Protective clothing legislation?

[SARGE]

hell..i dont even wear a seatbelt in the cage.. grew up on bikes riding sans helmet too..i ride in a ledather jacket and jeans every time i go out.. when i am planning a spirited ride i swap the work boots for some Fox Tracker MX boots but thats the extent of it .. oh.. and i wear titanium gloves for the occasional mirror-ectomy


had a t-shirt a long time ago.. simply stated..


"keep YOUR laws off MY body"

i wouldnt wear a helmet in NZ if it wasnt for all the dipshit drivers .. im fairly confidant in my own abilities but driving for a living i see heaps of cellphone addicted jackasses.. saw one clown today on Queen St PLAYING A FRIGGING NINTENDO behind the wheel in traffic.. then did a u-turn at Mayoral dr and damn near capped a pushy rider

[Swoop]

While we are at it lets just make it a suite of armour...

Would that be a 3-piece?

If I want to ride my bike in a t-shirt its my skin, my bones my life I am dealing with... not yours...

No problem! Go right ahead!
Just do not expect me or anyone else to pay for your actions and choices.

[Naki Rat]

More safety gear is totally the wrong approach.They say the biggest incentive for safe driving is a 6 inch steel spike in the centre of the steering wheel - the same is true with motorcycles.The biggest improvement in rider safety would be the removal of safety gear - no helmet,no gloves,T shirt,shorts and Roman sandals (better for gearchanges than jandals.) Send 20 gixer riders around the Coro Loop like that and see how many crash.It high lights the motorcylist's vulnerability,and the very real possibility of getting very really hurt radically changes their approach to riding.That such a method makes a safer rider proves that they are in fact totally unsafe wrapped in cotton wool.

I totally agree

My job includes visits to industrial sites and oil installations (including offshore) both of which have safety regulations that are mind boggling. From my observations in these situations the implementation of safety requirements for everything from PPE (safety clothing) to how to go up and down stairs which while being originally well intentioned, gradually desensitises the average worker into a sense of being able to then blame any incident on the failure of someone or something. A flock of safety specialists decend on any mishap so that it then can be fully documented, blame apportioned and more safety guidelines implemented to prevent it reoccurring.

This generates safety literature that runs to volumes that continually grow, and which must be exchanged with other contractors, subcontractors and clients who then incude the relevant safety data of those associated parties in their own "Health, Safety & Environment manual" and so on it goes.

The average worker is then expected to absorb these HSE manuals as part of their employment conditions and sign off to confirm that they have. As further HSE manual updates and safety alerts are issued these must also be absorbed and signed off for as the employers' transfer the responsibility (and liability) of safety over to the masses.

However the lowly worker having now signed over the acceptance of safe work practice is now lulled into a sense of having done their thing for safety and happily heads off to finally get some work done 'now that we've got all that safety stuff over and done with'. But, the HSE geeks have now identified this shortfall in the system so in they come with more paperwork to reinforce the safety message. Before a task is started the job crew must have a 'toolbox meeting' to collectively identify what it is they are intending to accomplish, workflow and equipment required, what hazards they may be exposed to in doing that job and how those hazards are to be eliminated, mitigated or isolated, and what other people and activities will be affected or put at risk by your task. And to make sure the workers' minds haven't been completely numbed by all this they are set the responsibilty of filling in anonymously submitted cards identifying hazardous or commendable actions of individuals which give the HSE geeks further fodder for generating meetings and literature, justifying their own existence.

Am I alone in seeing this safety overkill madness now infiltrating our every activity?

My point here is that the more that some governing body implements layer upon layer of safety on their underlings, the greater the mental disattachment of those underlings from the actual act of keeping themselves safe. The recurring tone of 'If it becomes law I won't be wearing it' together with the equally counterproductive mindset of 'I'm well clothed so don't have to be as careful' are all too familiar as parallels to the reaction to HSE in the workplace.

Used to be a time here in NZ that if you did something stupid there was a good chance that you were deleted from the gene pool - not really acceptable but we now have a situation that is swung to the other extreme, increasingly lead by the North American and European liability industries.

The problem is how do we find a happy balance?

[Katman]

Your mechanic has to put on a seat belt if he is road testing you car.

No, he doesn't actually (unless they've changed the ruling recently) - as long as he doesn't exceed 50kph.

[portokiwi]

I agree with the safety thing. But I dont agree that it has to be sole motorcycle only.
Many of us can not afford some of the gear that is sold.... Or just dont feel right in the gear. Comfort wise.
I use many army/security gear which is just as good as much of the gear being sold in motorcycle shops.
As long as they see you are trying to wear gear that if you full off or crash...(my case hit by a truck) will protect you then you should be covered by ACC.
I think its crazy seeing bikers going realy fast down streets and on the motorway wearing t shirts, no gloves and even shorts.
They if they come off should not be covered by ACC. As they where not trying to be safe. thats my own thoughts.

[firefighter]

If I want to ride my bike in a t-shirt its my skin, my bones my life I am dealing with... not yours... and at the end of the day my risk... you have no right to tell me what I can and can not do with it... none what so ever. Kiwis are worse than sheep and just simply follow along whether its right or wrong and slowly taking away your freedoms that my forefathers died for...

I could'nt agree more, it is after all YOUR skin, YOUR body. I'm sick of the rediculous rules that come in.
OSH took fire poles out of firestations.......so it is apparently safer to run down stairs now is it? Let people live their lives the way they choose I say.

Crash helmets, as well neck braces 5 point racing harness and soft rubber foam bumpers that can take 99% of the impact and uses that stored energy to solve the power problem... and because NZ is such a bad place to drive this system would solve our power problem...

