I'm a grave menace to society

**idb** · 24th July 2007, 11:55

Originally Posted by Jantar

SD, I've got to agree with the other comments made in relation to this idiot. By emphasising the supposed dangers of exceeding the posted speed limit, rather than recognising what is or isn't a safe speed for the road and traffic conditions, the anti speed campaign is deluding people into thinking that they are safe when they are under the limit. But it also doesn't allow them to learn when it is safe to exceed that same abitary limit.

Here is an interestin snippet: http://www.safeas.govt.nz/smf/index.php?topic=568.0

New York Times
Safe at Any Speed
With higher speed limits, our highways have been getting safer.

Friday, July 7, 2006 12:01 a.m. EDT.

It's more dangerous ground I know but the same can be said of alcohol limits.
I know myself that the amount of booze I can drink before feeling the effects varies from sesh to sesh.
............and some days I'm stupider than others so the stupidometer could fail me on Wednesday when I would passed on Tuesday.

**Sanx** · 24th July 2007, 12:22

Originally Posted by Grahameeboy

So they still have 660 million cars which is double the population of America which is slight larger than China so no wonder they have so many accidents.

America has approx 150 million cars so China has 4.4 times the number of cars than America so it doesn't take much to work out the car density in China.

China is 35 times larger than New Zealand. NZ in 2002 had 245,000 registered vehicles so x 35 gives a comparison figure of 8,575,000 vehicle so given the low traffic density of NZ we are not too hot.

Good try, but...

China has (according to the figures I can find) 8 cars per 1000 inhabitants; 9.6 million cars. The US has 940 cars per 1000 inhabitants; 283 million cars. So your figures aren't just wrong, they're out by more than an order of magnitude. Every year, there are between 110,000 and 250,000 people killed on China's roads, depending on whether you believe the Chinese authorities or independent organisations like the World Health organisation. Let's take an average: 180,000. The US, by comparison, has an annual road toll of around 40,000.

So, by whatever measure you use, the US's record is massively better than China's. One death per 7075 cars in the US, versus one death per 53 cars in China. One death per 7500 individuals in the US versus one death per 7343 individuals in China. The usual measure of road toll, though, is fatalities per million km driven. China doesn't publish this information, but I think it's safe to assume the number of kms driven in China is massively less than in the US.

Still not scientific, but - sorry to say - a crap load more so than your effort.

**Grahameeboy** · 24th July 2007, 12:28

Originally Posted by Sanx

Good try, but...

China has (according to the figures I can find) 8 cars per 1000 inhabitants; 9.6 million cars. The US has 940 cars per 1000 inhabitants; 283 million cars. So your figures aren't just wrong, they're out by more than an order of magnitude. Every year, there are between 110,000 and 250,000 people killed on China's roads, depending on whether you believe the Chinese authorities or independent organisations like the World Health organisation. Let's take an average: 180,000. The US, by comparison, has an annual road toll of around 40,000.

So, by whatever measure you use, the US's record is massively better than China's. One death per 7075 cars in the US, versus one death per 53 cars in China. One death per 7500 individuals in the US versus one death per 7343 individuals in China. The usual measure of road toll, though, is fatalities per million km driven. China doesn't publish this information, but I think it's safe to assume the number of kms driven in China is massively less than in the US.

Still not scientific, but - sorry to say - a crap load more so than your effort.

Well not according to the sites I looked at and I chose the top ones which must be current / most hits.

However, does not detract from the fact that NZ drivers are not good.

If number of cars increased by 67% in 4 years that is a huge jump and is bound to have a huge impact of accident rates with liberated Chinese taking to cars so still not a comparable comparison.............still they have enough spare labour to go back to using red flags!!

Still it proves one thing...we are not rocket scientists eh?

**Grahameeboy** · 24th July 2007, 12:29

Originally Posted by idb

It's more dangerous ground I know but the same can be said of alcohol limits.
I know myself that the amount of booze I can drink before feeling the effects varies from sesh to sesh.
............and some days I'm stupider than others so the stupidometer could fail me on Wednesday when I would passed on Tuesday.

So at anyone time you are still stupid but to varying degrees then...

