Being a helmet nazi...

[FJRider]

Yeah and if the cheaper helmet comforms to exactly to the same standard and is a good fit?

This it a reality some folks don't seem to be able to get their heads around. Excuse the pun.

The same stated MINIMUM standards are passed. Same thing for exams...pass mark 50%. If you get 75% you still passed but which mark would YOU want ???

[FROSTY:Me]

Heres an argument from left feild.
Lets say for a moment ALL helmets protect you just as well in a crash.
What value therefore is placed on the fit/comfort /quietness from a safety point of view.
Ie less noise,less buffetting making riding more comfortable therefore the rider is less fatigued and more able to concentrate on riding.

[Bonez]

The same stated MINIMUM standards are passed. Same thing for exams...pass mark 50%. If you get 75% you still passed but which mark would YOU want ???

You didn't read the article did you?

[AllanB]

A mate bought an $80.00 helmet to go with his hoysung, Brand new off tardeme. Its got a strange plastic strap catch. Its like a ratchet tounge..

Its got an E and a number like it meets euro standard...

Safe or deadly........ Who knows....

Hmm depends where they come from - there is a lot of 'replicated' shit coming out of China nowdays, to the point whewre they copy logos and standards stickers etc.
I have seen a couple of recent Nokia & Sony copies that are very well done (until you use them!).

I'd buy ex USA from a big name brand store, but not a no-name helmet from Trademe.

[FJRider]

Heres an argument from left feild.
Lets say for a moment ALL helmets protect you just as well in a crash.
What value therefore is placed on the fit/comfort /quietness from a safety point of view.
Ie less noise,less buffetting making riding more comfortable therefore the rider is less fatigued and more able to concentrate on riding.

It matters only to those that do the time with a helmet ON. The rest are only concerned with how much they saved.

[Robbo]

The same stated MINIMUM standards are passed. Same thing for exams...pass mark 50%. If you get 75% you still passed but which mark would YOU want ???

Hey FJ, we both obviously agree on the required quality of the helmet and also, as Jim has referred to, the fitting correctly factor. What seems to have got lost here is the question of the cost of the helmet. Obviously you won't get anything worth wearing for $10 but you also don't need to spend $1000 either. In many cases an expensive product just has a very high markup% and probably is'nt necessarily 100 times better than a cheaper equivalent. Several people seem to think that just because it is for sale on Trademe that it will be crap. This is not necessarily so as i have also seen some cheap "made in China" helmets at motorcycle shops.
Maybe the "Standards Details" need to be clarified a little better and shown very clearly on all helmets sold in NZ so that the buyer can be in no doubt as to the safety of their purchase.
Food for Thought i guess.

[FROSTY:Me]

Hey FJ, we both obviously agree on the required quality of the helmet and also, as Jim has referred to, the fitting correctly factor. What seems to have got lost here is the question of the cost of the helmet. Obviously you won't get anything worth wearing for $10 but you also don't need to spend $1000 either. In many cases an expensive product just has a very high markup% and probably is'nt necessarily 100 times better than a cheaper equivalent. Several people seem to think that just because it is for sale on Trademe that it will be crap. This is not necessarily so as i have also seen some cheap "made in China" helmets at motorcycle shops.
Maybe the "Standards Details" need to be clarified a little better and shown very clearly on all helmets sold in NZ so that the buyer can be in no doubt as to the safety of their purchase.
Food for Thought i guess.

Sorry Robbo I'm with FJ on this one. Not wanting to do my dick is bigger than yours but i've been riding/racing for 25 years and the difference between a cheaper helmet and a better one is huge.
The ONLY exception is where you are sensible and choose a plain color instead of the latest graphics on a lid.

[FJRider]

Robbo, I believe SAFETY issues are only a PART of pricing issues. As Frosty mentioned, wind noise, comfort, aerodynamically better, better venting etc,etc, are factors few consider untill their dollars (helmet) are strapped on their head, and heading (excuse the pun) away for a ride.

[Bonez]

Another thing to consider is how they are strapped to your head. Clips or double Ds.

[James Deuce]

Robbo, I believe SAFETY issues are only a PART of pricing issues. As Frosty mentioned, wind noise, comfort, aerodynamically better, better venting etc,etc, are factors few consider untill their dollars (helmet) are strapped on their head, and heading (excuse the pun) away for a ride.

Absolutely - Motorcyclist lost Arai and Shoei as advertisers over that article, because not only were the cheaper helmets safer, they had features that worked significantly better.

But the biggest thing in that article is that the mega buck helmets weren't/aren't doing their job because they are too stiff. They take so much force without absorbing it that significant inter-cranial damage occurs long before the helmet fails. In other words your brain is jellied mush from a simple angled kerb strike at low speed.

