THE corner in the Rainbow

[Transalper]

...
I reckon cooneyr should have just done it offline and saved all this tiresome opinionated fuss and bother.

Actually now that I think of it, if even only one person is able to see through the offensive talking down at you tones that the good advice has mostly been delivered with....that you should not make assumptions and should only ride to the road surface you can actually see and presumably stop in, then I guess all this online fuss and bother might have been worth it after all.
For the rest who can't be told or occasionally get carried away with the ride or distracted for what ever reason, there may be a corner, ditch, rock, hole, ford, sheep, oncoming bike or 4x4 etc out there somewhere with your name on it, just waiting to knock you off you bike... on this corner however, you're about to be given a second chance, good luck with the rest and thank you to cooneyr.


As you were.
TA.

[cooneyr]

Actually now that I think of it, if even only one person is able to see through the offensive talking down at you tones that the good advice has mostly been delivered with....that you should not make assumptions and should only ride to the road surface you can actually see and presumably stop in, then I guess all this online fuss and bother might have been worth it after all.
For the rest who can't be told or occasionally get carried away with the ride or distracted for what ever reason, there may be a corner, ditch, rock, hole, ford, sheep, oncoming bike or 4x4 etc out there somewhere with your name on it, just waiting to knock you off you bike... on this corner however, you're about to be given a second chance, good luck with the rest and thank you to cooneyr.


As you were.
TA.

Very well said TA. Definitely green bling for this. Pat yourself on the back.

I started to write replies to a number of other posts on this thread but have though better of it as this thread has become ridiculous in the extreme. From my perspective, the alternative is to do nothing and to sit back and watch more people seriously injure or kill themselves. Simply put I'm not that sick. All the bickering and expectations of riders skills posted on this thread will not stop the injuries or death.

Cheers R

[Ms Topo]

As the partner of a 3 time Dusty Butter (Balrog) soon to do the Yamaha Safari I am extremely grateful for Ryans efforts to stop that corner claiming anyone else.
It's not just the riders lives impacted when something bad happens, there are loved ones who suffer, when these 'adventures' go wrong.

I have been in that hospital room with those loved ones as they wait for answers. I have sat next to the widow saying good bye to a friend in his coffin.

So I'm with Ryan on this one . He knows what he is talking about.

It's about preventing unecessary accidents, not spoiling anyones fun.

Well said Magic fairy.

[Mr. Peanut]

It's a clear hazard, it has caused injury. It's like seeing a big piece of retread on a blind corner, and not removing it lest we spoil someones 'fun'

I'm sure anyone reading a sign saying "slow down" on that corner will thanking you after riding through it.

[FJRider]

I recall something in the law about being able to stop within half the clear distance or road ahead. Would those that binned on this corner have done so if this law had been adhered to...???
If vegetation is removed, does road direction angle, suddenly become obvious....??? or just help with visability of seeing oncoming traffic. If the road turns left (going north) then drops away with an off camber, how much of the road could (will) actually be seen. Or wont that be known untill after the vegetation is removed.

[NordieBoy]

With the bushes cut back you should be able to see the next bit of straight after the corner which gives you an indication of where things are going.

[Woodman]

I recall something in the law about being able to stop within half the clear distance or road ahead. Would those that binned on this corner have done so if this law had been adhered to...???
If vegetation is removed, does road direction angle, suddenly become obvious....??? or just help with visability of seeing oncoming traffic. If the road turns left (going north) then drops away with an off camber, how much of the road could (will) actually be seen. Or wont that be known untill after the vegetation is removed.

So what you are saying is, if there is a car, lets say a trafficcop doing a u turn halfway round a corner and you run into said cop then it is your fault and not the u turning cop car??

Slightly off topic I know but for the record I agree with Cooney.

[FJRider]

With the bushes cut back you should be able to see the next bit of straight after the corner which gives you an indication of where things are going.

"Should"...??? "Indication"...??? In other words... is a no to my question...???? or just a "might be"...
Previous corners gave an "indication" of "where things went".
Cutting back the scrub may work, untill the grass grows a bit, and any road disappears...

Pic's already posted by the thread starter, clearly shows the road coming from upper right to lower left towards you (first pic). Would that not be an indication of where things (i.e. the road) are going. I would imagine, on an unfamilar road (those familar with the road would know to take care there ...right ?), that by time any rider got to the point of where the second pic was taken, the rider would be looking at the corner (where he/she was going), and pretty much committed to speed, and line.
As a newbie to gravel, I would be very interested in the lines through this corner. Would it be as on tar seal, follow the wheel tracks, or some another. Can any expert tell me ??? Pardon my ignorance on this subject.

D.O.C. have a habit of placing signs, green with yellow writing all over the place. Perhaps a similar "profesional" sign might ... "appear"... a little before the point where the first pic was taken...

