What's with the lack of gear?

[Oakie]

1. The people who ride around sensibly without any safety gear

Isn't that an oxymoron?

[Raelynn]

Who do you really think costs this country more money?

1. The people who ride around sensibly without any safety gear
OR
2. The people who have all the gear and "push" their riding a little harder.
(hint: number 2)

I'm guessing all you safety nazis at one time or another have ALL done number 2.

Mmm false dichotomies...

in the latest ACC report it said in 75% of motorcycle accidents the rider was not at fault... really, any biker who chooses not to wear gear is the greater cost, no matter the reasons or their IQ, because it's unlikely to be your ~choice~ that you binned.

I guess you could try to argue the rest of the accidents caused by riders are all number 2's, but I would hazard a guess that the connection between "No gear" and "being a retard" are more closely related than any of the other options.

At the end of the day it's blind ignorant cage drivers costing this country money - more if they hit someone who's chosen to not wear gear, not as much if they hit someone wearing some decent protection.

I would fall into a "all gear, all the time" category - I have confidence in ~my~ ability (minus the odd mishap ), but none in 99% of other road users. Isn't that how everyone is taught how to drive/ride these days? Assume everyone else on the road is blind, deaf and stupid?

[breakaway]

I have confidence in ~my~ ability (minus the odd mishap ), but none in 99% of other road users.

Yep. I really get a bad case of the shits when I have to stop quickly - I just start praying that the guy behind me is paying attention and doesn't shunt me.

[sunhuntin]

in the summer, and on nice winter days, i often ride around town with nothing more than jeans, helmet and fingerless gloves. the rest of me is covered in either a tshirt or singlet and sneakers.

i have come off once after being hit by a car that ran a stop sign. i was wearing:

steelcap cowboy boots
socks
jeans
singlet
helmet [open face]
sunglasses.

i hit her front right and sailed over her bonnet. i dont remember hitting the ground, but i must have done. rolled a few times and came to a rest on my back. i got to my feet very quick, though with pain, and took my helmet off. my givi topbox missed my head by less than a meter [it came off the racking, as did my back pack, which was sitting on her bonnet. it had been bunjied to the racking.] the box had all my kit in it: jacket, fingerless gloves etc.

it has been 2 years this month. my upper body came away with a small knick on the knuckle of my thumb. my lower body didnt fare so well.

my lower left leg, the jeans were shredded, and my skin was scraped up. my right knee left an impressive dent in the tank and swelled up bad. my sunglasses lens popped out, which was easily remedied.
i was carted to hospital against my wishes [wanted to go to work] where i was xrayed and my left leg put in a cast. the wound on that leg was NOT dressed prior to the cast going on. my swollen right knee was then left to support almost all of my weight.
2 weeks later, i went back to hosp for a check up. cast was cut off, and the bandage over the wound had almost been grown over. i was re xrayed, and the decision was the lens must have had a hair on it.

so, therefore, taxpayers money was wasted for a simple hair on the lens. it was not a lack of gear that caused my injuries. i would have been fine to work, maybe not that day, but a few days later.

my right knee was not even looked at by medics, and even as i type, it is aching from lack of movement and the cold. i am 22, and it will only get worse.

i escaped any major injury despite a major lack of gear, so no one can say that someone not wearing "proper" gear will come away badly hurt or worse. i am living, riding, proof of that.

btw, yesterday i went from levin to southwards in jeans and a sweatshirt just for shits and giggles. guess what? im still alive.

[Ixion]

The most Commonly Sensible people I know wear army greatcoats, gaiters, and cork helmets.

Neither speed nor accident has exploded them, despite the Governmental policy that speed shall kill, and the manufacturers propaganda that only leather, kevlar, and lorica styled armour shall provide the necessary protection to prevent all and any damage in the event of a bin m'lud.
..

Did someone mention greatcoats and gaiters. Did y'all notice the dude on Trademe selling most excellent oilskin greatcoats - I shall certainly buy one. And y'all know where to get gaiters, from your friendly Army Surplus store in K Rd, opposite the billboard of the chick with the titanic tits- can't miss them.

As to the 'wah wah you'll cost ACC ' argument. I pay ACC around $2000 a year for the privilege of being insured. So if I am injured, I've paid my way, so piss off. And I pay a shitload more in tax (and then have to pay for private medical insurance on top of that!) to cover not only my own hospital costs, but yours too. So double piss off.

[Usarka]

in the latest ACC report it said in 75% of motorcycle accidents the rider was not at fault... really, any biker who chooses not to wear gear is the greater cost, no matter the reasons or their IQ, because it's unlikely to be your ~choice~ that you binned.

Any chance of linking to that report? i seem to remember that was in relation to multi-vehicle accidents and didnt include single vehicle stats.

