MNZ request Super Motard feedback

[skypig]

if motards can race f3 and motard classes. why cant f3 bikes race motard class. not to be annoying or arguing for the sake of it but everyone wants more track time.

Motards were eligible for F3, before they amended the rules specifically to exclude them. (Handlebar height and “off-road” frames). F3 bikes were never eligble for motard.

I don’t think many Motards would be competitive with a hot SV650 on a RR circuit.

Letting slower bikes race in a faster class MAY be a way of promoting involvement and letting people gain experience and filling grids.

Letting top F3 bikes win every Motard race wouldn’t make much sense.

(much the same as letting F2 600s race F1 1000s seems sensible, while letting F1s in F2 races does not)

[CHOPPA]

For years I put up with comments like that. A lot of 'racers' simply don't like being beaten fair and square by a guy on a lightly modified dirt bike.

Get faster or get over it.

So you think you would beat me? honestly that really isnt my reason for my opinion, im actually going to be racing a motard at selected events this year as well so im by no means a motard hater

[CHOPPA]

I spoke to scotty this morning about this and i have to agree that yes it is the riders that are the problem but when you have a rider with those tendancys and put them on a motard against road bikes and thats where the problem lies....

[Crasherfromwayback]

So you think you would beat me? honestly that really isnt my reason for my opinion, im actually going to be racing a motard at selected events this year as well so im by no means a motard hater

There's not too many people I haven't been able to beat mate!

You'll love racing the motard...it's a fun and cheap way to do it.

[Quasievil]

me in the market for a Motard, just cant make up my mind what to get not that there is alot of choices around.

Personally I dont want to race F3 or any sportsbikes, rather race Motards against motards.

[skypig]

I'll bet you can both beat me. Doesn't matter, I'll still come back for more, with a smile on my face.

"It's better to race for last - than not to race at all"

[spsduc]

These riders should stick to Motard competition then. I.E. mixed dirt and tar, not road racing.

If they have a seperate Motard road race class at normal road race events (I.E. not actual Motard Dirt/tar races) I fear the norm will be to ride foot out backing it in etc and guys will not learn the ärt" of road racing and never experience the thrill of knee down high corner speed racing and may never progress to road bikes.
From a safety point of view the same dangers exist if the two styles are mixed on the same type of bike.
I.E. Motards-some foot down diving up the inside, others knee out sweeping lines. Think about it. No different to mixing with road bikes.

Those who want to ride wheels in line, knee out should be given the opportunity to ride with road bikes doing the same thing.

Cheers Craig.

[CHOPPA]

maybe a tad of topic....

I dont want this to come accross as i want to get rid of motards cause they are prob the best class to watch, but i reckon they need more of there own events on better suited tracks that actually promote riding supermoto style rather then riding a motard bike like a road bike if thats what you want to do then buy a road bike.

Did anyone see the round of the fim supermoto tracks where they had pretty much sealed a mx track it was so sweet! In the interest of proper supermoto it would be good to see mx clubs put in sealed sections to try steal some mx riders to sealed racing.

[TonyB]

BEARS racing in Chch has effectively been gutted by the ruling against Motards, which is a bloody shame because the vast majority of them had figured out that a traditional road racing line was the fastest way around any of the Ruapuna track configurations. I found the bigger Motards pretty hard to deal with on my underpowered and heavy Monster, but I sure as hell enjoyed racing with them. Racing against bikes with different capabilities is fun- they could out brake me and gas out of the corner better, but on a decent bend I could carry a bit more speed than the guys I was mixing it up with, and DAMN that big hole they make in the air is handy for the draft-and-pass down the straight! Now that they are excluded, the track is bloody near empty.

As has been said earlier in this thread- can we really afford to exclude such a large number of potential competitors?

[spsduc]

That is what I thought would happen.
Could you please pass these comments on to MNZ?

email vicky@mnz.co.nz

Thanks, Craig.

[Kevin G]

Below is the outcome from MNZ re the input received from members on the motard bikes in formula classes. Bloody good I think, well done MNZ.

All Classes & Super Motard Riding Style


All class’s and Super Motard riding style.

