KTM990 throttle snatch?

[ducatijim]

Ok you guys, I know youre out there watching....I'm watching the hit counter so I know, see!
How about these questions;

1) Anyone had a DEFINITIVE result with the obscure; 2 bar from cold and 2 minute warm, uninterupted idle run-up fixing throttle snatch?
( For everyone who says yes, another says no-differant. Beats me that a 'modern' ecm system should need any such protracted 're-boot' process everytime it is started?)
AND:
2) Who has removed the upper butterflys and seen an improvement OR otherwise? ( again I wonder if a modern company could 'unnecessarily' fit these things if they are to the DETRIMENT of performance?Although I belive they are only there as part of the emissions control system-to prevent overfuelling?) This fix also had about a 1-1 better/no-better result overseas
OR:
3) There are still other processes like trying to modify the way the MAP system( is that the right one?) reads the manifold pressure, even linking the 2 together, but I really do struggle to see that we, as owners, should need to do such invasive alterations to eliminate a problem that the factory could have done in a millisecond with a click of the mouse in the right place!

Comon you owners, don't be afraid to admit that KTM may have got it wrong, lets save future owners/potential owners the frustration of banging their head against the wall!( and provide a fix for all,including those who 'don't' have a problem!)

Big thanks in advance.

[Crisis management]

You've been searching through the other forums as well, haven't you......

I have no answers Jamie, I'm too fresh to my 990 to have tried much, the only comment I have is the one the previous owner passed to me: "the akras and a remap got rid of the snatchyness"

My take on the fueling from reading widely:
There are various maps out there and some bike / rider combinations don't seem bothered, some do. The G2 throttle cams have some merit, I have some here but haven't played with them yet, as for the secondary butterflies, remapping etc, the only way to really do something with that is put it on a dyno and get some real readings anything else is speculation. Have a read of the current thread in Orange crush (ADv rider) and you find everyone has an opinion and eveyone is different..... I trust the french guy Auriel? he seems to be a reliable poster.

My limited experience with the bike is that the throttle is not too snatchy down low, it feels like my 200exc really, keep the throttle steady and regulate speed with the clutch at low speeds, I don't expect it to trickle around tree stumps at idle.

Maybe worth riding some other 990's to get a feel for them? The couple I have ridden felt the same down low so maybe yours is normal or maybe not?

Now wasn't that helpful, I'm sure you feel better already!

[Gremlin]

Does anyone know if the new 990 adventure features the latest ecu technology from ktm?

I believe the new bikes are coming out with fairly advanced features, and shortly software will be available to do more than just change the loaded map

[ducatijim]

[QUOTE=Crisis management;1766615]You've been searching through the other forums as well, haven't you......

I have no answers Jamie, I'm too fresh to my 990 to have tried much, the only comment I have is the one the previous owner passed to me: "the akras and a remap got rid of the snatchyness"

QUOTE]


Thanks for that Iain, its much as I have also generaised ! As for any opening up and free-flowing the ex and a re-map, well man the lack of fuel economy stock already jeopadises my plans for this bike = 16km/L 1 up unladen with easy throttle use. Any worse than this and it will not take us where I want to go in Oz.

[Triwi]