[FJRider]

So what you are saying is, if there is a car, lets say a trafficcop doing a u turn halfway round a corner and you run into said cop then it is your fault and not the u turning cop car??

Slightly off topic I know but for the record I agree with Cooney.

Read the rode code yourself and figure it out.
If when you saw the cop, had plenty of time to stop... and he turned as you got to him, his fault. Cops aren't the only one's who do that...
If you never saw him 'till you were going over his roof... some responsibility must lie with you. It may not be a cop next time, maybe a tree down, or a slip, or a washout, or..... If you assume (there's that word again) the road is clear round that corner...

[cooneyr]

.....As a newbie to gravel, I would be very interested in the lines through this corner. Would it be as on tar seal, follow the wheel tracks, or some another. Can any expert tell me ??? Pardon my ignorance on this subject.....

As this corner is a left hander the typical line is the LH wheel track which means you typically get plenty of camber to help you. Part of the issue with this corner is that the camber rapidly rolls off and becomes negative meaning that you need to reduce your speed rapidly. That combined with the rapid tightening of the corner is the got ya.

It is not practical to do anything about the camber as we have no budget for this work whatsoever. Therefore the only thing we can do is provide more of an indication of the tightening of the corner. In the first of the photos of mine that you posted, you can just make out my XTZ through the bushes at about mid bush height (a white spot in the bush). I'm proposing to remove those bushes so you can see the road at that point.

Removing the bushes immediately inside the corner will not enable you to see the road past the apex much sooner, maybe about 10m sooner. However if we transplant those bushes to the outside of the corner (outside the ditch) it will be clear that the road is much tighter than it appears. It is very common and well understood now that lamp posts, hedges etc can either be used to reinforce the shape of the corner or they can deceive. There is quite a cool diagram in one of the manuals at work that shows this but unfortunately I don't have access to it at the moment.

Cheers R

[FJRider]

As this corner is a left hander the typical line is the LH wheel track which means you typically get plenty of camber to help you. Part of the issue with this corner is that the camber rapidly rolls off and becomes negative meaning that you need to reduce your speed rapidly. That combined with the rapid tightening of the corner is the got ya.

It is not practical to do anything about the camber as we have no budget for this work whatsoever. Therefore the only thing we can do is provide more of an indication of the tightening of the corner. In the first of the photos of mine that you posted, you can just make out my XTZ through the bushes at about mid bush height (a white spot in the bush). I'm proposing to remove those bushes so you can see the road at that point.

Removing the bushes immediately inside the corner will not enable you to see the road past the apex much sooner, maybe about 10m sooner. However if we transplant those bushes to the outside of the corner (outside the ditch) it will be clear that the road is much tighter than it appears.

Cheers R

Thank you. Your mention of planting on the outside of the corner does make sense.
I have done a bit of 4WD'ing, and as a general rule, the outside of corners on "less" maintained, adventure roads, tend to get chewed out, as the weight of vehicles tends to push out the road surface to the outside and off the track. Just over the rise of the same corners, where vehicles regain sprung weight, is also liable to be more rutted or gouged out. Tighter corners do tend to be even worse. Have you noticed similar...???
I did see the bike.
How long since a grader went down that road...??? Or has their not been one since the D8 that created it...???

[warewolf]

It is very common and well understood now that lamp posts, hedges etc can either be used to reinforce the shape of the corner or they can deceive. There is quite a cool diagram in one of the manuals at work that shows this

Mwahahaha... I'm not sayin' nuthin' about the choice of guide post reflector colours in this country. But the chances are good I can draw that same diagram to demonstrate the reflector problem and solution.

[NordieBoy]

How long since a grader went down that road...??? Or has their not been one since the D8 that created it...???

Graded every season.

[cooneyr]

...I have done a bit of 4WD'ing, and as a general rule, the outside of corners on "less" maintained, adventure roads, tend to get chewed out, as the weight of vehicles tends to push out the road surface to the outside and off the track. Just over the rise of the same corners, where vehicles regain sprung weight, is also liable to be more rutted or gouged out. Tighter corners do tend to be even worse. Have you noticed similar...???....

From my experiance there tends to be a fair bit of loose material on the outside of gravel road corners but I wouldnt say that it is normal to find rutting any more than normal gravel roads. I too did a few years of 4wding before I got into bikes.

Graded every season.

Grading might be a little bit of a stong word. It is not done very well as evidenced by the windrow of gravel on the shoulders of the road. The Molesworth and Molesworth farm section of the Rainbow road have been graded properly but almost too deep as there is a lot of loose gravel on them now unless you are in the wheel tracks.

Actually I've never heard of or seen a grader in there but I do know that a dozer (station) and excavator (transpower) goes through every season. I suspect that much of the grading work is done by the dozer on its way to and from Hells Gate and beyond to clear the slips.

Cheers R

[FJRider]

Graded every season.

So when is it due through next ... ???