Poll: Learner speed restriction change?

**Mikkel** · 21st February 2008, 16:43

Originally Posted by FROSTY

Ive been thinking a lot about this today.
Learner licence -nahh cant change my mind about the whole its a licence to learn not a licence to go out doing what you want to --as such the time restrictions make sense and the speed limit makes sense BUT
There should be NO qualifying time before you can sit a restricted licence.
In other words if you can demonstrate you have the riding skills needed to ride a bike competantly then why should you be stopped doing so?
Mind you I'm also an advocate for the whole HP as oposed to CC restriction too.
That would make bike pricing more reasonable for a learner removing the insanely inflated pricing thats on 250's
In my opinion a GS500/goose350/gb400/gpz500/etc is a heck of a lot more inteligent learner bike than a prillia 250 or a RGV250 etc

Ah well - that is something I can agree with, mostly at least. Make the tests for R and F difficult enough that you could say - go for your test when you want. If you pass, you pass and it's all good. If you never develop good enough skills to get the F license you'll never be allowed to ride an insanely fast bike...

However, as far as the power restrictions go. I'm one of the hoons on a fast 250 ccm - it's still not as fast as our car and you'd be allowed to drive that on your 1L... Dunno about the high strung 250 2-strokes - but the ZXR250 has been a lovely learners bike. It's fast enough not to be dull - but you have to really crank it up before it delivers anything. Riding it at low revs it's very docile and easy to manage. It's fairly light and agile and a lot of fun. IMHO you learn faster when you're having fun. So I would be very much opposed to banning them for learners. You could however introduce a hp limitation based on age of the licensee, e.g.:

15-18: <25 hps
18-20: <30 hps
20-25: <40 hps
25-?: Anything that is 250 ccm or less.

And then I think you could up the ccm restriction to 400 ccm for 6R while keeping these hp-limits in place. Just a thought.

**roy.nz** · 21st February 2008, 17:16

Hell yeay it should be changed because you become more of a hazard riding at 70.It should be 100.

**TKDSKIP** · 21st February 2008, 19:19

The new biker on a leaner licence should most certainly have restrictions place on what they ride (hp instead of cc rating). But 70km/h is dangerous in certain situations, how can you be allowed on the motorway legally with your new leaner licence at this speed. I believe that the BHS test should incorperate a speed test (how fast does a GN125 go). Not simply "are you happy putting along in second gear at idle" but can you really handle a motorbike up to 250cc in real world situations. These would include travel at a safe speed for your enviroment which most certainly isnt 70km/h on the open road.

**Zuki Bandit** · 21st February 2008, 19:22

It really dosent stress me out to much. Im not planning to stay on my learners longer than I have to.

**Toaster** · 21st February 2008, 19:56

Originally Posted by Jantar

I have seen this mentioned on kiwibiker a few times now. Where is written in the rules or in any official policy? And how is anyone living in a rural area supposed to learn?

Quite simple, people have to work with the rules, not against them. That's where using ones brain and getting creative comes into the equation. And if you can't take back roads (like I did) then you need to ride in the 100km/h zones with great care (great care... now that's a novel approach to motorcycling).

**justsomeguy** · 22nd February 2008, 01:21

The rule was designed to keep learners off motorways until they had 6 months experience.

Simple.

I think the old farts can apply sooner, can't remember the details.

**xwhatsit** · 22nd February 2008, 01:56

I really don't understand why 100kph on the Northern Motorway is any more dangerous than 50kph (rather, 60kph) in rush-hour Newmarket?

The hours restrictions are silly, too. After 10pm is when I far prefer to be riding; no traffic, better vision (no distractions, just clear white lines and cat's eyes).

You can't treat the 6L as a `licence to learn' thingie (as 1L) so long as it takes 6 months to get past it. Nobody can take that seriously.

I've noticed most of the Biker Killed threads around here seem to be people on GSXR1000s and other similar weapons.

**justsomeguy** · 22nd February 2008, 02:06

Originally Posted by xerxesdaphat

I've noticed most of the Biker Killed threads around here seem to be people on GSXR1000s and other similar weapons.

Uhmm, I'm a bit slow, what's the connection between gixxer thou's and newbies doing 70kmph again?

**FROSTY:Me** · 22nd February 2008, 07:02

Heres an ammendment to propose to the powers that be.
A person on a LEARNER licence shall travel at the perscribed speed of 70km/h and on roads appropriate to that speed. Should there be NO alternative road they shall be permitted to travel at 100km/h untill they can return to a road speed appropriate.

