Bike out of commission

**JWALKER** · 11th February 2008, 06:28

i agree. as far as i know i don't have any enemies in christchurch who would do that to me. i have some quite big disagreements with a couple of people, but even i know, they would not do something like that.
there was roughly a week, from when i got my service done to when the back brake went, and only did two long trips, one to diamond harbour and a cruisey pace and one to akaroa, where it was failing on the way back

**wofman** · 11th February 2008, 06:51

it is unlikeley it is oil in the brake lines not impossible . but if you have got the bike at another shop you need to get them to right a report stateing what they have found as this will come in handy if you take it to court.also get a test done on the fluid . an independent inspection,talk to the shop who did the brake job and take notes .keep a file of every thing you find out no matter how small the info is .the more info you have for your clame the better it is for you.as to oil in the lines it takes some time to do this on most bikes .differint types of brake fluid can cause similar problems , you need to be certin be for you start to action against any one for this problem.
hope it can get sorted quickley

**Grub** · 11th February 2008, 08:28

Originally Posted by JWALKER

also, i think they are going to make me pay, to fix up trhis incident, which im not very impressed about

Given the amount of work it takes to get the cover off, get brake fluid out of the resevoir and add the oil, this cannot be sabotage. It just can't. Therefore it was the shop. Of course they're going to say all of those things.

If they don't accept responsibility I would talk to whoever the crown agency is that monitors stuff like this - would it be the Labour Dept maybe? I'm also wondering about the agency that licences shops who do WoF (used to be called MotorSafe).

I'd firstly chat to the agencies anonymously to estalish what they can/can't do about it, find the one that has the power and then tell the shop that if they don't make it right, you will call in the regulatory agencies. As someone said this is negligence causing death type stuff ... it's serious. One of the other things to consider is that you (or the agency) may need to get to your bike real quick because the evidence needs protecting

**NinjaNanna** · 11th February 2008, 08:58

Originally Posted by wofman

differint types of brake fluid can cause similar problems

Now it looks like we could be getting to the truth of the matter. I would investigate this comment as best I could, if I were you.

Try emailing some of the Brake Fluid manufacturers to see if you can get comment on whether mixing 2 different types of Brake fluid can cause failure of the system.

If it is indeed possible then it could be a simple as the apprentice putting in DOT5 fluid instead of DOT4 - now that would certainly be excusable and vindicate both yourself and the bike shop.

**Mikkel** · 11th February 2008, 10:17

Yeah, what NinjaNanna is saying is very reasonable indeed.

There are quite big differences between different DOT ratings on brake fluids. I'd go and have a chat with the manager again and tell him matter of factly (and calmly) that you believe they have made an honest mistake. If he's not willing to even consider the possibility ask him what he think has happened - how this thing could have come about. Unless he has something a bit more insightful than "they're out to get ya" I'd tell him that you'll take legal advice on the matter - and that no matter what happens, word gets around. Chch is not that big and there are plenty of other bikeshops.

Oh, and it's always worthwhile having a chat to other mechanics and ask for their professional opinion on the matter (of course leaving out the bikeshops name). And even better if you can get a written and signed statement from one.

**steveb64** · 11th February 2008, 23:55

Originally Posted by JWALKER

i agree. as far as i know i don't have any enemies in christchurch who would do that to me. i have some quite big disagreements with a couple of people, but even i know, they would not do something like that.
there was roughly a week, from when i got my service done to when the back brake went, and only did two long trips, one to diamond harbour and a cruisey pace and one to akaroa, where it was failing on the way back

Sounds like the bike shop fcuked up. If they topped up your reservoir after changing the pads, then the time scale you mention would be just about the right amount of time for the oil to work it's way out of the master cylinder, and into the rest of the system...

And I've had my brakes (in an old Fiat 125) stuffed up due to oil being put in the system - thanks to Continental Cars in Wellington! Long time (~20 years!) ago now - but I NEVER went back for any more service work. Damn apprentices.

Good luck with getting it sorted...

**JWALKER** · 12th February 2008, 22:09

you cant but help stick your opionon in, can you D?.
the stone incident, i will ignore your comment.

me put oil in my brake lines?, to be honest i would not even know how too.
i said i didnt think that it was set up and the only person who i would have even considered to do that is YOU.

i will put the shops name up, once i get my bike back. how about you go along to sportzone yourself and see the oil they drained out of the bike?, cause its sitting there right now and im sure chris would be happy to show you it happened or you want to hide behind your computer and spat off your little opinons.

tell me what kind of person logs in under a friends login on another bike forum and then starts writting stuff up to insult other members?, i would see that as a coward, what you reckon D?

**JWALKER** · 12th February 2008, 22:11

Originally Posted by steveb64

Sounds like the bike shop fcuked up. If they topped up your reservoir after changing the pads, then the time scale you mention would be just about the right amount of time for the oil to work it's way out of the master cylinder, and into the rest of the system...

And I've had my brakes (in an old Fiat 125) stuffed up due to oil being put in the system - thanks to Continental Cars in Wellington! Long time (~20 years!) ago now - but I NEVER went back for any more service work. Damn apprentices.

