Insurance companies and leaving your keys in the ignition

**Matt_TG** · 15th December 2007, 15:29

IF you believe the ISO to be impartial take your concern to a Disputes Tribunal. I've been involved in many DT hearings, and found the outcome to be equitable.

As someone who sees things from both sides of the fence, I do see many people who screw insurers for more than they are entitled to. Others just can't seem to get what they are allowed.

I don't handle vehicle claims however the principles of insurance are the same.

**Tomcat** · 15th December 2007, 16:42

You gotta be jokin. 99% of us leave keys in the car when we fill up at a gas station???!! No way. That is asking for trouble. It is all about taking reasonbale care and that means don't make it easy for theives! People who leave keys in cars and then get the vehicle stolen should not moan about it as it is their fault. By simply turning the vehicle off and slipping the keys in your pocket can prevent a lot of heartache after. To throw out threats if an insurance company won't pay out is a bit rough. The first line of defence is taking care of your property and that certainly means don't leave keys in the ignition when you elave your vehicle. There are opportunistic thieves everywhere looking for an easy picking.

**Tomcat** · 15th December 2007, 17:30

We wonder why we pay high premiums?! I am sorry but if you leave the keys in your car and your car gets nicked whose fault is it? Would you leave your keys in your bike if you pulled into a service station and walk away from it. Feel sorry for your mate but c'mon isn't leaving keys in the ignition and walking away asking for trouble. All I know is the world is full of opportunistic thieves so why help them out? It is all about reasonable care, taking care of your property. Is leaving keys in the ignition taking reasonable care? Nope, don't think so. Simply by turning off the engine and slippin those keys into the pocket can save a lot of heartaches, simple as that. Then of coursde we want insurance to poay for our d gross stupidity. Then it affects us all with higher premiums and so on it rolls.

**HenryDorsetCase** · 15th December 2007, 17:46

Im of the "alwayst take the keys out school" too.

but isnt the point of insurance to cover negligence, including your own?

**Edbear** · 15th December 2007, 17:54

Originally Posted by HenryDorsetCase

..but isnt the point of insurance to cover negligence, including your own?

Umm! No.

**dmouse** · 15th December 2007, 19:23

we all end up paying higher premiums if insurance throw our money away to people who dont care or look after there property insurance is there to cover risks not mistakes

**shifter** · 16th December 2007, 08:50

my owners manual,at no stage does it mention removing the key from the ignition when leaving the machine.Now i can only assume that this is the case for all vehicles.Maybe the car/bike manufacturer is at fault?

I do wonder why them fitted an ignition switch when clearly it wasn't meant to be used.I am going to send mine back hoping to get a refund.

**sAsLEX** · 16th December 2007, 09:48

I know that a NC30 can be hotwired in about 2 seconds, does this make me culpable when I take the keys but have left the steering lock off and it gets nicked?

**Mikkel** · 16th December 2007, 10:02

Hmmm, he didn't actually leave the keys in the ignition of his bike did he? Wasn't it the keys for the car that was left behind?

(and yes, this is an irrelevant observation)

As for the "99% of us leave the keys in the ignition when paying for petrol" I think this thread clearly illustrates that it isn't true.
I certainly never does that - and at times I might even lock my car...

Besides, it doesn't matter if you only walk a few feet with the vehicle being in sight if you're not keeping an eye on it...

It is very sad that you have to take these measures these days, that we can not just trust our fellow beings to leave our stuff alone (and perhaps even care for it if necessary) - but let's wake up and smell the coffee. Theft is common as is a lot of other crime, failing to realise this is almost certain to cause you grief at some stage.
Personally, I'm on with the muslims on how to punish theft - I'm sure it isn't very funny stealing an X-Box if you only have one hand!

**Shaun** · 16th December 2007, 10:04

Originally Posted by sAsLEX

I know that a NC30 can be hotwired in about 2 seconds, does this make me culpable when I take the keys but have left the steering lock off and it gets nicked?

READ THE LINK HERE

There is case law regarding this type of issue.

It comes down to calculating the risk of threat and negligence.

The linked document below raises some areas your friend may wish to pursue...

Insurance Ombudsman Ruling - TERMS IN INSURANCE POLICIES REQUIRING INSUREDS
TO TAKE REASONABLE CARE

**Shaun** · 16th December 2007, 10:06

SORRY< READ THIS LINK FOR YOUR OPINION

Originally Posted by Matt_TG

There is case law regarding this type of issue.

It comes down to calculating the risk of threat and negligence.

The linked document below raises some areas your friend may wish to pursue...

Insurance Ombudsman Ruling - TERMS IN INSURANCE POLICIES REQUIRING INSUREDS
TO TAKE REASONABLE CARE

In summary -

When considering claims that appear to have been caused by the carelessness of the
insured, if the policy includes a reasonable care clause insurers have the burden of proving
that the insured’s conduct amounted to at least gross negligence.

Claims that appear to have been caused or contributed to by the carelessness of the insured
need to be scrutinised and investigated with a careful eye to detail before decisions are made
to deny liability on the basis of reasonable care conditions.

**sAsLEX** · 16th December 2007, 10:16

Originally Posted by Mikkel

Personally, I'm on with the muslims on how to punish theft - I'm sure it isn't very funny stealing an X-Box if you only have one hand!

Most thieves are repeat offenders........

**Usarka** · 16th December 2007, 10:19

Originally Posted by Tomcat

I am sorry but if you leave the keys in your car and your car gets nicked whose fault is it?

it's the thiefs fault dumbarse.

**Shaun** · 16th December 2007, 10:37

PLEASE STOP TELEPHONEING ME

I started this as I said a wee bit back, JUST to try and wise any one up that may ---k up and forget to remove there keys

What I have said on here in some posts is way to much, and not professional nor wise for me and my future ( But Principals do matter to me)

Maybe I should stay off the internet and stay away from people for a while longer untill I fix my head issues since my crash 6 months ago?

I WILL NOT BE RE POSTING ABOUT ANYTHING TO DO WITH CASE ANYMORE APART FROM OFFERING APPOLOGIES THAT I MAY NEED TO?????????????

**scumdog** · 16th December 2007, 10:37

Originally Posted by Shaun

After all, he really loved his bike, and did not leave the keys for some one to steal his car and bike for him, he honestly thought that he was safe in a place like a petrol station, which normally have security camera's every where

Not too many thefts actually prevented merely by a security camera being present.