Cheesecutter campaign

[Urano]

What is wrong with you people? There are plenty of things out there that are more dangerous, than a wire road barrier. If you cannot cope with any of the ones around NZ. Then you either need to leave NZ or stop riding on NZ roads. This is really getting pathetic and some of you should really know better.

...or not coming to nz at all...
this is not my intention, obviously, and i do agree with you that there are a lot of dangers out there.
but this is not a good reason to give up.

i wrote the post 'cause i've seen you a little dispirited, and i think this could be something that worth the battle.

you know, lookin' at you from here, i see interesting differences about the way you think at the road in our countries.
you are much more on the essence of a problem, way more consistent, i'd say...
here we are focused on the look first of all, on how things will appear rather than if it will work or not. for example we have different speed limits on the highways in consideration of the weather: 130 if sunny, 110 kmh if it's raining.
and everybody would say "woa, gooooood, this is a wise law" ya. unfortunately it is impossible to set the speed cameras to two different values, cops have old instruments that are difficult to use in the rain, and there are even discussion on "when exactly is "raining"?". so the result is that if you try to follow the rules under the rain you'll very likely to be flattened from behind... as you see italy is a pretty stupid place.

gettin back on topic, here we have frequent accidents with enduro bikers decapitated with wires put in the countryside to limit properties: when riding are completely invisible...
those "cheesecutters" remind me those accidents...
so, in the very rare cases you have thing to get better, well, fight for it. you can do it.

[inlinefour]

Reading a lot of your recent posts you seem to have a real chip on your shoulder, or you're bored and trolling. Either way it's getting pretty old. No one is forcing you to read these topics, or even the forum in general ............


........ don't let the door hit you on the way out. Have a nice day.

I think the door hit some of you in the head when you came in.

No one is forcing you to ride on the road if you don't like any of the hazards.

No matter what anyone says here, this is the way that it is. The fact that there is more here that cannot see this, just shows that your the ones with the problems. No me, but its funny as hell reading all the bullshit replies from people trying to avoid reality.

As you were.

[Urano]

this is the way that it is.

and it is also the way that it should be and you like it to be?

[swbarnett]

There are plenty of things out there that are more dangerous, than a wire road barrier.

Very true. To me the issue is not that they're dangerous. It's that a "safety" system actually makes the situation worse. Also the fact that we are deliberatly left out of the discussion when it comes to what type of barrier to install. Not to mention that they are installed because they're cheap when concrete is cheaper and more convenient for all in the long term.

[bogan]

Very true. To me the issue is not that they're dangerous. It's that a "safety" system actually makes the situation worse. Also the fact that we are deliberatly left out of the discussion when it comes to what type of barrier to install. Not to mention that they are installed because they're cheap when concrete is cheaper and more convenient for all in the long term.

You left out the main bit, the safety system does make it better overall, however they are completely ignoring a minority of road users for which it makes the situation worse. They complain that bikes are too dangerous yet the mindset is to ignore bike safety completely.

And at IL4, some of us don't do the protesting etc for ourselves, we do it to preserve the biking community of NZ, if it gets too dangerous (or perceived as such) or too expensive (see ACC levies) then biker numbers will drop and many will miss out on the awesomeness that is riding

[inlinefour]

Very true. To me the issue is not that they're dangerous. It's that a "safety" system actually makes the situation worse. Also the fact that we are deliberatly left out of the discussion when it comes to what type of barrier to install. Not to mention that they are installed because they're cheap when concrete is cheaper and more convenient for all in the long term.

You miss the point completely. Anyone who complains about the wire barriers because they ride a motorcycle, is just being selfish. Its about making NZ roads safer for everyone and not just a minority here. The fact is that they are here, they are here to stay and no amount of bleating to anyone is going to change this. It is entirely up to you if you continue to try. But all it is likely to do is make you all frustrated the longer it goes on for. Having me here stating the obvious, would appear to frustrate some also. But at least it gives me plenty to laugh about.

[Urano]

so you don't think that a movement of people can change things in your country? i thought nz was a democracy.... (i know i know... the queen...)
even our guard rails were there to remain, but a lot of people in europe have said that they were wrong, so at the end we managed to make clear the error.

talking about motorcyclists is not being selfish, is only to remark the fact that riders are (sadly and by far) the main part of incidents injured victims, with all the social related costs for everyone in the country, also for the cagers...
so it's everyone's interest to make safer barrier for bikers...
and, seeing at the picture posted in this thread, those barriers are not so safe for cagers as well...

listen, from the other part of the world, as i've said, you seem a very advanced and intelligent country. there are no paradise on this earth anyway, so this is one thing i hope you could make better as everyone here wanted to do. then is you...

