Technique Clinic

[OV Lander]

Guys, guys, guys what a response - Absolutely awesome!

There is heaps of stuff in here which confirms that I am doing somethings right, and gives me heaps of other stuff to try and to think about - like doing 50+kmph round a corner on gravel - still sitting here on 40 at present, but comforted to know nobody really likes the loose stuff!

Will definately be trying to track down the video, and look into the Kwaka course - if they'll take Beemers?

Mostly though guys, I really appreciate the time you've spent on your responses - so much solid advice. Thanks. I'll be sure to let you know how I get on.

Glad to see others coming out of the woodwork and asking questions too.

[OV Lander]

Thanks for the link Jim - DVD Ordered!

[topo]

One thing i hve found on the PD is that having a full tank of gas (35lts) settles the bike no end, goes from being "wishy-washy" at 60-70km/h to stable as rock at 110 on the same section of road.
If you really want to go faster on gravel just get a GS of early 90's vinage, the lack of brakes removes the ability to slow down, therefore A-B=faster

[Balrog]

Thanks for the link Jim - DVD Ordered!

No problems
I learned a lot from watching it & I still go out and do the riding exercises.
Really improved my ability in handling the GS

[magicfairy]

No problems
I learned a lot from watching it & I still go out and do the riding exercises.
Really improved my ability in handling the GS

Now he can go MUCH faster off-road, great fun for the pillion ...

NOT

[cave weta]

I have been putting on trail skills training days once a month since the end of last summer. Most of my participants are the owners of new trail bikes or people who have decided to get back into it after a few years of bringing up kids. either that or they want to get the kids up to speed so that the family can enjoy time out there together.

Ok so these people are not wrestling 200kg - $20,000 bikes up hills but I'm sure that a day with me on the slippery clay will help your sphincter to relax a little next time you have to cross slippery wooden farm bridges or weave your way through snot covered river rocks under 12" of fast flowing water.

Go HERE http://www.overthetopadventures.co.n...ing-clinic.htm
or HERE http://www.silver-bullet.co.nz/event.php?id=6186

[Padmei]

Excellent help guys. The recurring theme seems to be not to be afraid of using the throttle around corners. Unfortunately it is the reverse reaction to what my instincts often tell me. Teaching my instincts may be in order.

I often find my gravel riding is better on the way back. I put this down to being a little more tired/ relaxed & thinking of a good cup of coffee & scone

Maybe on the next Nelson rideout we can get some more pointers.

I may have to try some risers on Gonzo as when riding standing up my arms are still pulled down & back - can't really get into a neutral position.

[JATZ]

I may have to try some risers on Gonzo as when riding standing up my arms are still pulled down & back - can't really get into a neutral position.

I felt I was always pulling myself forward to hold on when standing up untill I shifted my feet back on the pegs about an inch maybe, feels much more neutral now, just gotta get the hang of changing gears while standing now.

[Oscar]

Buy yourself a cheap dirtbike, take it to a track or waste land and practice.

There is no substitute for time on the bike, on varying terrain types. A lighter (cheaper) bike will allow you to get the hang of the bike moving around on slippery terrain and the consequences of a fall are limited (both physically and fiscally).

Kenny Roberts Snr is famous for his ranch full of XR100's. Gun Grand Prix riders (like Eddie Lawson & Randy Mamola) would race these things around a dirt track for practice and enjoyment.

I have the opposite problem to OVLander lately, I love gravel roads and any kind of off road, but have a real problem with wet tarmac (after a couple of "moments" recently). After years of exclusively riding off-road or on gravel, I find myself very tentative on a wet road - to be fair, having a 100hp/200kg bike on knobblies is a big ask, but I find myself lagging behind my contemporaries. The irony is that I can go faster of wet gravel than I can on wet seal...

One observation I would make, having watched some of guys ride recently is that a lot of adventure riders ride on gravel like it's gravel. Like it's really deep, and evenly distributed. This means every corner is set up for a brake slide and a power exit. The fact is that most gravel roads have two worn tracks in them, whereby in the dry there actually a lot of traction. They can be ridden quite hard as if on seal and without any particular dirt riding techniques employed apart from being aware of front wheel traction. Oh, and the other tip I have for going a leetle bit faster on a big bike is when cornering (on or off road), change up one gear from normal. Hitting the apex deep into your bikes powerband makes it feel busy and difficult to handle, whereas if you change up chances are you'll torque it out the bend and be much smoother (difficult to explain - just try it).

