THE corner in the Rainbow

[cooneyr]

Time for a bit of a lesson. Ever heard of the three E's, Engineering, Education and Enforcement? Getting the right balance of the three E's is the approach taken to the operation of much of the transport system (whatever the mode of travel). Think of it like this - the TV ads showing the result of alcohol, tiredness and speed, the fact that police are on the roads, and the presence of road controlling authorities such as NZTA (of which the old Transit is a part) and City and District Councils.

Some of you lot are arguing that Education is an issue (riders not riding to the conditions or lacking skills to deal with the conditions). Yes I agree, however, I also believe there is an Engineering issue with the corner and I believe I'm more than qualified to make this statement.

Look at if from another perspective. We cannot "edumicate" everybody and even the "edumicated" are hurting themselves. Whatever the case, people are still getting hurt there at an alarming and what I believe is an unacceptable rate.

As enforcement is not an option at this site this leaves engineering. To this end it appears to me that the simple solution of modifying some bushes may go a long way to improving the visibility, and hence safety, of the corner.

I am not proposing to go out there and install hundreds of signs, I'm simply proposing to make subtle changes that are in keeping with the environment. Remember that the natural environment changes over time, specifically bushes grow, which will alter the visibility of the corner. If you look at the annotated photo it can be seen that the bushes immediately on the inside of the corner are small i.e. young and if the ones further from the corner were about 1/2 their size they would be below the downstream road level.

....I am able to offer a tandem trailer and any building materials at trade rates (timber, quickcrete etc for signage if we go that way), otherwise labour for any digging and transplanting.....

Thanks for the offer B. As mentioned above I'll post here when it is time to do some work onsite.

Cheers R

[clint640]

Could happily take that corner at 80-90 once you know the road, first time if you hit it at say 30 if you get into strife its easy to save, that particular bend even at 60 you could point the front into it and give her a handful of throttle to get you round.

The voice of adventure riding wisdom speaks...

Applying a handful of throttle if going too quick at the entry to a downhill, off camber gravel corner is unlikely to result in a favourable outcome

Ryan is dead right, a little engineering is what's required, 10 or even 1000people saying on here that people should just slow down & learn to ride properly will not stop a single person getting hurt at that corner. Cutting down a bit of scrub & maybe sticking up a sign almost definitely will.

Shit, in industry we spend 10's of thousands of dollars protecting people from potential hazards that haven't ever hurt anybody & are way more obvious than that corner.

Clint

[Peril]

Just to add to this.With Tony's crash,we weren't going that quick.My bike was leaking oil so the speed coming into that short straight was probably 50-60km/h at the most.I did see the road veer towards the river back before that corner as I remember looking out and seeing the flats and the river beside it,so I knew we were heading that way.

[warewolf]

I have to agree, given this particular corner is a known trouble spot, a bit of discreet engineering to eliminate the problem is a wise thing to do.

[skidMark]

The voice of adventure riding wisdom speaks...

Applying a handful of throttle if going too quick at the entry to a downhill, off camber gravel corner is unlikely to result in a favourable outcome

Ryan is dead right, a little engineering is what's required, 10 or even 1000people saying on here that people should just slow down & learn to ride properly will not stop a single person getting hurt at that corner. Cutting down a bit of scrub & maybe sticking up a sign almost definitely will.

Shit, in industry we spend 10's of thousands of dollars protecting people from potential hazards that haven't ever hurt anybody & are way more obvious than that corner.

Clint

Ahhh i did tour 3,000 k's of south island gravel roads a month...

I think i would have some idea, i didnt crash and i was on a 250 kilo katana inline four on dual purpose tyres.

I sai grab throttle for the fact of you want to cut the rear loose, my elaboration would be lock the rear to get it sliding then heave on some power, drift the rear and get yourself round the corner tighter...provided you are standing up and leant over the front the front will go where you point it.... kicking the rear out sideways is going to help you get round a tighter corner than you expected.

Skid.

[skidMark]

Experienced motorcyclists that are familar with handling characteristic's on gravel roads, should expect problems. As you would on any unfamilar road. Start putting up signs on "dangerous" corners, and the whole country will be inundated with them. It is a known "adventure" road. Treat it with respect, or it will bite you. (As it did)

Yeah what he said! Ya cant sign post everything... well you can, but doesnt that take the challenge out of it.

If you cant read corners you shouldnt be on a motorcycle... and if you dont know the road and cant see where the corner goes...as in this case.... then go slower!

If you can't see where the corner goes you don't just go ripping into it... you should be at a speed where if it does turn out to be a nasty corner you can save it....not go ohhh shit now that i can see it it's tight.... oh bollocks im going too fast...

Oh i'll blame the road.... it's the roads fault that it was a blind corner and i didnt slow down to be cautious.



Shouldnt be adventure riding if you cant cope with such a simple thought process.

