Police blast speed cameras.

[Biggles08]

I'm a little tea pot short and stout here is my handle here is my spout.

If I am the pot you must be the kettle.

The point is jahrasti, there are fewer 'good' cops on the road now days... The last two times I have been pulled over I have been very polite and cooperative with the cops but both times they have given me tickets. The first time I was speeding and did deserve some sort of a ticket but the one I got I don't think - no, I'll rephrase that, I know the circumstances did not warrant it 'in the name of safety' which is how the officer was justifying it to me. The last time was for my # plate and no rear reflector...the numberplate is just a joke, it is easily seen while I'm on it (look further in the thread there are photos of me riding in front of a car) I made sure that it is..I have even put lighting on it for at night, I have no intention of hiding my numberplate...even here online. The reflector was something I did not realize was needed and I have since put one on...but did it warrant a $150 fine...all that did was make me pissed off at ALL TRAFFIC COPS. This cocksucker that pulled me over did so because he was annoyed that he didn't get me speeding because the guy I was with was. He asked me why I had a radar detector. Go figure fucktard!

[Coldrider]

Okay, i just had to go back and read the starter post in this thread. I don't see what everyone is getting their dick in a huge knot for. (Apart from perhaps trying to prove that it's long enough for them to tie in a knot). If I speed or run a red light and I'm pinged, who do I have to blame for that? Let's see here, thinking really really hard, oh, I've nearly got it, it's on the tip of my tongue....Light bulb: the answer is ME! We know what the road rules are and if we're going to flout them we are well aware what the consequences will be - this is regardless of what our "criminal behaviour" is. Getting het up over who gets a slap on the wrist with a wet lettuce leaf compared to the huge fine we might get for something we feel is far less "dangerous" is understandable but not likely to solve anything. HTFU, suck it up, and take ya medicine. I have nothing but admiration for the police who often have a crap job which seems to result in getting a lot of grief when they're either only trying to do their best and /or following orders. (This from a woman who had to wait for hours before police could arrive when she walked in on a burglar in her own home one night).

I don't agree with or support any one who breaks the law, i even critisize a few who do, but I don't like the site for police propaganda or lectures either.

[jahrasti]

The point is jahrasti, there are fewer 'good' cops on the road now days... The last two times I have been pulled over I have been very polite and cooperative with the cops but both times they have given me tickets. The first time I was speeding and did deserve some sort of a ticket but the one I got I don't think - no, I'll rephrase that, I know the circumstances did not warrant it 'in the name of safety' which is how the officer was justifying it to me. The last time was for my # plate and no rear reflector...the numberplate is just a joke, it is easily seen while I'm on it (look further in the thread there are photos of me riding in front of a car) I made sure that it is..I have even put lighting on it for at night, I have no intention of hiding my numberplate...even here online. The reflector was something I did not realize was needed and I have since put one on...but did it warrant a $150 fine...all that did was make me pissed off at ALL TRAFFIC COPS. This cocksucker that pulled me over did so because he was annoyed that he didn't get me speeding because the guy I was with was. He asked me why I had a radar detector. Go figure fucktard!

Thats you opinion and you are allowed it. I am not gunna argue, all I have to say yes you may have been given a warning but weren't. Generaly, unfortunetly warnings don't work. I give out a few warnings but nothing fucks you off more than give a motorist a warning and then have them drive off laughing and you know they aren't gunna do anything about it.

[HenryDorsetCase]

Fair enough you are allowed your day in court, but what happens when it is General Duties cops that are in court? Is that not one less cop that can go to callouts that day? GDB officers give out tickets too.
What are you going to plea bargain, Sorry I knew my WOF was two months overdue, if you drop the ticket to half the money I will get it tomorrow I promise.
Sorry I knew I had cut spings, Don't give me a pink sticker and I will put the correct ones in tonight I promise.
I didn't have my seatbelt on because I don't believe that they save lives, but drop my ticket by half and i will wear it all the time I promise.

I could go on and on

plea bargain in the sense that: Cop says "I believe that your conduct was reckless because of blah" punter says "ferk off, it wasnt dangerous at all, I barely touched 'im guvnor" Cop says "rather than fuck about if you agree to cop to careless with X penalty then I will give you the approprate ticket" It goes on now but informally. Cop goes in like a box of hammers knowing he will be bargained down, punter knows he has a shot of getting a reduced penalty, then it falls finally where it should be.

as for your cut springs example, if dickweed does have cut springs, puts the right ones in (i.e. the vehicle is presented to the cop or whatever and yes it has the proper springs in)then dickweed doesnt get caught again with the cut ones in for say a year, whats the harm? In fact is it not arguable that is a better road safety outcome?.