I would like to thank the people who took the time to put forward constructive comments regards the riding style of the Super Motards.



Given the various opinions put forward for consideration of those that are for and those that are against the two class's racing against each other, it is clear that there is a genuine desire by the Super Motard riders to be included within the structure of what would be considered an accepted road race style.



Given that there was a remit presented to the commission some two years ago by concerned riders of F3 about the style of some the SM riders a safety rule was put in place excluding SM from the F3 class racing.



However following the correspondence over the last two months regards this subject it is the determination of the commission that there is to be a one year (maximum) trial period to gauge the safe practice of these class’s racing against each other with some exceptions.



If during this period (1 year trial) of mixed class racing the Super Motard riders cannot adapt to the traditional style of racing then Super Motards will be excluded from all class’s, except their own class of racing.



Therefore it is incumbent of Super Motard riders to self govern themselves, as I am sure we would all like to see this exercise succeed.



The issues are.

The practice of sliding the rear wheel out on the entry into corners, leading with the inside leg off the foot peg (i.e. similar to a moto Cross style), and backing into corners in an exaggerated manner.



All class’s and Super Motards



In race meetings where there are F3/ BEARS class races and also Super Motard class races then the genuine F3/ Bears bikes will have first call on the grid positions for the F3 races.



Any grid positions that are left vacant can be filled on a first entered (by post date of entry form to meeting) on the grid up to the maximum numbers on the grid as set by the club in the sub regs by Super Motard class bikes.



Remembering Super Motards would have their own races and that a true F3/ BEARS cannot race in Super Motard races.



It is the clubs discretion as to the class structure of their meeting.

When applying for a permit the club must consider the circuit suitable as to whether F3/BEARS and Super Motards can compete together where the circuit lends its design to using traditional road racing styles.



In the case where a circuit is suited to Super Motards only (i.e. Wyndham Burt Munroe meeting) then the permit must indicate so that MNZ will sign off the permit on the information provided as to the suitability of F3 and SM racing together.



Riding Style.

In races where F3/BEARS and Super Motard are permitted to race together a traditional road race style ONLY MUST be used.



Riders who are considered not to be riding during practice or racing within the intent of the traditional road race style the rider will be spoken to by the steward in the first instance.



In the circumstances where it is considered dangerous to riders the offending rider/s will be shown the black flag by an official



Rule 6-19 to be observed by officials, Individual rider to stop and retire from the course upon completion of that lap. The rider’s number must be shown on a board at the same point as the black flag is displayed.



If the rider/s continue to ignore the safety of themselves or fellow riders they may be barred from competing in the remainder of that meeting this infringement to be recorded in the riders log book.



Regards

Paul Stewart

Road Race Commissioner.

[lostinflyz]

sounds like logic prevailed. that must be a first. whats the world coming to?

[gav]

The practice of sliding the rear wheel out on the entry into corners, leading with the inside leg off the foot peg (i.e. similar to a moto Cross style), and backing into corners in an exaggerated manner.

Now if you took the MX reference out doesn't this describe how Valentino Rossi and Casey Stoner ride? Inside foot off the peg, rear wheel out of line and sliding into corners? Just a thought .......

[GaZBur]

Thanks for posting that Kevin. That sounds cool if I understand it correctly. Please correct me if I am wrong.

Motards are allowed to ride in F3 provided:

• there is enough room numbers wise on the grid to accomodate them
• they ride in a compatabale manner to F3
• the start position on the grid must be behind all genuine F3 entrants
• the club running the meeting does not deem the circuit unsuitable to SM and F3 to compete together (such as tight street circuits).
• We keep our noses clean and don't create excuses to get us excluded again

That is actually reasonable. So when the grid is full as it appered to be at Rnd 1 Levels Winter series we are out, but if F3 numbers are low we can get some extra racing.

One of the things mentioned by Paul Stewart is almost exactly what I put in my submission, does that mean that riders opinions are actually listened to?!?!? Fan-bloody-tastic!

[skypig]

Sounds very fair and reasonable but..... I'm off to OZ