[Crisis management]

Skiddie, I think you need to ride with people before you are in any position to comment on their abilities.

Their comments I trust, which either makes you a very good rider or misinformed, you choose.

[warewolf]

Oh i'll blame the road

That's an extreme view and you know damn well that ppl advocating a change to this corner aren't absolving people from taking due care.

There are the usual hazards we face, then there are the odd abnormally treacherous ones. It's not so much that this is a blind corner, but a sucker corner. Trite phrases about "ride to the conditions" are at odds with the admissions from sensible riders getting caught out.

We are not hypothesising; this corner is a proven issue - just the one in how many over the 250km of Molesworth/Rainbow roads? Well-considered pro-active action to reduce the likelihood of accidents at that one corner will not turn us into a Nanny State, nor impinge on the "adventure". You can bet that similar subtle action has already been taken at a bazillion corners in this country, you just weren't given the opportunity to comment.


PS When people die in the great outdoors, it's not usually due to one thing but rather a compounding sequence of conditions and events. Curiously, this corner has a similar profile, as Ryan has already outlined.

[CrazyFrog]

It's a funny thing when a lot of non-local adv "experts" feel they know enough about this exact corner to basically blame the rider for a mistake on a badly engineered corner. This corner has so much accident history attached to it, not only with bikes but also several 4 x 4's. No, I have not lost it on this corner, because I heeded others advice to watch out for it, however, the first time I rode it a few years back, yes, it gave me a good fright.
Someone mentioned filling the ditch with gravel to assist with overshoot...well, the f...ing corner is way off camber, difficult to correct on with rolling gravel under your wheels, then goes straight into a ditch, then swamp.....the deep drain is there to assist water channeling away from the road. Fact is, the corner is mostly blind and even a slower rider, driver can still be caught out by the way the corner tightens up.
In the whole of the Dusty Butt 1000kms, this was the only corner that raised any real concern, mostly by guys who have ridden this road and know it is a problem. What the hell is wrong with raising concern and awareness about it. If it was on a public highway, the crash stats would speak for themselves, and the roading engineers would have the problem adressed.

[skidMark]

It's a funny thing when a lot of non-local adv "experts" feel they know enough about this exact corner to basically blame the rider for a mistake on a badly engineered corner. This corner has so much accident history attached to it, not only with bikes but also several 4 x 4's. No, I have not lost it on this corner, because I heeded others advice to watch out for it, however, the first time I rode it a few years back, yes, it gave me a good fright.
Someone mentioned filling the ditch with gravel to assist with overshoot...well, the f...ing corner is way off camber, difficult to correct on with rolling gravel under your wheels, then goes straight into a ditch, then swamp.....the deep drain is there to assist water channeling away from the road. Fact is, the corner is mostly blind and even a slower rider, driver can still be caught out by the way the corner tightens up.
In the whole of the Dusty Butt 1000kms, this was the only corner that raised any real concern, mostly by guys who have ridden this road and know it is a problem. What the hell is wrong with raising concern and awareness about it. If it was on a public highway, the crash stats would speak for themselves, and the roading engineers would have the problem adressed.

But its not a public highway its a gravel country backroad and like all of them it actually requires skill and a brain to ride them...

If you cant handle it stick to your remuera tractor.

[PLUG]

Ahhh i did tour 3,000 k's of south island gravel roads a month...

a fuckin X SPURT from north of the bombays ... just what this thread needs

[CrazyFrog]

a fuckin X SPURT from north of the bombays ... just what this thread needs

Yup, a 21 yr old X-Spurt, spending more time writing shite on internet forums than riding his prehistoric Katana roadie. What an oxygen thief.

[NordieBoy]

Yup, a 21 yr old X-Spurt, spending more time writing shite on internet forums than riding his prehistoric Katana roadie. What an oxygen thief.

As opposed to all the 40 yr old X-Spurts, spending more time writing shite on internet forums than fixing their broken KTM/Suzuki's

[JATZ]

But its not a public highway its a gravel country backroad and like all of them it actually requires skill and a brain to ride them...

If you cant handle it stick to your remuera tractor.

Thanks for your input SkidMark,welcome back by the way.Nice project bike you got y'self

BUT untill you have actually riden the road and seen the offending corner for your self nothing you say will change my mind, something needs to be done.
The corner damn near got me 3 days before the D.B. and I wasn't going that fast.
I don't think the angle of the corner is the big issue,if it was well banked you wouldn't need to hardly slow down at all, it's the negative camber about 2/3 of the way around it.I didn't notice untill I stood at the top of the corner looking down it how bad it is, also the fact that all the other bends around it are fast ones.I'll go and take a photo of it (the camber)next w/end perhaps.
Another volunter here Cooney, can supply chainsaws, scrubcutters and even a small digger if needed

[reofix]

lets seal the rainbow.. call in transit... erect the armco and signage... NO NO and NO!!!!