any updates?
Hardcore Biker
any updates?
Forum whore
Ah ha B000M that clears that up for me. I to cannot remember any posts of KB members boasting about how loud there bikes are out at Ardmore!
I'm on John Cobbs email list because I'm a member out there and I haven't got anything through yet since the Sat email that was posted here.Originally Posted by Pierce
I just called someone who was there at the meetings on Monday and the final decision won't come out for another 2 weeks or so. But he thought Monday went better for Ardmore than what John reported Friday went. So the juries out at the moment and until John Cobb puts his present feelings forward via email, we won't know. He may of coarse not venture a public opinion until after the council have done their thing. So its time for patience. Whats done is done! and we don't want to effect any decisions that may come out by stupid rantings on here that may or may not be monitored by the people making those judgments.
So get your shit together KB'ers the time for a rant is after we hear what the decision is!!!!!!!!!
I might go out for a practice tomorrow if its open and weathers fine.
On a Motorcycle you're penetrating distance, right along with the machine!! In a car you're just a spectator, the windshields like a TV!!
'Life's Journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out! Shouting, ' Holy sh!t... What a Ride!! '
Hardcore Biker
RE Nordieboy - on Back pressure and Super Trapp
Sorry, really should start another thread for this stuff . When restricting exhaust problem is not just mixture, you have to get rid of the heat as well. Problem is restriction at small surface area really inhibits flow. My Pro Circuit has a spark arrestor that has a very fine mesh that's pretty restricive as well though.
Couple of times I've needed to check bike still runs (after carb out or similar job) before next days ride. In order not to annoy the neighbours I wrapped a 'T' shirt around muffler end (whisper quiet) but never ran it for more than a few seconds so avoided any probs. I reckon you might see a red hot header running it like that fairly quickly!
Yeah Nordie, the Super Trapp had quite a different higher frequency tone as well. I figured it was an outdated design, I didn't realise they still made them. That high adjustabilty factor could be really useful these days. I wish I had a better idea on how far you could push the silencing on an engine set up for a freer flowing exhaust. On newer EFI bikes, with maybe a dual mapping and an adjustable exhaust it might be possible to have an 'Ardmore mode' for certain ride areas. I have the feeling that even aiming well below 96 Db it might not be enough to save Ardmore though.
RE the 'boasting about noisy bikes' comments. I did a quick search of Off Road threads. There are a few comments that are a bit, lets say 'edgy' and wouldn't be ideal to have at these hearings, but those who made them had no idea where they ended up (I hope those councillers understand the concept of context), and those posts were heavily outnumbered by really positive stuff and far more accurately represents riders as a group. Here's one thread I looked at for example:
http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/sh...ght=noise+loud
Quote Reckless: So get your shit together KB'ers the time for a rant is after we hear what the decision is!!!!!!!!!
Good call there Reckless. The walls have ears. Fingers crossed for a good result.
Armature speller
There is/was a guy in Engerland who went to a lot of trouble to make a mechanically baffelled pipe for his Berg 650 motard - Very good read if you can find it...
Unexpected Spanish inquisition
FYI: Those wire mesh spark arrestors make an average of 1db difference (quieter) and cost 1-2hp on most mid size bikes. Exhaust packing as Scott stated earlier will make way more difference one way or the other, whether its not enough packing, too much, wrong type or wet etc. You'd be surprised the difference in performance between different types of packing too.
Before you judge a man, walk a mile in his shoes. After that, who cares? ...He's a mile away and you've got his shoes
told ya so
when we went to repack my dads 350kitted ktm exc 4stroke
we bought the proper packing
pulled the muffler to part
and found that it was empty, had no packing
so we put the new packing in and it didnt make any difference to how loud the bike was and it still backfires sometimes, thats why we repacked(or to be fair packed)it in the first place
but maybe only motox 4stroke ktms, cuz the muffler internals on the sx and exc is different, the sx is straight thru
and the exc changes direction a few times
Unexpected Spanish inquisition
I don't want to start an argument, but that is physically impossible.
Read this:
There are three ways to muffle the sound coming from the combustion chamber: restriction, reflection and absorption. Restriction means just that: The flow of exhaust gas is restricted. This method definitely makes for a quieter exhaust note, but it also chokes off any decent power the engine is trying to make.
Reflective technology involves splitting the flow path of the exhaust gases within the muffler and using wave-cancellation techniques to create a pressure drop within the muffler. That reduces sound pressure and, therefore, the noise level at the muffler’s exit. If you look at a cutaway of a reflective-type muffler, you’ll find a series of baffles and reflectors. That’s the maze the exhaust winds around to set up the wave reflection.