DucJim
You are so right that KTM should have attended to the 990 FI issue. It is not up to the owner who has just paid $23k. At those dollars it was a conscious descision not to go 1200GS instead. I waited to get an 08 model convinced that they would have attended to the prob, as they have been good at updating other issues. Not so. I have no realistic option now but to do what I can to make it more rideable in technical situations, hence a 400 cam, dampen the hairtrigger return, and yesterday fitted an ignition switch on dash to allow easier switching to hi/lo octane fuel rather than pulling wire under seat. Am interested to see if switching to low setting (retard) has any effect on throttle response.
Fuel economy is vexing. Fixed throttle cruise (up to 5000rpm) gets me easily into the 17k p l range. (1 up medium load). Any roll ons of substance above 5000 and its in the 15's. I bought the bike specifically for touring in Oz so will refit the 42 rear sprocket (17/42). I have also fitted a 2 into one collector exiting into a purpose built Neptune muffler and fitted a 5.5litre alloy tank in place of lh muffler. Better use of weight all round. I can realistically now think about 400k range - given the type of Oz touring I do which is generally the eastern areas Cairns to Melbourne up to 500k west of coastline. Sort of. No desert crossings or deep sand anyway. My riding consists of transiting at steady cruise or exploring in national parks or around country towns. All this is really saying that I'm happy the fuel economy can be acceptably controlled for my sort of work. (Mind you if I'd bought a 1200 I wouldnt have to be so aware of it.)
It does have to be said tho that the superb all round handling, comfort and wind protection I find really great. Its a natural transition to standing so sudden water crossings and dropouts , coupled with that suspension, are coped with easily. I have watched in some awe 990's on two Yamaha 3 day Adv rides, so clearly the throttle issue can be 'ridden through'
However for my version of adventure touring (laden,remote, and alone) it's a great machine flawed by that snatchy throttle and questionable fuel economy.
A great pity
Triwi

[ducatijim]

Great review thanks Triwi, very candid. I am a BMW owner already, a satisfied one at that, so gave the 1200gs a good trial;big ups to Experience BMW, but felt it 'felt' too big for a wee bloke like me. Was a stretch to the bars at full lock and the front generally felt 'detached'( like my Kr I suppose) not what you want in a multi-road bike!
All ergos, bar wind noise, are very good stock on the Kt; it is a well sorted package right off the floor.....except the efi.
I wanted it mainly to take to Oz like you, but for 2-up with gear riding: no room for xtra fuel....now my range is looking to not exceed 350km, if even do that much fully loaded. I will look at returning the 17t cs sprocket, however, she is a little out of the sweet spot in that gearing, cruising at NZ and all but NT road speeds.
Your idea to use the useless xtra muffler space as a fuel reserve is genius I must say, but as a skill-less 'sod-basher' it is way outside my abilities! and to find someone who will do this kind of work from an idea is not so easy here in the land of cows and trees!
If I can motivate to it, I will 'cam' my own throttle( us exchange rate v bad to buy G2 now), and then, if necessary, move into ripping out the un-necessary xtra butterflies: see what that does....then maybe go back to Henry @ Exp!! if that fails!!

I tend to wonder if the almost 'silence' on this subject means I have touched on a sore point that most owners won't publicly confess to? I did expect MUCH more imput on this....there are a hell of a lot of these things out there??

[warewolf]

no room for xtra fuel....now my range is looking to not exceed 350km, if even do that much fully loaded.

Try a Safari Tank, pricey but should do the biz: Safari Fuel Tanks: KTM. Might be cheaper ex-USA.

KTM 950/990LC8

Litres: 40
Colours: Orange, Black or Translucent White
Fits: 950 & 990LC8 models - please specify when ordering
The amazingly small increase in size, given the huge increase in capacity, comes from the fuel being held low over a wider area.
Includes: Fuel caps
The two tanks replace the stock ones, plus the fairing shrouds. The glovebox is retained, and the black skid panels on the base of each tank are easily and cheaply replaced if damaged in a crash.


Cost: AUD $1,694.00 (inc GST)

[young1]

Jamie have a ride on my some time, I don't notice anything that you talk about, all AFC did was fix the throttle. They have sold a sh!t load of 990s now (including a 990S to a friend of mine here last week), maybe ring Brendan there and ask him?

[ducatijim]

Jamie have a ride on my some time, I don't notice anything that you talk about, all AFC did was fix the throttle. They have sold a sh!t load of 990s now (including a 990S to a friend of mine here last week), maybe ring Brendan there and ask him?