[Ocean1]

just gotta get the hang of changing gears while standing now.

Change gear? On a fookin' big single like that?

Seriously, one of the things I used to notice about the quick dudes in the short time I got to view them is how they seem to slot a reasonably tall gear and just leave it there. Bit of clutch in the tight bits and just grunt away down the straight bits.

[pampa]

I've collected a few links with riding techniques that I found usefull (some of them provided by known very good riders like Jimmy Lewis).

http://www.gunsmoke.com/vacations/ji...005/index.html
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showt...=232895&page=1
http://www.africabiketours.com/GravelRiding.html

On the first one you can extract a few drills you can practice (I've summarised at the end).

As a note I'd never been offroad before last year and while still a noob I'm a little bit more confident (very little ) but much better than before trying them. This is the list of tips extracted from the course, hope it helps since they're from my notes

1. We were to weight and un-weight the foot pegs left to right and observe that weight on inside peg steers bike in that direction
2. Next up was a rear braking drill where we were to skid to a stop in a straight line
3. used a mark to slide rear end out to one side, again braking to a stop. Caution: do not to let up on the brake until stopped, as doing so would probably result in a high side, with us being thrown off the machines
4. The ultimate evolution of this maneuver was to turn slightly to the left or right and skid rear wheel, again to a stop
4.1. Note: During all of this we kept the speed low, no more than 20 MPH or so, and we used only the rear brake, always leaving it on until we stopped.
5. This is intended only to get used to the feeling of the front wheel skidding. While giving bike gas, gradually apply the front brake until front wheel skide. Then released the brake when bike started to fall or otherwise misbehave. The idea is to see how far we could skid the front wheel, and still keep control of the motorcycle
6. The emergency stop drill combined front and rear braking. It is a four step process:
6.1. roll off the throttle,
6.2. pull in the clutch,
6.3. butt goes back but stays above seat,
6.4. arms out front but not stiff,
6.5. then hit the back brake while modulating front.
6.6. Note: That’s a lot to remember all at once, so start slow and deliberate, gradually reducing the time between each step until it become one very short sequence. Done properly, the bike would come to a full stop and we could keep it balanced while we chose which foot to put down. Usually though, we’d be just a little unbalanced at the end and be reaching out with a foot to keep from falling over. Jimmy had us practice until we could pick which foot to use, an especially tricky feat if you wanted to put your right foot down.
7. wheelie
8. Riding in circles.
8.1. Weight the outside peg, with the inside foot of the peg (sitting on the saddle).
8.2. Pointing the inside foot (leg straight and outstretched) controlled the radious of the circle.
8.2.1. Point the inside foot forward and you get a wide circle
8.2.2. Move the inside foot back toward the page an the circle magically tightens
8.2.3. slid your fanny off the seat to the outside of the circle, still weighting the outside peg, and decrease speed. the circle tightened even more
9. Sliding from one outside position to the opposite side smoothly flipped the bike into turning in the opposite direction
10. Emergency stops, but this time the task is to transmit as fast as possible from max acceleration to max braking. Doing the following
10.1. Whack open the throttle
10.2. then roll off,
10.3. pull in the clutch,
10.4. butt back and off the seat,
10.5. arms outstretched,
10.6. quickly but smoothly apply both and rear brake,
10.7. and pick the side you want your foot to come down on, the right side for extra points
11. The barrel race, doing
11.1. accelerate hard toward a cone,
11.2. brake and
11.3. slide out the rear wheel to set up for a turn around the cone,
11.4. slip your butt off the seat to the outside,
11.5. wight the outside peg,
11.6. circle the cone once
11.7. then straighten out the bike and accelerate hard toward the finish line
11.8. then emergency brake to the line
12. Going steep downhill, how to balance the bike on the hill
12.1. Killing the motor while in gear and
12.2. letting the clutch act like a rear brake, stressing on maintaining balance, and not wear ourselves out holding up the motorcycle
12.3. Coming down, he used the clutch and front brake to walk the bike would inch forward as the front suspension extended and the rear collapsed.
12.4. then hold front brake,
12.5. release the clutch, the front end would collapse while the back came up allowing the bike will inch forward again.
12.5.1. Note: the beauty of this technique is that it freed either foot to hold the bike up, and still retained perfect control of forward progress.
13. Going steep uphill,
14. Crossing washes, the best technique is
14.1. standing on the pegs,
14.2. legs slightly flexed,
14.3. no weight on my hands, loose grip on bars
14.4. keep balance on the pegs and let the bike move under you
14.5. slow before entering a wash, then accelerate slightly or use steady throttle through loose stuff
14.6. steering by weighting your feet would work much better than steering with the bars


