Pack mentality

[The Stranger:Me]

The pack often attacks people, when they have not done anything wrong, everyone is allowed the opinions and ideas, some people put there ideas across in good ways others do not,

if everyone had same ideas nothing new would come.

I'm having problems remembering a situation where "the pack" has attacked someone who has done no wrong. Now sure, I accept that you guys do see more of this than the rest of us - hence my comment in the OP about making your life easier.
Opinions - sure lets have them, but if they have been chewed over and rejected - often on a robust basis, please stop trying to ram them down our throats at every opportunity. This is part of the taking clue to which I refer.




Honstly kb is like a school playground, kids picking on other kids, due to they act different talk different, or something different than normal.
Some people use online persons on site, and are very different on line.
Some people have personally clashes, people have falling outs, and like always you will get fuckwits & dickheads in every group no matter what no way you can stop it.

But members should not be repeatly targeted by a many members of the pack for really doing bad.

Why? A couple of young riders were fooken dangerous and one put a life close to me at risk. Many others felt similarly at risk from their riding. These riders were first offered constructive advice and assistance by many. They choose not to accpet it. a solution was imposed upon them by the pack. Interestingly, they pose little risk now. Remind me again why it's a bad thing.

Some people really need to grow up, pull head out of there arses, and actually do something go ride play in garage, go enjoy friends, and meet some people off real life people.

We are all bikers a small % of nz total population we shouldn't be targeting each other due to somethign minor we should be trying to make NZ a safer/better place for motorcycles, and not targeting each other for jobs/looks/beliefs.

Jobs? - whilst it may seem a bit silly on the face of it, FFS, should a "janitor" really be lecturing a CEO on business management? Even if they should, at least base it in fact.
Why should I bother with someone’s job?
To discredit them.
Why?

We'll take a hypothetical situation.
Fred asks about squeaking brakes. Said janitor replies spray them with CRC. Fred being a noob goes out and does so, rides down the road and bins - or worse.
Should janitor be hauled over the coals for being a janitor?
No, that would be silly.

But should janitor repeatedly and consistently give dangerous advice and resists all advice and requests not to (and yes janitor did received such advice and requests from me) i.e. fail to receive clue - it becomes easier to discredit the person than to continually discredit each individual piece of crap.

[Tank]

I'd be interested to know what your definition of "the greater good" is in this instance.

In all seriousness ....(Using Katman as an example)

I honestly believe that if you listened to some of the feedback from a lot of posters (the 'pack') and didnt bang on with the same story in pretty much every thread then your message wouldn't become boring background noise and would have more impact when you did bring it up.

I actually agree with your position - I think that a lot of people here do - but I believe you are doing it a disservice.

Thus - the pack eats its young - the young (using the term loosely) listens and changes behaviour - and then when the message is made it actually has impact (again). And that (in this instance) would be a greater good.

[Katman]

and didnt bang on with the same story in pretty much every thread

I'm sorry Tank.

So how's the weather up your way?

Read any good books lately?

[The Lone Rider]

I have taken the approach, over time, as using KB as simply a place to read and write about bikes, find out tid bits about whats going on in terms of events, and thats it. I stick to my own club mates, as they are club mates for a good reason. Many use KB also, in much the same way I do.

Some call themselves the KBers.. thats pack mentality with no rules or guidlines. They act like a club, arranging KB events or meetings amongst KB users. For now, all I've really heard of is of crashes, bins, drops, and vomitting.

I guess that isn't too bad.

[Mom]

There was a time that the technical forums were heavily moderated around dangerous advice being given out, posts removed and the like. Also for being silly in them (not that I ever did anything like that of course Perhaps it is not so well moderated now, if the janitor can advise the biker to CRC his brakes and not have the advice censured by the site.

On the whole this KB community is like a big family (que Bliss Ninny nomination again) and in my experience members go out of their way to help and support other members. Not being face to face with someone makes it hard for people to pick up nuances and body language and take offense at what is posted where none is intended. Then again there are some incredibly soft skinned members that take offense at almost anything.

Getting back to the OP statement that perhaps the pack should be listened to more often is valid in some cases. Bleating about being given a hard time for posting dangerous and continuously stupid things perhaps should be viewed a bit closer by the moderating team as a heads up to ongoing potential "issues" arising each time said stupid things are posted.

[The Stranger:Me]

Thus - the pack eats its young - the young (using the term loosely) listens and changes behaviour

Ironic you use the term "eats it's young".
The young it seems are at least capable of learning and of change.
Unfortunately many of the old are too set in thier ways to learn, adapt or change.

[Katman]

Unfortunately many of the old are too set in thier ways to learn, adapt or change.

Hey, steady on.

I'm younger than you.

[Oscar]

Ironic you use the term "eats it's young".
The young it seems are at least capable of learning and of change.
Unfortunately many of the old are too set in thier ways to learn, adapt or change.

It's the old story about there being no "...old, bold riders."
However, I do think there are lots of young 'uns here who will listen (well, maybe in the specialist areas). It's just that the young louder, stupider idjuts do tend to stand out...Moron Few, anyone?

[The Stranger:Me]

Hey, steady on.

I'm younger than you.

What on earth would make you think I was talking about you?

[Katman]

What on earth would make you think I was talking about you?

