Reply from MP Harry Duynhoven

[avgas]

Never trust someone who gets paid to lie.

[Ocean1]

I don't think it's really necessary to test the bleedingly obvious, & overseas research is quite clear that WRB = bad news. What I reckon we need is when the next politician/bureaucrat comes out with that "WRB are no more dangerous to motorcyclists than other barriers" bollocks, show them a pic of a concrete barrier, and a wire rope barrier, ask them to imagine they're on a motorcycle doing 30 km/h, wearing full protective gear & they're going to hit one of these barriers at a 30 degree angle. Which one would they rather have?

It's a bit of a no-brainer really, so even politicians & bureaucrats should get it.

Cheers
Clint

I believe test data concentrates mainly on impact angles of some 15 deg. No less dangerous from a rider’s perspective, but apparently an angle representative of most impacts.

But I like the idea of a wee local experiment, lots of potential for publicity, pic’s of bits of machinery and sheep carcases all over the six o’clock news? Brilliant!

[ManDownUnder]

Never trust someone gets paid to lie.

I felt my ears burning... what're you hint... ooooo you mean Harry.

... ok...

[clint640]

Sorry, O Delusional One. They would deny the noses on their faces if their staff told them to....

Well, they might not 'get' it, but it would be fun watching them try to explain why they would rather hit a WRB instead of the concrete equivalent:

"well actually, I'd rather be dismembered on a cheesecutter because otherwise the massive budget surplus might be decimated by the approx 50c per capita needed to install something safer"

Clint

[Ocean1]

approx 50c per capita needed to install something safer"

Clint

You have budget numbers?

[clint640]

You have budget numbers?

No, that was just a rough guess based on the around $20/m extra that concrete costs x say 100km of barrier built per year (way high probably) divided by 4M people.

Clint

[Ocean1]

No, that was just a rough guess based on the around $20/m extra that concrete costs x say 100km of barrier built per year (way high probably) divided by 4M people.

Clint

I think materials costs are likely to be only a small component of the installed costs. Unsubstantiated romour has WRB costs at $700,000/K, far in excess of the price of the posts and wire. Be real nice to lay our hands on actual numbers. I've also heard LTNZ indicate that installation time is a factor, with concrete closing roads for too long, I'd be keen to consider finding solutions to that issue.

[Nasty]

I think materials costs are likely to be only a small component of the installed costs. Unsubstantiated romour has WRB costs at $700,000/K, far in excess of the price of the posts and wire. Be real nice to lay our hands on actual numbers. I've also heard LTNZ indicate that installation time is a factor, with concrete closing roads for too long, I'd be keen to consider finding solutions to that issue.

Which is interesting ... as they close roads for huge lengths of time installing the WRBs ... concrete they can develop off site and install at speed onsite.

[Swoop]

Never trust someone who gets paid to lie.

You can always tell when a politician is lying... their lips move.


Why is it that Die'nhoven has to get fuggin' consultants in? Is his department that incompetent, or is it for the normal reasons of gubbinment putting up a secondary layer of protection (like DHB's) to avoid public scorn??

[Ocean1]

Which is interesting ... as they close roads for huge lengths of time installing the WRBs ... concrete they can develop off site and install at speed onsite.

Do you think I'd be interested in offering hideously overpriced project or design solutions for really really difficult problems?

[avgas]

After working with them on a few jobs......i wouldnt let their design engineers lay a gravel driveway.
Sorry if you do have this job, but i doubt any motorcyclist would cut corners off a road.

[Pixie]

I sent this email to Harriet Dynhoven:

Dear Minister

I read your letter to Mr Allison regarding Motorcyclists' concern over dangerous road barriers.This seems to be ,in a phrase Labour Party members love so much,a flipflop on the assurances our representative at the Labour party conference was given.
I will be advising all my Biker associates of your party's attitudes to this issue.

Yours
Paul Girardin

The text as posted follows:

Dear Mr Allison

Thank you for your email of date 2007, to the Prime Minister Helen Clark in which you express concern about the dangers posed to motorcyclists and other road users by wire rope median barriers (WRMB).....etc

[Pixie]

Could we stage a sort of "Mythbusters" test by throwing a dummy at a WRB and a concrete barrier at say 80km/h and compare the results? Just a thought.

That is a great idea.But don't use dummies,pig carcases would be better as they behave like a human body.Make sure they have not been gutted prior to the test.

[Beeza]

Harry Duynhoven, even though he's apparently a motorcyclist, has about as much courage to press ahead ANY motorcycling cause past his Labour cabinet colleagues as what a solitary pilchard has in a tank full of great white sharks.

Duynhoven is NOT the man you want on your side if you're going into battle. He's a milksop.

[yungatart]

I believe test data concentrates mainly on impact angles of some 15 deg. No less dangerous from a rider’s perspective, but apparently an angle representative of most impacts.

But I like the idea of a wee local experiment, lots of potential for publicity, pic’s of bits of machinery and sheep carcases all over the six o’clock news? Brilliant!

Can I suggest, that for maximum impact, this be done on the Friday at about 4.30/5 ish of Wellington anniversary w/e. It could be followed with the same stunt the next w/e, in Auckland.......at the very least you should have a captive audience of cagers as they leave the city in droves for their long weekends.