Fast and Safe

[Mongoose]

I am fixated on what works and what doesn't work, that is all. What we might think minimises risk doesn't matter. What matters is what actually does minimise risk. To find out we have to investigate and measure things.

But you DO NOT know what works, its all an experiment to you, its all theory not proof.
Are you in any way suggesting that a lower speed does not minimise the risk of unjury/death?

[Mongoose]

Maybe a good start would be to require people have insurance and let the insurance companies put the pressure on their customers. No insurance, no entrance to private toll roads.

Oh, and as usual when the govt runs things, if they drive on public roads without insurance we'll fine and/or jail them. Anything the govt runs, it has to invent yet more crimes to manage it.

Sounds like another form of tax to me, just the place it is going is different. I mean that private business is going to want to pay for what the build PLUS make a profit PLUS have enough to mantian their asset. Who will police these private roads, private police?
Compulsory insurance has done a great job of reducing the cost of insuring in places like the UK has it?

[hobdar]

I am fixated on what works and what doesn't work, that is all. What we might think minimises risk doesn't matter. What matters is what actually does minimise risk. To find out we have to investigate and measure things.

Actually i think you have reached a conclusion and then looked for facts to back them up. The american study as per my last post you quoted used data for 3 years 1996 - 1999 and only used very small sections of road and concluded that speed is in fact a significant issue still in road safety.

The conclusion indicated in that study (not the persons unpublished (read non-peer reviewed) dissertation) was that there was little to be gained from increasing the speed limit i.e. the imfamous cost/benefit ratio. The study also indicated that the impact in the rural areas was that there would be a higher road toll which I would assume reflects NZ roads much better than comparing the US Highways or the German Autobahns.

Personally i think to achieve your 4 lane highway we should increase the taxes of companies and those people who are in the top tax bracket... (PT)

[Mongoose]

Actually i think you have reached a conclusion and then looked for facts to back them up. :

Alan is after all a statistician

[James Deuce]

As I have said, almost always drivers get it right. Occasionally, not, and we should investigate those cases properly to find out why and what we can do to avoid recurrence.

From personal experience, and I am sure that most active motorcyclists would agree, most drivers do NOT almost always get it right. Collect data from motorcyclists and you would have a very bleak picture about the ability of most drivers to negotiate a straight piece of two lane highway.

Collecting the data could be problematic though. If I was required to log every example of a driver not complying with the road rules, or making a decision that put someone else at risk, it would take me two to three hours to ride the 22km to or from work. It is more by luck and ingrained habit that most drivers get it something like right.

The most annoying thing is that I've just made a subjective judgement of the driving standards in the Wellington/Wairarapa region, and I'm about to be informed that my opinion is unwanted.

[spudchucka]

Oh, and as usual when the govt runs things, if they drive on public roads without insurance we'll fine and/or jail them. Anything the govt runs, it has to invent yet more crimes to manage it.

What do you suggest they do to punish all the miscreants? Take their birthdays away from them?

[John]

What do you suggest they do to punish all the miscreants? Take their birthdays away from them?

..?

sacrific their first born to judist preists.

[spudchucka]

It is a decision a driver makes every moment - what speed to travel at. Whether it is above or below the posted speed limit makes no difference whatever. The risk and outcome possibilities are exactly the same.

I can't see how you arrive at that. In terms of traffic crashes the risks and and outcome possibilities only get worse as speed increases. Reaction times, stopping distances, the ability to effectively scan for hazards, the negative effectcs of a sudden reduction in forward momentum, physics, human falability etc etc etc all say increased speed means increased risk.

[spudchucka]

For example, bored drivers forced to travel at 90 km/h when they want to travel at 120 km/h?

There is no reason to increase the speed limit simply because some people find it boring. Some road users find 110 terrifying but I suppose you would ban these otherwise legitimate road users from sharing your playground.

Only if it does minimise the risk. My point is that it doesn't, hasn't and won't.

You are having a hard time proving your point as far as I can see.

[spudchucka]

..?

sacrific their first born to judist preists.

Never liked Judas Priest. I was always more of a Led Zeppelin, Deep Purple, Fleetwood Mac (the original fleetwood, not the wussy girl stuff they did with Stevie Nicks) kinda guy.

[Slipstream]

..?

sacrific their first born to judist preists.

what is it with you and sacrificing first borns????

[John]

what is it with you and sacrificing first borns????

I have not had one yet, so the options still on the table.

[Waylander]

..?

sacrific their first born to judist preists.

Are you a middle child John?

[John]

But on topic, I totally agree with you spud, and only can register my vote for you because your saying everything I beleave so heres a cold one

Are you a middle child John?

actually yes...lol only had a step brother and sister.

[Slipstream]

There is no reason to increase the speed limit simply because some people find it boring. Some road users find 110 terrifying but I suppose you would ban these otherwise legitimate road users from sharing your playground.

You are having a hard time proving your point as far as I can see.

I sometimes find it confusing why some roads are the speed they are. Who decides them? I mean, how do they work it out?