That's what the was there for.

[Cajun]

Jobs? - whilst it may seem a bit silly on the face of it, FFS, should a "janitor" really be lecturing a CEO on business management? Even if they should, at least base it in fact.
Why should I bother with someone’s job?
To discredit them.
Why?

We'll take a hypothetical situation.
Fred asks about squeaking brakes. Said janitor replies spray them with CRC. Fred being a noob goes out and does so, rides down the road and bins - or worse.
Should janitor be hauled over the coals for being a janitor?
No, that would be silly.

But should janitor repeatedly and consistently give dangerous advice and resists all advice and requests not to (and yes janitor did received such advice and requests from me) i.e. fail to receive clue - it becomes easier to discredit the person than to continually discredit each individual piece of crap.

You are looking at one occurance of this. I have been a senior mod for 18+ months now and been on kb for 5+ years, i been seeing people target people for all sorts of crap, some small some large, people actively stalking people around site attacking them, often for no reason other than to be fuckwits, people threating people via pm/txt/phone calls, people get other members to target people people.

The rules on kb are very lax as a whole, and many alot of things let slide here that most other bike forums do not.

The world is full of people with bullshit information, some of them you can teach some of them you can not, and abusing them isn't gonna fix it, sometimes they never will, sometimes they need something drastic in there life to change, sometimes it just takes time. and no abuse is gonna happen, its more gonna reforce their beliefs.

but noel honestly like you said in a comment above some people are old and set in there ways and never learn, and that goes in both directions.

-----
and well site has many sheep, wouldn't call them a pack, more like sheep who follow around some more popular members, who like to pick on people cause they have complex of some kind, small man syndom, small cock syndom, small tit syndom or something.

This is funny its also region/island based have.

Also many people who are friends offline also follow them around like sheep

[AlBundy]

Is it tiring jumping to those conclusions...?

By your statement, you imply most people DON'T ride like this?

http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/sh...&postcount=185

[Cajun]

There was a time that the technical forums were heavily moderated around dangerous advice being given out, posts removed and the like. Also for being silly in them (not that I ever did anything like that of course Perhaps it is not so well moderated now, if the janitor can advise the biker to CRC his brakes and not have the advice censured by the site.

On the whole this KB community is like a big family (que Bliss Ninny nomination again) and in my experience members go out of their way to help and support other members. Not being face to face with someone makes it hard for people to pick up nuances and body language and take offense at what is posted where none is intended. Then again there are some incredibly soft skinned members that take offense at almost anything.

Getting back to the OP statement that perhaps the pack should be listened to more often is valid in some cases. Bleating about being given a hard time for posting dangerous and continuously stupid things perhaps should be viewed a bit closer by the moderating team as a heads up to ongoing potential "issues" arising each time said stupid things are posted.

but then the site gets turned in to be over modded, and we get cryed at cause peoples post go to pd.

Why should some be targeted if they are doing there best with information they have(at least they trying to help, be it with wrong information).

Maybe should take a harder line to people more quickly who abuse people as well as people who post bad information?

[The Stranger:Me]

You are looking at one occurance of this. I have been a senior mod for 18+ months now and been on kb for 5+ years, i been seeing people target people for all sorts of crap, some small some large, people actively stalking people around site attacking them, often for no reason other than to be fuckwits, people threating people via pm/txt/phone calls, people get other members to target people people.

The rules on kb are very lax as a whole, and many alot of things let slide here that most other bike forums do not.

The world is full of people with bullshit information, some of them you can teach some of them you can not, and abusing them isn't gonna fix it, sometimes they never will, sometimes they need something drastic in there life to change, sometimes it just takes time. and no abuse is gonna happen, its more gonna reforce their beliefs.

but noel honestly like you said in a comment above some people are old and set in there ways and never learn, and that goes in both directions.

I accept what you say there Cajun. No I don't see all and yes I hear of some stupid shit going on in PMs and red rep wars etc. I don't envy you your job.

I aren't seeking to have rules changed, nor am I bitching about being asked to modify my sig, avatar or user title. They really aren't important to me.

I would however like to point out that there are some reasons why some of this stuff happens - beyond a pack of meanies. You can accpet that perhaps there is another explanation or not. But if you are old and too set in your way so be it.

[Cajun]

I accept what you say there Cajun. No I don't see all and yes I hear of some stupid shit going on in PMs and red rep wars etc. I don't envy you your job.

I aren't seeking to have rules changed, nor am I bitching about being asked to modify my sig, avatar or user title. They really aren't important to me.

I would however like to point out that there are some reasons why some of this stuff happens - beyond a pack of meanies. You can accpet that perhaps there is another explanation or not. But if you are old and too set in your way so be it.

I know there are reason why it happens and not saying in this cause some of it was very self inflected, but sometimes someone just has to be the bigger man/woman/alien.

Some people will never learn/grow up/listen/take advise UNTIL they want to themselfs.

And well Everyone has a right to use the site, and not be abuse/indimated/made to feel inferror/etc by other members.

Many members use the site for the bike information, many people use site for social side, many people use site to case trouble, many use site to help people etc list goes on, we all here for different reasons.

But meh human nature sometimes happens, with people resulting to pack attacks, or fight or fright reactions etc.

home time for dinner and a walk