Riding in groups - Some of you have no idea!

[sinfull]

O yea...been there.. done this..however this above is pack riding....not group riding..diff is wearing on back an what relates too..social riding as what...group riding is classed as..

Was gonna post a reply much the same to Ixions post !
Done a little bit of pack riding myself (years ago ! Hey i'm old now) and what he says is mostly correct, with pack runs (in my case there was more harleys than anything else) the front guy starts a run and (usually) the car pulls left due to the sound of drag pipes all lighting up at once and he's all of a sudden aware there is a mob of bikes flying past ! And yes if the guy in front twists the throttle, so do you, or yr liable to get the bike behind you up yr arse ! I'm talking pak rides, forget the c cause there aint no room for a letter c between one bike and the next ! still staggered but (usually) only enough room for the left track guy to swing in line to pass, then hook left track as soon as he's done it !
Unfortunately when things go bad it usually ends up in at least three bikes going down !
4 guys i know from around these ways, went down together on a ride a few weeks ago, due to a car cutting them off, all 4 went off the road together 2 are still in intensive !
Although it is an adrenilyn rush to ride that way, i think i'd much prefer to sit on another guy (or gals) back wheel on the track nowdays ! Same rush and *far safer* not to mention i can pass him anytime (hehe or not)! then again i don't associate with many clubs now either, on a dif buzz)

Group rides, such as a few i have been on with KBers, i leave a hell of a lot more room than say, i would with a group of mates who i know how they ride and vice versa !
Allthough *EVERYONE* on here is obviously a marvelous person and i wouldn't even think i had the riding ability, to say i'm better than any on here, it's just that there would unlikely be many on here who know how i ride, when i will jump, twitch, fart or brake AND vice versa, apart from the odd few i have tried to keep up to on the track ! So why the hell would i/you want to ride on yr/my shoulder ! Being on the same forum is one thing but i sure as hell don't want be in the same ward as you cause you twitched left and braked, when i went right and give it a fist full to get out of trouble !

I ride on the left wheel track on the road in a group by the way !!!! If i do jump the cue in front of you, it aint cause ya smell, it will be because you don't have a left hook mirror just like me and i cant see your eyes (wink wink)!

[MSTRS:Me]

I've posted before: Staggered formation is wrong.

Essentially there is one optimum place to be on the road at a given time, and that should not be compromised by proximity to another vehicle, apparently 'friendly' or not.

I remember...and I still think "You what?"
Do you understand the term 'staggered'? The guys in that clip are Line Astern.
But if you follow the 2 second rule, and are unhappy with someone less than 2 secs ahead (but in the other wheel track), then why don't you assume duties as TEC?

[alanzs]

I ride at the back and watch it all happen. And, I live to ride another day...

[Katman]

Those who do not observe the propierties end up having a painful interview with the Master at Arms.

I bet you wouldn't tell that same Master at Arms that you've passed on their pack riding techniques to "a lovely bunch of guys and girls on an internet website that I could give you the address of if you're interested".

[Mom]

eh? Its good fun riding in close formation. It gives me something interesting to do while we putter along at 90k.

Yeah some things are dangerous, but also they are fun so we do them from time to time for kicks. Thats what motorcycling IS innit? Or do we always ONLY do safe stuff? Why ride a bike if we can't misbehave? Whats the point to that?

Steve

Remind me never ever to be on my motorcycle anywhere you are riding mate! What an irresponsible, stupid friggen post!

[MSTRS:Me]

Remind me never ever to be on my motorcycle anywhere you are riding mate! What an irresponsible, stupid friggen post!

Ooooh Mom. Careful. He'll get all upset. He doesn't like it when his posts are treated with derision/scorn/contempt. He also doesn't like it when he's told his smile will get re-arranged if he tries that shit round me or mine.
DAMHIK

[NighthawkNZ:Me]

Remind me never ever to be on my motorcycle anywhere you are riding mate! What an irresponsible, stupid friggen post!

same... a complete twat if you ask me... but well no body asked...

[warewolf]

Do you understand the term 'staggered'? The guys in that clip are Line Astern.

Oh yes, I understand the term staggered. Do you understand the term sarcasm?

Staggered formation basically says, "I am going to ignore the guidelines for optimum safe riding in order that the group takes up less space on the road". It presumes - erroneously - that the nearby riders are no threat, and that saving space on the road is a worthwhile endeavour. This goes against the entire point of safe riding taught at every training course I have done, every riding technique book I have read, where every vehicle is considered a threat, and you maximise your buffer space from them: both front/rear and to the sides.

Re-defining your buffer space as half of "your" lane to allow a staggered bike doesn't cut it. I think this is the main point of contention: those in favour reckon they still have an acceptable buffer zone, as they trust the vehicle consuming half of their buffer; those against acknowledge the buffer is reduced as soon as any vehicle encroaches within it, supposedly a friendly or not.

Spacing out the stagger to 2+ seconds means the other bike is considered too far away to require action against the threat. In other words, taking up the same amount of space as independent non-grouped vehicles ... so can't be called staggered formation.

Staggering along the straights then adjusting speed into the corners doesn't cut it. It means that rather than adjusting speed to suit your riding conditions, you are adjusting your speed to satisfy the formation... definitely the lesser of the two goals. And right at the higher risk situation: the corner.

One of the dumbest moves I see ppl do while riding in staggered formation occurs along straights. I'll be in the right-hand wheel track, near the middle of the road, maximising distance from roadside hazards. As an oncoming vehicle approaches, I move to the left-hand wheel track to maximise the space to the biggest threat: the vehicle closing on me in the vicinity of 200km/h. The fellah behind is so hung up on riding in staggered formation, that he moves from the safe place (left hand wheel track) to the worst place (right hand wheel track) right at the time I have made the decision to move the other way - putting himself at unnecessary risk.

The solution is to ride your own ride: you put your bike in the best place for you, and don't trust anyone else to make decisions on your behalf.

then why don't you assume duties as TEC?

I might, if'n I knew what it was.

[NighthawkNZ:Me]

I might, if'n I knew what it was.

Tail End Charlie

[MSTRS:Me]

Long explanation that makes good sense....

I might, if'n I knew what it was.

Tail End Charlie

[warewolf]

TEC... right, I see, ta.

If I feel I'm too close to the vehicle in front, I'll increase the gap. Don't have to go to TEC to achieve that. Or maybe if the gap keeps closing because they are consistently slower than I am, I'll pass them.

[Maha]

TEC... right, I see, ta.

If I feel I'm too close to the vehicle in front, I'll increase the gap. Don't have to go to TEC to achieve that. Or maybe if the gap keeps closing because they are consistently slower than I am, I'll pass them.

Then you could always be RIC ???

[warewolf]

Then you could always be RIC ???

Allrighty, translate that one, too

[yungatart]

Don't ride in groups. Simple.

Or...ride in sensible groups, where you know and trust your fellow riders.

[Maha]

Allrighty, translate that one, too

Check your User CP.....