Cheers

[JATZ]

Change gear? On a fookin' big single like that?

Seriously, one of the things I used to notice about the quick dudes in the short time I got to view them is how they seem to slot a reasonably tall gear and just leave it there. Bit of clutch in the tight bits and just grunt away down the straight bits.

I love that second gear, useable from idle revs until it just about shakes you off the bike

[cooneyr]

...I may have to try some risers on Gonzo as when riding standing up my arms are still pulled down & back - can't really get into a neutral position.

I'm 6'2" with long arms (ape - finger tip to finger tip is longer than I am tall) and was never comfortable standing. I bent my steel bars on a ride and started looking into what bend bars to get. I ended up with 971 bend renthals (see here). These bars are further forward than most and are about as far forward as you can get. Cause the 971's are not overly tall I stuck 30mm risers on as well (check that the cables can reach first!). While height is important the bend of the bar makes a big difference as well.

Cheers R

[Oscar]

I'm 6'2" with long arms (ape - finger tip to finger tip is longer than I am tall) and was never comfortable standing. I bent my steel bars on a ride and started looking into what bend bars to get. I ended up with 971 bend renthals (see here). These bars are further forward than most and are about as far forward as you can get. Cause the 971's are not overly tall I stuck 30mm risers on as well (check that the cables can reach first!). While height is important the bend of the bar makes a big difference as well.

Cheers R

I just put 25mm risers on the 950 bars (and I have a set for the 640).
I'm just over six foot, and it makes things much more comfortable when standing (wish I done it ages ago).

[warewolf]

One thing i hve found on the PD is that having a full tank of gas (35lts) settles the bike no end, goes from being "wishy-washy" at 60-70km/h to stable as rock at 110 on the same section of road

Two potential reasons for this. Firstly my Triumph Triple exhibits the same behaviour, it has a 25L tank and feels much more planted with a full tank. It's kinda symptomatic of the suspension not being right, ie it is better at full load than at partial.

Secondly, a big tank partially full creates petrol tsunamis. I've spoken with PD riders who have biffed the big 35L tank in favour of the 15L(?) for technical work. The big tank allows the partial load to slosh around. Riding transalper's DR650 with the big tank, after tipping the bike in to a corner (or getting on the brakes hard), the petrol would slosh forward slightly delayed from the chassis of the bike moving, and make the front wheel suddenly lurch & break traction, after the bike was settled from the original input. Not very nice!

The recurring theme seems to be not to be afraid of using the throttle around corners. Unfortunately it is the reverse reaction to what my instincts often tell me. Teaching my instincts may be in order.

Read some Keith Code - I have all the books if you want to borrow them, the vid has gone out on permanent loan somewhere - he says it is wrong to say someone has "natural talent" when it comes to riding. It is an un-natural skill that must be learnt, and one of his key tenets is to over-ride inappropriate survival reactions with the appropriate skill. (Actually it is to understand what triggers them, why they aren't right, and how to avoid them triggering by understanding what is happening and what the right action is.)

The phrase "if in doubt, power out" is applicable here, mostly. One of the reasons people who rode dirt bikes as kids - especially those who never stopped - are highly competent off-road is that they learnt to ride somewhat aggressively from a sense of youthful invincibility, or peer pressure, or lots of time mucking around on bikes, or any combination thereof. I've watched other people riding and often thought, "the only reason he got through there okay was because he didn't have the balls to back off!" and later you hear in the pits or the pub, "feck I nearly crashed there but I kept it tapped, prayed, and it all stayed together".