**Edbear** · 24th July 2007, 12:38

Originally Posted by Grahameeboy

So at anyone time you are still stupid but to varying degrees then...

**Sanx** · 24th July 2007, 12:38

Originally Posted by Grahameeboy

China is 35 times larger than New Zealand. NZ in 2002 had 245,000 registered vehicles so x 35 gives a comparison figure of 8,575,000 vehicle so given the low traffic density of NZ we are not too hot.

Incidentally, New Zealand has 3.9 million registered vehicles, not 245,000; 951 vehicles per 1000 inhabitants, slightly higher than the USA. So to compare NZ against China's figures: one death per 9750 vehicles compared to one death per 53 vehicles in China. One death per 10250 inhabitants versus one death per 7343 in China.

**Grahameeboy** · 24th July 2007, 12:43

Originally Posted by Sanx

Incidentally, New Zealand has 3.9 million registered vehicles, not 245,000; 951 vehicles per 1000 inhabitants, slightly higher than the USA. So to compare NZ against China's figures: one death per 9750 vehicles compared to one death per 53 vehicles in China. One death per 10250 inhabitants versus one death per 7343 in China.

Bugger that was a top site I checked out too......but like all figures that shows that there is almost 1 car per person in NZ compared with less in China so interesting...

See my last post.......

**SPman** · 24th July 2007, 13:08

Originally Posted by Grub

And the $$ pay the Policemen and the Policemen catch bad guys (like the ones that stole Frosty's kids bikes!)

I wish people would just get off the "it's only revenue gathering" bandwagon.
- Speed is the major factor in the road toll
- Therefore they police speed

Losers blame someone else for their mistakes, never themselves.

I guess you're right. If every vehicle in the country didn't actually move (ie, travel at a speed), then the only accidents would be trees falling on garages!

Originally Posted by t

Mate, I hear what you are saying.... but driving or riding is risking a crash any time of day or night. The issue is how fast do you want to be going when you crash.

So - by that statement you are assuming that you and everyone else on the road IS going to crash at some stage, irrespective of how fast they are going or what is happening, just by the fact of being on the road???? If that is your outlook, you'd be better off refusing to venture out on the road and going everywhere by train......self fulfilling prophecies we could well do without.......

**swbarnett** · 24th July 2007, 13:51

Originally Posted by Toaster

The issue is how fast do you want to be going when you crash.

Preferably no more than 8km/h. That's the speed of impact at which bones start to break. Would this be a good speed limit?

**MSTRS:Me** · 24th July 2007, 13:53

Originally Posted by swbarnett

Preferably no more than 8km/h. That's the speed of impact at which bones start to break. Would this be a good speed limit?

SHUT UP. You never know who might be listening.

**scumdog** · 24th July 2007, 13:57

Originally Posted by Sanx

I'm not suggesting people have to go round in a race qualifying time; but going round fast enough to get the tyres squealing a bit shows they're not afraid of a car and they know how to drive at speed.

But it's a better test than the learning-by-rote of the road code the current system seems to focus on.

In fact, almost all accidents happened on roads. Therefore, we should ban roads.

Teaching a person to handle a car well is not the same as teaching them to drive well.

And a counter to your last comment:

In fact almost all accidents (and most ain't 'accidents' BTW) happened with vehicles. Therefore, we should ban vehicles.

**Toaster** · 24th July 2007, 14:06

Originally Posted by MSTRS

SHUT UP. You never know who might be listening.

Yeah i can hear the phones at LTNZ going hot now.

**swbarnett** · 24th July 2007, 14:09

Originally Posted by Toaster

Yeah i can hear the phones at LTNZ going hot now.

Maybe I'm naive but I'd like to think even they would see how ludicrous an 8km/h speed limit would be. Maybe I'm just over estimating the level of brain activity in NZ government?

**GIXser** · 24th July 2007, 14:10

Sanx me dear boy we need to chat. my favourite used to be going past them "one up" whilst giving them a one finger salute" then ya slow down a bit.. cos they think they can catch ya... then just bait the fuckers.. anyways . im older and wiser now.... i dont wheelie past them anymore, i just salute them...