[pritch]

Before I had proper gear I didn't miss it. Always wore at least jeans and a jacket though. Normally I wear boots, and a jacket with armour for the daily commute but some of those work trousers are not very robust. Now I feel rather exposed if I'm not wearing the proper protection.

Was sitting in a column of traffic waiting for a green light today and kid went past on a scooter. Wrong side of the road, on the back wheel, sweatshirt, shorts and shoes, no gloves.

I wish him luck, he needs rather more than he should.

Nice style though

[jigyjig]

its inevitable, once a month, someone will see someone riding who just doesnt give a fuck what the majority of you pc riders think wearing jeans an a t shirt smoking a ciggy, cold beer between the legs, texting away on his phone,

sure he / she might crash an injure 4 people, maybe 10! but this is once a week / month occurence not every hour,

think of the smokers, think of the fat ass's at the local fish an chip shop think of the people drinking at the pub,

shit loads more people causing shit loads more damage that you the goody two shoes pc tax payer are going to have to pay for,

motorcyclists not wearing gear? not breaking the law, not your problem. FUCK OFF.

[ambler]

the idea that anyone should have to pay for somebody else's medical bills at all is wack
perhaps we should pay for each others life insurance as well?

there is no way to truly 'live and let live' while we are digging into each others pockets.

[discotex]

Yep. I really get a bad case of the shits when I have to stop quickly - I just start praying that the guy behind me is paying attention and doesn't shunt me.

I always glance in my mirror when braking. Especially when braking hard!

opposite the billboard of the chick with the titanic tits- can't miss them.

That's such a landmark that billboard eh. Wonder if it's listed as heritage?

think of the smokers, think of the fat ass's at the local fish an chip shop think of the people drinking at the pub,

shit loads more people causing shit loads more damage that you the goody two shoes pc tax payer are going to have to pay for,

Exactly. Everyone does shit that ends up costing everyone else. It generally evens out in the end. Short of ditching the public health system and ACC and going to full private insurance there's not much you can do about it.

[jigyjig]

the idea that anyone should have to pay for somebody else's medical bills at all is wack
perhaps we should pay for each others life insurance as well?

through paying life insurance premiums you are contributing towards my replacement motorcycle i crashed, riding drunk. thank you.

maybe your not as smart as your mum told you

[swbarnett]

I guess this means then that you also respect the right of the next car driver who changes lanes and knocks you off to walk away as well.

If you'd read what I said you'd realise that I was talking about situations where the only person to get hurt was the one making the decision.

Spare me the the individual freedom crap, thats only an argument when no one else is affected by an individuals actions.

Sorry if I didn't explain in clearly enough but this is exactly my point. Where no one else is affected let them make their own choices.

Fact is the dick heads who dress like this, ride and have accidents are affecting the rest of us. They are affecting your insurance, your ACC levies, your taxes, and the availability of medical treatment for those who actually deserve it, and you never know, that might be your one day.

OK, you want no more motorcycling at all (with or without gear)? No car driving either? No getting out of bed in the morning (you might trip up)?

[ambler]

through paying life insurance premiums you are contributing towards my replacement motorcycle i crashed, riding drunk. thank you.

maybe your not as smart as your mum told you

The point is that life insurance is optional.
I don't have any life insurance, but if I was paying for a policy which supported 'smart' people who crash their bikes while drunk, I have the choice to dump it. ACC doesn't give you that option.

[swbarnett]

True, but part of riding is that we accept we are much more vulnerable than car drivers and we mitigate that danger by wearing appropriate gear in the same way that car drivers are supposed to mitigate their danger by wearing a seatbelt. I wouldn't tell another motorcyclist what to wear unless they asked ... but I do have the right to go "tut tut" to myself when I see someone wantonly exposing their body to additional and unneccesary harm.

Even riding with gear carries a greater risk than car driving. By your reasoning this is enough reason to ban it.

[swbarnett]

That would be fine. Except when they come off they expect ME to pay for expensive stuff like Ambulances, A & E's, trauma units and skin grafts. Why the hell should I if they are too stupid to do the right thing in the first place.

This is actually one of the points I was trying to make. Don't tell someone what to do because you won't pay for it. Just don't pay for it.

Lots and lots of people bleat on about "personal freedom" and all that shit, but concomitant to that is "personal responsibility": the obverse of the coin if you will.

Exactly, "PERSONAL" responsibility. I'm not responsible for you and you're not responsible for me.

Sure, be a tool, dont wear a helmet, eye protection. In fact you can pull a wheelie at 150 kph wearing only a divers mask and a pink G string, and your ballet slippers. Just dont expect me to pick up the pieces if it all goes to shit.

I wouldn't.

People thing "Oh the gummint will sort it out" or "the gummint will pay"... hospital care for the terminally stupid? not on my dime.

Who's to say what's stupid and what's not?