Absorption techniques have traditionally been typified by the “glasspack” straight-through mufflers. That type of muffler is basically a straight tube inside another tube. The inner tube is perforated with louvers, and between the tubes is a packing material, usually fiberglass. As the exhaust goes through the muffler, the packing material absorbs some of the sound.
As you can see from the above, by repacking the muffler you WILL have reduced the sound level - even if you repacked it with Mum's tea towel!
Nearly all popular late model (bar a few 2008/2009 models) use the absorption method of sound reduction, sometimes augmented with a small baffle/reflector section.
You may be confusing exhaust tone with sound level, the bike will still have a characteristic 4stroke 'bark' but the sound level (db rating) will have been reduced.
Now the question is, were you supplied the correct packing or were you just told it was the correct packing? I believe that KTM use Silent Sport packing (http://www.areapnolimits.com/silentsport.html) though I won't swear to it, however I'm 99% sure they use a similar product, did it look like this?
Just because someone in a bike shop has sold you packing and 'told' you its correct doesn't neccessarily make it so.
Exhaust packing will not affect backfiring, that is caused by either a fueling or ignition issue (usually ignition timing or lean mixture).
An incorrectly tuned four stroke engine can effect the noise output too believe it or not.
Unfortunately the human ear is not a reliable sound level meter, if you want to really know the difference you'll need to get it tested.
Before you judge a man, walk a mile in his shoes. After that, who cares? ...He's a mile away and you've got his shoes
told ya so
thats exactly what we both said
well we asked for the packing for a ktm 250exc muffler from triple x motosports on east tamaki and thats what we thought we got
if packing the muffler should make it quieter then a muffler with no packing would be really loud and packing it would make it at least quieter to notice with my ear(16yrs) even if dad didnt but we both thought it was the same and maybe it was 1 Db lower but packing over no packing should be at least a little notieably quieter
and yes we did put the muffler back together as per the manual
that probably being the next question
Unexpected Spanish inquisition
Hmm...something isn't right there. Either you have just got cheap two stroke style packing (does it look like pink batts material (only probably not pink)?) if so, you probably blew half the packing out the first time you started it and gave it a rev. That style packing cannot cope with 4 strokes. Does it look like the Silent Sport material (long strands of stringy white stuff?) if so, did you use enough? KTM's usually have quite large silencers that take more than the average Japanes bike silencers. Has the silencer been cut down or modified?
The other mistake that many people make is the opposite of underpacking - overpacking by ramming the material so hard down into the silencer body that it loses its sound absorbing qualities and effectively becomes a solid mass, thereby creating a strait-through silencer.
Before you judge a man, walk a mile in his shoes. After that, who cares? ...He's a mile away and you've got his shoes
told ya so
it looked like a pillow, and there were two seperate pieces for the two chambers of the muffler, and it was pretty hard to get it to fit like we has to ram it in, so maybe we got shafted??
not knowing, its not really loud so not really a problem
but just dissapointing
Unexpected Spanish inquisition
Well for what its worth, that does sound like the genuine item. Those are pre-prepared pillow packs that have the packing material inside them, mainly its just to make it easier to fit and avoid some of the pitfalls outlined above.
You shouldn't have had to 'ram' it in though they do require feeding in slowly and poking all the overlapping edges inside.
As long as when you finished the material was just poking out the end of the silencer so that it was snug to the end cap when bolted up you should be sweet.
The only other thing I can suggest is carefully checking you whole exhaust sytem for cracks or holes. Look carefull as hairline cracks can be almsot invisible when cold/engine off, but open up under operation.
Before you judge a man, walk a mile in his shoes. After that, who cares? ...He's a mile away and you've got his shoes
L-Plate Rider
maybe they should have read out what where saying here if we had said this sooner to at least show that were making an effort to sort out the noise problem but from what johns said to me the noise testing that was done at the complainants boundarys was well within acceptable levels. At some you couldn't even hear the bikes and this was on a race day. All we can do is hope that the evidence that we had was better at depicting what was really happening.
gee wizzz
Guys Im sorry reading this is just like reading about western springs speedway.
The same arguments from the drivers/riders--ohh ittll affect performance--ohh it isn't me etc etc.
Meanwhile they played right into the hands of the eco nazi's
Sorry to be blunt --but please pull ya heads outa yer asses.
If EVERYONE plays ball with the DBA levels then everybody has the same performance issue to work around.
DON'T let the bastards have an excuse to get ya's
To see a life newly created.To watch it grow and prosper. Isn't that the greatest gift a human being can be given?
Hardcore Biker
so wth my new 250f im running a ti4 exhaust system,does this put me in the loud bike catagory? do i need to change?
Armature speller
Depends.
Is it loud?
There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote
Bookmarks