I understand what youre saying Mike, I am WELL aware that this problem is not in ALL 990's, no question, and I also suspect that the degree of issue is vairable. My selling dealer is NOT interested in a fix - there is no problem if you listen to them!( In fact, I have been waiting 2 weeks for them to come back with KTM NZ's take on this!!!!) So I would doubt some other dealer, who has no obligation to me or my bike, would be even remotely interested: you do these people an injustice to indicate they have any interest in anything other than making money and trying to keep their existing customer base intact.
The ONLY dealer( and I have dealt with many now...TOO many in fact!) who I found ever gave a damn was Exp BMW ( Henry Plowright) in Kingsland.....top people who look after their customers very well....I had some serious issues with both of the Bm's I have owned and you know what? They NEVER told me that they had never seen it before/heard of it before. And they always fixed it too!
No Mike, it is going to take a 'homer' to get on top of this problem, but hey, so glad you have a 'good' one mate!

Wolfie....Safari tanks? You used one? I have fitted one to my DR....a bloody aweful fit: would not part with $2K for that lump of plastic!
I only wanted around 400k range, if I was doing a safari again, I would have a Dakar or GSa with the big tanks ex factory!

[warewolf]

Wolfie....Safari tanks? You used one? I have fitted one to my DR....a bloody aweful fit: would not part with $2K for that lump of plastic!

Not used one myself, but never had any feedback on them either, apart from in magazines where the reviewers were always happy.

[ducatijim]

Colin, on the dr, which only effectivly has 1 bolt on point for the tank, the fit was rubbish....need a pinchbar every single time you fit/re-fit the tank to make the bolt hole align !
Indicators strike the tank at each full-lock of bars.
Found out later that a reflector mount on each side of lower t-clamp was quietly erroding the tank each time full loc was used.

I feel that when you transpose those issues over a tank as complicated as the 990 one, there is too much margin for error in the fitment, would be differant if one was dealing with the supplier or his agent, but when you buy via the web, well, buyer beware!

Otherwise, a most excellent product.

[buzzard]

Hi, I have an 06 990, one of the first couple brought in to NZ. Ive done about 24k on it and have had no real throttle snatchiness until recently. Sure I have had to be cognisant of its sensitivity relative to other bikes but I have not found it too bad.

However I recently had it serviced and the throttle is now snatchy and surges between 3k and 4k. Fuel economy has also gone downhill and I am getting about 30-40km less a tank than i was (previously got around 17l per k and now get around 14.5l). All pretty unsatisfactory. I think it is to do with the new mappings that may have been uploaded, as previously i have been running on the stock mapping. I have just (yesterday had another tune done so am yet to see if economy has changed).

Does anyone know a mechanic (in Auckland) who knows these machines and tune them well? I know that John at Amps used to do a great job but left for greener pastures at Haldanes.

cheers

[ducatijim]

Thats interesting to hear. I was getting around 19k/l on the 07 map, but have dropped to 16k/l now the 08 map is loaded. I could easily imagine sub 15 with spirited riding!!
I too would like to know who is a good man to keep(get?) these bikes operating to their best.

[Crisis management]

So, how did you get on with the angle grinder DJ?

Are we now sourcing a new throttle tube and parts for throttle bodies????


FYI, my 06, mapped for the akras got 280 out of one tank then 350 out of the next both with similar running conditions....14 to 17.5km/l without any obvious change, and yes, I was measuring carefully and I'm still running the 17 tooth (cause I can't get the bloody nut off to change it!!!)

[ducatijim]

So, how did you get on with the angle grinder DJ?Spectacularly!

Are we now sourcing a new throttle tube and parts for throttle bodies????
I used to build small flying models, this was a cake walk Iain!!


FYI, my 06, mapped for the akras got 280 out of one tank then 350 out of the next both with similar running conditions....14 to 17.5km/l without any obvious change, and yes, I was measuring carefully and I'm still running the 17 tooth (cause I can't get the bloody nut off to change it!!!)Just when I think I'm getting traction, you go and blow me right outa the water don't ya Iain!!

Job done. Initial brief test( its raining here!!) indicate a marked improvement-I now have a gradual 'decceleration' action available on my right wrist...imagine that!!!

Will do more exhaustive investigation and report back.