Good luck with getting it sorted...

i was thinking the same thing. but, will be hard to prove

**dangerous** · 13th February 2008, 05:12

Originally Posted by JWALKER

me put oil in my brake lines?, to be honest i would not even know how too.
i said i didnt think that it was set up and the only person who i would have even considered to do that is YOU.
hide behind your computer and spat off your little opinons.

tell me what kind of person logs in under a friends login on another bike forum and then starts writting stuff up to insult other members?, i would see that as a coward, what you reckon D?

Me... you think that I would do such a thing? you are a tinnie short of a 6 pack man, if i was of that sort of nature then I wouldnt have been the only person to help you out when you last fell off, I would have watched just like the others did.

Theres something very dodgy with this thread and the brake thing man, use ya old warlock skills to sort it out.

I dont hide 'behind' any computer I hide infront of it ya nit... I shoot from the hip you know that.

If refering to me and posting under a friends login... not me mate I dont have any friends

Now sort the bike, dont fuk with the brakes, TIE and go ride

ps: to be able to replace the fluid with oil, it would take some time, the fluid would need bleeding out and the oil bleeding in anotherwords no fuker set you up man.

**JWALKER** · 13th February 2008, 06:21

D - i agree, i don't think someone set me up, i believe a mistake was made when the brake fluid was put into my back brakes at the service, i don't think it was deliberate, just a mistake, but i am having a hard time convincing the bike shop of that

**JWALKER** · 13th February 2008, 06:32

Originally Posted by dangerous

Me... you think that I would do such a thing? you are a tinnie short of a 6 pack man, if i was of that sort of nature then I wouldnt have been the only person to help you out when you last fell off, I would have watched just like the others did.

i know we argue on here, but, when i really thought about it, even i know you would not do that. i don't think i have enemies to do that.

yes, you did help me out with the bike when i came off and i really appreciate and once again say thank you for being there and helping.

**gav** · 14th February 2008, 20:11

I think you may need to replace the seals in the caliper etc as the oil may have caused them to swell. A straight flush may not be enough.

**The Boss** · 16th February 2008, 12:43

There has been some speculation of late that a job performed by Sportzone Suzuki on the rear brake system of J Walkers GSX-R600 has ended up with the brake lines being filled with engine oil rather than brake fluid by our workshop staff.

Both the front and rear brakes were serviced by Sportzone at exactly the same time by one of our very experienced mechanics (we don’t have any apprentices here) and J Walker has since done eight hundred and fifty kilometres.

J Walker has then bought the bike in to us to have his rear brake checked as he believed there was a problem with them. When we investigated, we found that someone had put engine oil into his rear brake system. We checked his front brakes, and discovered that the front system had no trace of engine oil and they work perfectly.

The idea that Sportzone has had anything to do with this problem is unacceptable, and it is important for the motorcycling public to understand that there is no way this kind of mistake could happen in our workshop. The process of obtaining engine oil from our 44 gallon drum into a large jug and pouring it into a very small rear brake master cylinder (which is tucked away inside the frames perimeter and located directly beneath a fairing) would be a very awkward act to perform, and the level of difficulty in performing this act would only be tolerated by someone who was intentionally wanting to put oil into the cylinder.

A new 500ml bottle of brake fluid is opened for each bike when all pads are to be changed. The price sticker of this bottle is removed placed on the job card, as it has been in this case, to ensure the customer is charged for this.

The technical experts from our oils supplier advise us that it is EXTREMELY unlikely that the brake seals would last 850 kms before swelling of the brakes seals and binding of the brakes would occur, and that the oil would likely have been fed into the lines well into the 850 kms.

If Sportzone had somehow managed to do something like this, I would have absolutely no issue with paying for the repairs and would accept full responsibility for the mistake. Let me state for the record however, that Sportzone has had no part in putting oil in any brake system ever, and the procedures in the workshop are there to make sure this will never happen.

It is always tempting to make assumptions on issues we hear about, and I think everyone does this from time to time, but the consequences of accusing an innocent party of something is extremely unfair. We accept that J Walker has not been a part of the rumours that are circulating. We would also like to make it clear that J Walker is a good customer and we feel for him in this situation, but we cannot accept responsibility for something that has definitely not occurred in our workshop. We would appreciate it if the speculation by people who have not had anything to do with this situation to stop please.

**dangerous** · 16th February 2008, 12:51

I dont think anyone has thought your shop did this... I would think JWalker did it himself by mistake or some how a mate of his ballsed up.
Now Joe (I asume) was this oil just floating in the res or had it been pumped right through the system (this would take time) how do the two fluids mix?
If the oil was poured into the res I expect it would not make it to the brakes un less bleed through?

**karla** · 16th February 2008, 15:21

Originally Posted by The Boss

There has been some speculation of late that a job performed by Sportzone Suzuki ...
....
A new 500ml bottle of brake fluid is opened for each bike when all pads are to be changed. The price sticker of this bottle is removed placed on the job card, as it has been in this case, to ensure the customer is charged for this.

Good to hear that your workshop has proceedures in place to alleviate human error, and to see that you have taken the time to present the other side of the story.

Is it possible that the bottle of oil that was used when the brakes were done could have been tampered with, or could have been filled with incorrect oil? Making this an outside mistake rather than an inside job.

If you only used one 500ml bottle to do both back and front brakes then both the front and back brakes would have been contaminated.

Leaving us with the unthinkable possibility of deliberate sabotage or as D says, a ballsup.