Fines wiped if biker buys 'dorky' helmet

[mstriumph]

................. But if it were me in the judges seat id have not budged an inch,..........

if it had been ANY of us in the judge's seat, methinks, we wouldn't have budged an inch .......

can anyone please explain to me why normal folk like thee and me are so much wiser,more intelligent, more JUST than those whose robe-clad bums warm the judicial benches?

do you have to have an IQ smaller than your shoe size to qualify?

[davereid]

John and Dave, I have only read your posts, I don't know you in "real life" but normally agree and see experience and wisdon in your writing. I agree about the nanny state etc etc but there is so much you lose your brain for and so much to lose to gain what? Bugs in your eyes and the feeling that your "stickin' it to the man"?

If you want to have the occaisional blat with no helmet I'm sure you'll find a little spot for doing it but for general riding with Mr I'm texting my mrs and all the girls changing the stereo and applying their eye-liner don't you think the perceived or real hassles of wearing a helmet are a small price to pay for a way higher chance of saving your mental faculties?

Hi Pancakes... all very valid points, I absolutely accept that wearing a helmet improves your odds.

As they say, Lies damn lies and statistics. So, we don't really know what the facts are. But this may be relevant...

- The Scuffham report found cycle helmets to be a waste of money. But lets assume it was wrong, and motorcycle data could be used.

- Per vehicle miles traveled, motorcyclists are about 21 times as likely as passenger car occupants to die in a traffic crash and four times as likely to be injured. (NHTSA, 2001)

- Helmets reduce the risk of death by 29% and are 67% effective in preventing brain injuries to motorcycle riders. (NHTSA, 2001)

So lets revise the figures to use the same multipliers, rather than emotive ones.

Riding without a helmet increases your chance of death by 1.29.
Riding without a helmet increases your chance of head injury by 1.67.
Riding a motorcycle increases your chances of death by 21.

Having made the decision to ride a motorcycle, I have already made the dumbest decision I will ever make. The helmet decision... merely petty cash by comparison.

So yes, I agree helmets help. So do lights on laws, pink flouro jackets, and hp restrictions. But by miles, the solution is to ban motorcycles.

Data from...http://www.saferoads.org/issues/fs-helmets.htm

[madandy]

Yep. No problem with different sets of rules based on experience and skill. IQ rating would be handy too.
Stupid? - Yes - compulsory everything.
Half a brain - follow the guidelines - or else.
Alpha - well, you inderstand - off you shoot.

I don't really care about the rest of the population. I think the Spartans had the right idea and fully support Darwinism.

That is the exact same set of ideals I have submitted to parliament several times with regard to 'boy racer' legislation and its impact on legitmate users of moddified motorvehicles.

One difference I see is you're arguing with me on an internet forum and I've already had a crack at the rule makers. Perhaps, in your positionyou have too, I don't know.
Do some research and you'll learn there are some major obstacles in front of those of us who'd like to improve the transport environment.
History is full of interesting events resulting from the 'one set of rules for us - another set of rules for you' mentality.

I don't enjoy being labelled as a nanny state supporter.

I ignore plenty of nanny's rules.

If I'm still around these traps, moaning about nanny this & nanny that and still dreaming of having my own set of rules because I'm so fucking pefrect on my bike in another 34 years of riding I'll consider my time on earth a complete waste.

[davereid]

History is full of interesting events resulting from the 'one set of rules for us - another set of rules for you' mentality.

That Andy, is the essence of government, and the cause of all war and conflict.

You see, when 3 mongrels, and 1 chick discuss the sleeping arrangements, and its decided that the majority can use force to take what is needed from the minority for the benefit of the greater good, somehow we understand that to be gang rape, and we know it is wrong.

But when Government uses force to make non violent, non threatening people do things they don't want to do, for the greater good, we call it Tax or Safety. Then its OK. Apparently.

[madandy]

Hi Pancakes... all very valid points, I absolutely accept that wearing a helmet improves your odds.

As they say, Lies damn lies and statistics. So, we don't really know what the facts are. But this may be relevant...

- The Scuffham report found cycle helmets to be a waste of money. But lets assume it was wrong, and motorcycle data could be used.

- Per vehicle miles traveled, motorcyclists are about 21 times as likely as passenger car occupants to die in a traffic crash and four times as likely to be injured. (NHTSA, 2001)

- Helmets reduce the risk of death by 29% and are 67% effective in preventing brain injuries to motorcycle riders. (NHTSA, 2001)

So lets revise the figures to use the same multipliers, rather than emotive ones.

Riding without a helmet increases your chance of death by 1.29.
Riding without a helmet increases your chance of head injury by 1.67.
Riding a motorcycle increases your chances of death by 21.

Having made the decision to ride a motorcycle, I have already made the dumbest decision I will ever make. The helmet decision... merely petty cash by comparison.

So yes, I agree helmets help. So do lights on laws, pink flouro jackets, and hp restrictions. But by miles, the solution is to ban motorcycles.

Data from...http://www.saferoads.org/issues/fs-helmets.htm

I'd love to see the test criteria for the Scuffham test. Under the wheel of a truck? I've had pleny of bike crashes where a simple, properly fitted, quality helmet has prevented trauma - though I cannot claim to have cheated death as a result of wearing such a device.
I'd lay cash on table to say that those statistics are ignoring the many deaths caused by massive impact to the body, blood loss etc and not reflecting the head only related deaths, and non deaths directly attributable to helmet use.
Yes motorcycling can be dangerous and yes most injuries and deaths would not have been stopped by wearing a helmet, but I know there's a lot of lives saved that'd have not been had a helmet not been worn - due to the nature of the impact.

Perhaps the most realistic solution is to stop idiots riding bikes?

[madandy]

That Andy, is the essence of government, and the cause of all war and conflict.

You see, when 3 mongrels, and 1 chick discuss the sleeping arrangements, and its decided that the majority can use force to take what is needed from the minority for the benefit of the greater good, somehow we understand that to be gang rape, and we know it is wrong.

But when Government uses force to make non violent, non threatening people do things they don't want to do, for the greater good, we call it Tax or Safety. Then its OK. Apparently.

I just don't see all the things I'm not allowed to do...or all the things I'm forced to do for the greater good. Sure Taxes bite and I don't enjoy funding the ciggarette habit of the fat, low brow bitch next to my wife in the maternity ward tonight .
Maybe I need to get out more and witness all the oppression against the hard working people who'd enjoy greater liberties.

[Big Dave]

Yeah - my dues are paid.