[MSTRS:Me]

The whole point of the 'resistance' is that for a safety system to be utilised, it must not make things more dangerous for any segment of the potential 'users'.
And as for WRB, they are a cheap compromise, albeit effective in most cases.
I don't believe that any country has yet to use them retrofitted with a sleeve (or whatever) to cover the cutty slicey bits, and many countries in Europe are in the process of removing these abominations due to pressure from the vulnerable.

[swbarnett]

You miss the point completely. Anyone who complains about the wire barriers because they ride a motorcycle, is just being selfish. Its about making NZ roads safer for everyone and not just a minority here. The fact is that they are here, they are here to stay and no amount of bleating to anyone is going to change this. It is entirely up to you if you continue to try. But all it is likely to do is make you all frustrated the longer it goes on for. Having me here stating the obvious, would appear to frustrate some also. But at least it gives me plenty to laugh about.

Imagine for a moment if WRBs saved the lives of all people except Maoris. They would be torn down so fast we'd never even realise that they were up in the first place. What makes one "minority" any more important than another?

Putting up a "safety" barrier that increases the risk for one section of the community is descrimination and makes no sense when there is an alternative that improves the safety of all.

[monkeymcbean]

The most effective soluton would be to find a fast cutting tool, and have a cordinated working bee one night...im not being selfish im just a doer.

[swbarnett]

The most effective soluton would be to find a fast cutting tool, and have a cordinated working bee one night...im not being selfish im just a doer.

Sounds like a good idea until you get killed by the wiplash.

[Katman]

Sounds like a good idea until you get killed by the wiplash.

Now that would be irony.

[thealmightytaco]

You miss the point completely. Anyone who complains about the wire barriers because they ride a motorcycle, is just being selfish. Its about making NZ roads safer for everyone and not just a minority here. The fact is that they are here, they are here to stay and no amount of bleating to anyone is going to change this. It is entirely up to you if you continue to try. But all it is likely to do is make you all frustrated the longer it goes on for. Having me here stating the obvious, would appear to frustrate some also. But at least it gives me plenty to laugh about.

You talkin' crazy man, nothing is here to stay. Fart tax was about to be here to stay till someone drove a tractor up the parliament steps, and our rego's were gonna be astronomic till bikoi's etc, reducing them to mere stratospheric. If folks want to let the powers that be know that they things these are lethal to those not in a cage because they forgot to think of that scenario, then so be it.

You've been brainwashed by the system man, like, far out.

And selfish? Ya reckon? If it kills 4 motorcyclists to save one SUV, does that make them okay? That sounds selfish on the part of the SUV to me. And believe it or not, there are options that are safe for all, and that's all anyone's trying to let anyone know.

[monkeymcbean]

Sounds like a good idea until you get killed by the wiplash.

Oh, I must be mis informed, I thought the worse part of these barriers was the steel uprights and how close they are installed, as a motorcyclist sliding into these barriers are more likely to loose limbs on these as you have no way of steering yourself between them, especially sliding in on a angle, I thought in some countries they have now gone after the install and wrapped the uprights in padding of some sort. Of course the wires would be treacherous but is that were the majority of motorcyclists get caught up in if going into them happens?
So by hypothetically suggesting a working bee I meant cutting the steel uprights off at the concrete foundation, thus it might not interfere with the wire tension, infact it would loosen them.

[monkeymcbean]

Okay, its most likely covered here somewhere in all these posts, but I think they can modidfy these wire rope barriers to make them safer for motorcyclist, buy adding a top rail and a runner board along the sides..(broken down simply here), The lake road from Kingston to Queenstown.....oh have they been busy lining almost the entire road to the outside, so stupid dumb drivers aren't in fear of slipping off into the lake. If drivers paid attention to there driving, you are not going to fall off the road, it looks like a babies cot lining the road.
Meanwhile the road surface is left to slump away and be so lumpy from digging up to put wires underneath etc, its terrible.
If it is for tourist sake so they feel 'safer' about travelling the raods well stuff them, my wages rely on them but I'd sooner eat dirt if it come to it than putting up with cheap fucking crap like wire rope barriers installed to pander to a section of people that have not the ability or incline to keep there cars firmly planted on the road. Phew!
I just think it gives people a false sense of security which then leads to slack driving practice and attention. Hmm feel better now!