grity or icy surface, and the distance is greatly increased.