Funny thing is, 5 point harnesses are ILLEGAL, I fucken kidd you not, somethig to do with the fact you won't bother putting it on properly (I know this as a mate of mine has one, he races his car but as he only has a 5 point harness in it, it's no-longer street legal, so some f-witt cop ticketed him for it)

What 'they' fail to understand - that we all know too well - is that 'I didn't see him' really means 'I didn't look'.

Yes well i'm sure if i'm wearing a dayglow the drivers will bother to look......pfft.

Just like those retard drivers that don't see big red firetrucks with lights and sirens on trying to cross their path yet they are'nt gonna stop 'cause they are'nt fucken paying attention, and you gotta sit and watch and wait for them to drive past or they would have meandered into you! Explain why a dayglow is so good again now IXION when cagers can't even notice a flashing lights, siren and an airhorn?!

I hear what you are saying buddy but you didn't go on to say where the money is coming from to put you back together when you fuck up on your bike in your Tee and shorts. Do you have a personal hospital for which you pay all of the expences on standby for when you fuck up..

Well I dunno about him but I have medical insurance, so I get fucked in the ass by acc, and i'm covered by my insurance also. I actually believe I should be excempt.
By the way, so what if some of the thousands of tax dollars i've paid actually come back to me? I pay for half of south auckland to sit at home smoking pot and drinking piss!........oh and the islanders that live across the drive from me - I get to pay for them to disturb the whole neigbourhood, pay for their piss, pot, listen to their language, parties and bullshit, so if I get some acc come my way- I think i've earned it!

Would that be a 3-piece?

No problem! Go right ahead!
Just do not expect me or anyone else to pay for your actions and choices.

As above, iv'e paid double with medical insurance and ACC, so I think I should have the right to wear a t- shirt and shorts on my bike should I want to shoot up to the dairy, I don't, but I think i'm entitled to choose.

As are the rest of you.

Remember how we took playgrounds away from kids and replaced them with junk? (i mean real playgrounds, monkey bars etc) what the fuck has that really achieved? I'll tell you what - fat chicken shit kids that's what.

[SPman]

More safety gear is totally the wrong approach.............................. cotton wool.

Hell yes.
Now I wear Draggin jeans and a mesh jacket over here in summer as concessions to the heat, I feel rather more vulnerable. The boots, gloves and full face stay (ever ridden through a swarm of locusts at speed.......)
Conversely, I also feel more at one with the bike.......
But
Compulsory gear and safety vests - I'd feel more inclined to ride in shorts and T shirt and fuckem!

[swbarnett]

It has sufficient statistical basis

Is it that HiVis vests save lives or that those that wear them are naturally careful riders?

[swbarnett]

The gear question has been debated probably countless times before. Take a look at this thread as one example:
http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/sh...ad.php?t=59772

[popelli]

is the nanny state trying re reassert new zealands position in the world as the poland of the south pacific

[NighthawkNZ:Me]

I could agree with the sentiment, but only on the proviso that I can exercise my right to refuse to contribute for your medical treatment and rehabilitation.

I don't expect any one too pay for my medical treatment and rehabilitation I have always paid for my own medical care... (I have private insurance) and have never ever made a ACC claim in my entire life (so why should I have to pay for your treatment and every other fucker out there which I am...)

maybe I don't want it either... again my choice...

As I said I ride with ATGATT (but thats my choice) and always will, but the point is it should be my choice.

[MDR2]

Maybe a campaign like the one in aus. Run some of the ads that they had playing on the tv when i was in melbourne last year.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=448OzeZmL0M

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=448OzeZmL0M

They dedicated huge billboard ads to ATGATT type displays etc.

[McJim]

Here is a question for you. Helmets are overwhelmingly good right ?

What year were they introduced ?

Hint 1 - table attached from official NZ statistics.
Hint 2 - if you can't identify the year from the death statistics, google the paraplegia/tetraplegia statistics. Much easier to pick there.

Trouble is, that helmets DO help with minor knocks and abrasions. But the leather stuff the oldtimers had was great for this too. "Proper" helmets have err, actually, not been as useful as you may have imagined.

At best a helmet may double your chance of survival. But getting on a motorcycle made you 30 times (depending on whos figures you read) more likely to die than driving your Volvo.

The ATGATT game sounds nice, but really the only way to be safe with a motorcycle is to sell it.

Looking at the stats I think the correlation is more in line with the acceleration power and max speed of the bikes. It's a lot easier to get kill yourself with 120 hp than it is with 60.

Maybe the answer is to limit roadgoing bikes to 60hp?



That would increase the value of my bike too!

[AD345]

If I want to ride my bike in a t-shirt its my skin, my bones my life I am dealing with... not yours... and at the end of the day my risk... you have no right to tell me what I can and can not do with it... none what so ever. Kiwis are worse than sheep and just simply follow along whether its right or wrong and slowly taking away your freedoms that my forefathers died for...

Absofuckinglutely

and to hell with any ATGATT disclaimer

[AD345]

And while I'm at it...

Those of you tha agree with these general sentiments:

but only on the proviso that I can exercise my right to refuse to contribute for your medical treatment and rehabilitation.

Get over it.

Think of all the myriad single issue groups (ALAC, ASH,etc), people with their own hobby horses (people that disdain loud music fer example) not to mention a reasonable percentage of the population that ain't bloody thrilled with motorcycling AT ALL who would just lovvve a chance to line up and not pay for any ACC cover for YOU.

Gear or no bloody gear