As for GDB cops vs HP cops, again my response is either "so what?" isnt uncle helen giving us all more cops for christmas (its election year after all). And surely, the coercive arm of the state MUST be answerable to the judicial, or are you arguing for an actual fascist police state?

the WOF example is easy too: (and not to mention WAY off my central thesis which is that speed doesnt kill, people do) You have no statutorily required certificate your vehicle is fit to drive. The coercive arm of the state's attention is drawn to that fact somehow. Your vehicle is clamped and then (at your cost) you have to get it towed to where they issue WOFS and get a new WOF. Not difficult is it?

No seatbelt? (and again WAY off the speed thing) Unless your vehicle (pre 1962 innit) doesnt require them, then you get ticketed for not wearing a seatbelt. It might be classed as reckless (but you might plead guilty to careless) or it might attract its own penalties as it does now.


OK ive dealt with your off topic scenarios. I'm waiting for you to address my central thesis. To reiterate: You need to defend speed limits ipso facto as a tool of road safety.

You're up.

[Biggles08]

Okay, i just had to go back and read the starter post in this thread. I don't see what everyone is getting their dick in a huge knot for. (Apart from perhaps trying to prove that it's long enough for them to tie in a knot). If I speed or run a red light and I'm pinged, who do I have to blame for that? Let's see here, thinking really really hard, oh, I've nearly got it, it's on the tip of my tongue....Light bulb: the answer is ME! We know what the road rules are and if we're going to flout them we are well aware what the consequences will be - this is regardless of what our "criminal behaviour" is. Getting het up over who gets a slap on the wrist with a wet lettuce leaf compared to the huge fine we might get for something we feel is far less "dangerous" is understandable but not likely to solve anything. HTFU, suck it up, and take ya medicine. I have nothing but admiration for the police who often have a crap job which seems to result in getting a lot of grief when they're either only trying to do their best and /or following orders. (This from a woman who had to wait for hours before police could arrive when she walked in on a burglar in her own home one night).

While I would like to agree with you PB, the fact is you have missed the point. The law is an ass in regards to speed vs road safety...this leads to further misconceptions about our rights as citizens of this country. While everyone wants the roads to be safer, reducing speed is not the way to achieve this. If we all just sit back and let governments make silly laws while little boys are charged to enforce these stupid laws, we may as well give up all our rights now and trust the gov to look after all our interests. This Ting Tong 'poor excuse for a cop' fella is exactly why the police in this country a less and less liked as people...in fact you could say I'm trying to do the police a favor by pointing out this poor behavior!

I can honestly say that I would like to respect the police in this country but the fact is they have done little to encourage my respect...and hence they receive little. When I start seeing and hearing of good policing of real road safety issues and not the bullshit propaganda that we see every day then I may change my mind.

[HenryDorsetCase]

Okay, i just had to go back and read the starter post in this thread. I don't see what everyone is getting their dick in a huge knot for. (Apart from perhaps trying to prove that it's long enough for them to tie in a knot). If I speed or run a red light and I'm pinged, who do I have to blame for that? Let's see here, thinking really really hard, oh, I've nearly got it, it's on the tip of my tongue....Light bulb: the answer is ME! We know what the road rules are and if we're going to flout them we are well aware what the consequences will be - this is regardless of what our "criminal behaviour" is. Getting het up over who gets a slap on the wrist with a wet lettuce leaf compared to the huge fine we might get for something we feel is far less "dangerous" is understandable but not likely to solve anything. HTFU, suck it up, and take ya medicine. I have nothing but admiration for the police who often have a crap job which seems to result in getting a lot of grief when they're either only trying to do their best and /or following orders. (This from a woman who had to wait for hours before police could arrive when she walked in on a burglar in her own home one night).

did you get my pic with my dick tied in a knot?

You are arguing about a different thing from what I am arguing. Your position is that someone who knowingly breaks a law (running a red, speeding) should attract the statutorily defined consequences and shouldnt whine like a little girl. I agree with you.

I am arguing an ENTIRELY different thing, which is that arbitrary speed limits do not assist in assuring anyones road safety.

[HenryDorsetCase]

Whilst totally ignoring the effect of enhanced car structures, airbags, ABS brakes, vehicle stability control, better roads, tyres, just generally better vehicles!!

Its all down to speed cameras, folks!

What a crock of shit!

concur.

there is a rule of logic that says:

Just because B follows A, it does NOT mean that A caused B.

but of course the gummint gets a LOT of revenue from speeding, nearly as much as the other slot machines.