You can either continue the $10 helmet $10 head argument in the face of principled independent research by respected researchers (Dr Harry Hurt) or accept a company's marketing line about how safe their helmets are. The standards are passed at the same level for all helmets. It's pass or fail, not a percentage figure. The SNELL standard is bollocks and the DOT standard is questioned extensively as well. Helmets are developing crumple zones as a result of that research too, testing chin bars that crumple to prevent the broken neck that has become prevalent in face first landings. The chin bar forces your head down and transmits a large chunk of the force generated by your body rolling your head forward and levering your head away from your cervical spine. The inherent conundrum is how to protect your face and prevent the spinal injury at the same time.

Check this article out and then tell me that helmets that meet ECE22.05 are worse than SNELL or DOT helmets only? The testing is much more extensive and varied and tests a greater range of possible impact types. Looks like DOT + ECE22.05 compliance are what you'd want.

http://www.msf-usa.org/imsc/proceedi...cleHelmets.pdf

[Motu]

A knot is pretty damn strong - but I can never get it remember.......left over right,but I can't see with my helmet on?

I've been using a helmet I bought second hand maybe 7 years ago,but who know how old it is.You guys would of been dead a week after putting it on....but I know how to use a helmet properly.....

[Robbo]

Robbo, I believe SAFETY issues are only a PART of pricing issues. As Frosty mentioned, wind noise, comfort, aerodynamically better, better venting etc,etc, are factors few consider untill their dollars (helmet) are strapped on their head, and heading (excuse the pun) away for a ride.

Hey Frosty and FJ, you'll get no argument from me on that one as i also appreciate a comfortable, quiet and snug fitting helmet, where i am coming from is that there is room for compromise in the comfort zone but NOT in the safety zone for a young rider starting out with a very limited budget. Hell, when i first started riding over 40 years ago, we did'nt even have any helmets at all. Things have come a long way in that time, and just as well cause i would'nt ever contemplate riding without a good helmet nowdays.
After all, they are probably also starting off on a compromise bike as well just like you and i did back then. However, when they can afford to buy their new or dream bike then they can also afford a quality lid to go with it.
Cheers Guys

[Ripperjon]

For the people who don't know what's a legal helmet in NZ...

http://www.landtransport.govt.nz/roa...-clothing.html

[90s]

For me, i have worn HJC helmets for many years now and have always been more than satisfied with them and they are quite reasonably priced at most reputable bike shops.
However, it is still a personal choice and i would not criticise anyone who had spent $100 or $1000 on their helmet of choice.

My current lid is a HJC CS-12.
Reviewing the AC-12 Carbon webbikeworld said (http://www.webbikeworld.com/r2/motor...et/hjc/carbon/) "HJC is equal to the best and, we think, better than Arai quality, which in our experience is highly over-rated. Unfortunately, some riders still have a perception that owning an HJC helmet doesn't offer the same prestige as other brands."

Back the the point and hopefully the end of this one - no-one has said on this thread at all that a cheap trademe helmet is a bad choice for a budget rider, if they can establish:
1) that it meets an accepted standard (ie. DOT)
2) that they can be sure the above is geniune and not fake, and the helmet a knock-off
3) that the helment is 100% new, remembering what I said about it being very hard to tell sometimes if a lid has been trashed
4) THAT IS FIT YOU (not your mate who tried one on)

If you can be sure of the above, save the cash and the store dealer mark up, or the mark-up for comfort, style, graphics etc. and get the minimum. Why not if it is all you can afford - but you CANNOT afford to do LESS.

However, as I said, if you look in the stores for end of line stuff you don't have to worry about 1-4 as you can try on, and can still save as there are often 1/2 price sales on old stock.
I tried many budget helmets with the wife for her (as she rides very infrequently on pillion) and many were nasty - too nasty that even a young guy trying to save money wouldn't get fed up with - but managed to find an $80-off CAN that actually impressed me, being not much down in terms of quality from my CS-12 (admittedly a fairly budget helmet).

Save money where you can, but be sensible.

[FJRider]

Hey Frosty and FJ, you'll get no argument from me on that one as i also appreciate a comfortable, quiet and snug fitting helmet, where i am coming from is that there is room for compromise in the comfort zone but NOT in the safety zone for a young rider starting out with a very limited budget. Hell, when i first started riding over 40 years ago, we did'nt even have any helmets at all. Things have come a long way in that time, and just as well cause i would'nt ever contemplate riding without a good helmet nowdays.
After all, they are probably also starting off on a compromise bike as well just like you and i did back then. However, when they can afford to buy their new or dream bike then they can also afford a quality lid to go with it.
Cheers Guys

I started riding in 1975, helmets WERE required by law. ANY helmet. My first bike was a Kawasaki 100 farm bike (5 speed, high/low ratio) road legal and cost $2,00 to fill the tank. My first helmet was an ex MOT pudding basin with the leather bottom. $5,00 from a second hand shop. TIMES CHANGE