**CookMySock** · 22nd February 2008, 07:15

Originally Posted by FROSTY

Heres an ammendment to propose to the powers that be.
A person on a LEARNER licence shall travel at the perscribed speed of 70km/h and on roads appropriate to that speed. Should there be NO alternative road they shall be permitted to travel at 100km/h untill they can return to a road speed appropriate.

I agree. But you can see what is going to happen here ay ? This will be open to all sorts of legal spanner-swinging so folks can get up to 100k and stay there. Remembering one of your earlier points (was it yours?), newbies who are prepared to go to these lengths to ride at 100k are probably ready to do so, and those who are not ready will strongly avoid it.

For me, the most mind-bending part of the transition to a larger sport bike and open road speeds, was getting the bike laid hard over in a corner and not getting a fright. Getting a fright meant picking the bike up and quickly running out of road - fatal on a lefthand bend in traffic.

DB

**Hitcher** · 22nd February 2008, 07:57

Originally Posted by FROSTY

Heres an ammendment to propose to the powers that be.
A person on a LEARNER licence shall travel at the perscribed speed of 70km/h and on roads appropriate to that speed. Should there be NO alternative road they shall be permitted to travel at 100km/h untill they can return to a road speed appropriate.

That's no different to saying that a learner shall travel at the posted speed limit for any stretch of road.

**Robbo** · 22nd February 2008, 09:04

Frosty, Tank and Hitcher all make very good and valid points on this issue and although they differ i agree with them. Travelling 30km/h below the road speed can lead to some dangerous situations with the cages as they will tail gate you and just push past you which can run you off the road altogether.
On the other side, a Learner licence is just that, a temporary licence to enable you to develop your skills and then hit the highways as per normal.
Perhaps a solution to this would be a compulsive and very comprehensive rider training course that once you have passed this then you can go out safely onto the roads without the current speed restrictions. Having said that, we never should stop the learning or knowledge process regardless of our age or experience.

**Hitcher** · 22nd February 2008, 10:46

There are some dangerous assumptions implicit in the current regulations relating to learner riders.

One is that having gained completed a learn to ride course and gained the necessary documentation to get a learner license, that the person concerned is competent to ride a 250cc motorcycle on the open road. Learn to ride courses are not that. They are basic handling skills courses. There's a big difference, as we discovered five years ago. Mrs H had never ridden a motorcycle prior to attending this course. Location of levers and their coordinated function was something that the instructor expected people to have a working knowledge of. The *instructor* wasn't interested in providing this level of coaching. I ran alongside Mrs H explaining things to her until such time as she was able to move off, change gears and come to a stop again. Two hours later she had a certificate enabling her to ride on the open road. I needed CPR.

**xwhatsit** · 22nd February 2008, 11:25

Originally Posted by justsomeguy

Uhmm, I'm a bit slow, what's the connection between gixxer thou's and newbies doing 70kmph again?

Where's all the threads about guys on L-plates doing 140kph over embankments?

No, the L-plate guys do stuff like grab the front brake on a patch of diesel around town. Or run into a car-door when a cager pulls out in front of them, and they haven't learned how to dodge yet. Doing 100kph on a straight bit of motorway is one of the safest situations you can be in when you're starting to ride. I used to dread everything leading up to Gillies Ave on my morning commute, but once on there, I was happy as Larry.

**sunhuntin** · 22nd February 2008, 12:03

Originally Posted by Hitcher

There are some dangerous assumptions implicit in the current regulations relating to learner riders.

One is that having gained completed a learn to ride course and gained the necessary documentation to get a learner license, that the person concerned is competent to ride a 250cc motorcycle on the open road. Learn to ride courses are not that. They are basic handling skills courses. There's a big difference, as we discovered five years ago. Mrs H had never ridden a motorcycle prior to attending this course. Location of levers and their coordinated function was something that the instructor expected people to have a working knowledge of. The *instructor* wasn't interested in providing this level of coaching. I ran alongside Mrs H explaining things to her until such time as she was able to move off, change gears and come to a stop again. Two hours later she had a certificate enabling her to ride on the open road. I needed CPR.

before i got my BHS, i was riding around a rugby paddock. dad taught me everything i needed to know as far as gears and levers etc. so i had some level of understanding before i even went for the license... blow going for it without even knowing how do something like change a gear.