[twotyred]

What do you think traffic cops do? we are dedicated traffic officers who ARE real cops and not just to enforce traffic. The old days werent good as the old traffic cops werent allowed to deal with REAL crime as you put it. Have you ever had to deal with a fatal where speeding was an issue? have you ever had to inform the family of a death and see the life drain out of their eyes? How often does someone die as a result of a burglary or theft, the real crimes you speak of?? Luckily you dont have to deal with all of this, we do! its nice to sit in your warm home bitching about everything but you would soon change your tune should you have to deal with all of the mayhem that drivers and riders cause! and not just to the drivers or riders more importantly to the innocent law abiding members of society. If i have to issue a ticket to every single person in the country and it saves one life then i have done my job, others wont see it my way but i really hate dealing with these deaths, they ARE avoidable its just the standard or driving and riding in this country is crap! and its everyone elses fault but yours, especially when you get a ticket for something you know you were doing!!!

blah,blah,blah your a hero... don't like dealing with it? get another job

[Biggles08]

Thats you opinion and you are allowed it. I am not gunna argue, all I have to say yes you may have been given a warning but weren't. Generaly, unfortunetly warnings don't work. I give out a few warnings but nothing fucks you off more than give a motorist a warning and then have them drive off laughing and you know they aren't gunna do anything about it.

There is a fine line between opinions and facts. Re the warnings, I can see your point but it depends on the situation and whether the fine justify's the feeling the person will have of the police for years to come. I for example as written above have very little respect for the police due to personal experiences that ARE FACT not opinions.

The last time I had a good experience with a cop was when one saw 2 of my mates and myself on green kwakas on the side of the road having a cig stop and he pulls up to chat about bikes and life in general...didn't check up on us, hassle us for number plates, just talked about our bikes and shit. He road a TL and was obviously into bikes. He was from Dublin and had been here for one year...he was sick of the attitude NZ police had! What a top bloke, pulling up to put a face to the plod...he gained my respect right there and had he given me a warning about anything like red reflectors I would have listened to him (I had a different bike then, with a reflector).

When was the last time you stopped to have a general chat with bikers? I bet it was more recent than Ping pong or ting tong whatever the fucktard calls himself here on KB

[Toaster]

But on the whole I seem them a tax on the brainless/dopey/careless drivers..

I can see the charge sheets now.....

On... at... did drive a motorvehicle on ... road in a manner considered to be dopey.

hehehehe

[Coldrider]

I can see the charge sheets now.....

On... at... did drive a motorvehicle on ... road in a manner considered to be dopey.

hehehehe

Wait till the swing shift finishes, that's what they call it ?

[PrincessBandit]

did you get my pic with my dick tied in a knot?

You are arguing about a different thing from what I am arguing. Your position is that someone who knowingly breaks a law (running a red, speeding) should attract the statutorily defined consequences and shouldnt whine like a little girl. I agree with you.

I am arguing an ENTIRELY different thing, which is that arbitrary speed limits do not assist in assuring anyones road safety.

I did indeed get your pic you sick puppy. I'd report you, but it was kinda cute... Kidding!!!!!
I hear what you are saying, and I would like to point out that my post wasn't actually aimed at you per se. I'd have quoted something from it (like I did just now) if that had been the case. As for the original post, I guess it was just asking "wonder what our police think of it" i.e. the camera as revenue gathering, so the comment about police propaganda (think that was the word used by someone else a moment ago) is interesting.

[Coldrider]

...so the comment about police propaganda (think that was the word used by someone else a moment ago) is interesting.

Nah it was probably me, I can now safely log on to KB and recieve a lecture about how bad we are blah blah blah, maybe we can even receive virtual infringements. Maybe now KB is government controlled or spyed on.

[FROSTY:Me]

Back to the origonal discussion. I think the point the Vic cops are making re speed cameras and red light cameras is totally valid.
In that the fine comes through the post and is not a disincentive for offenders.
By the time you get the fine the offence has long gone from ya mind.
My opinion is ya run a red bingo its an instant loss of keys on the spot
Random red light checkpoints on the black spots
Waste of fully trained cops arguably so --->
The use of freshly qualified cops on the booze checkpoints could be extended to include red light checkpoints.

[Bass]

I am arguing an ENTIRELY different thing, which is that arbitrary speed limits do not assist in assuring anyones road safety.

They may not assist in significantly reducing the probability of a crash (I refuse to use the word "accident"), but spudchucka made the point eons ago that they can affect the damage that is done when a crash occurs.

E = 1/2 M x V squared

So the energy involved in the crash (or the potential for ripping people apart) goes up as the square of the speed.
Basic physics really.