What IS the rule?

[dpex]

Hmm on and off 15 years of Motorway commuting Vs 1 day. But hey dont believe me. Have a quiet word to le motorway cop.

Le Motorway cop has got zip to do with your posit that the side bits are covered in shit.

[dpex]

There was an item in Bike Rider magazine about 4 years ago covering this very topic. A rider using that section to the right received a ticket for "driving in an unavailable lane". He measured the width and determined that it wasn't a legal lane, so opted to defend the charge. The cops ammended the charge to "did drive outside his lane". He could find nothing in any law that said it was illegal to drive or ride outside a lane, other than in a safety zone (ie the section on the left of the motorway). He took the matter to the Minister of Transport before it went to court, and the next thing was that the whole matter was dropped.

BRM interviewed a lawyer, Bill Dean, (was my lawyer a few years ago) who also said that that there is nothing in law to prevent anyone from riding along that section.

So certainly use it, but be prepared that you may get a ticket, but that if you fight that ticket you should win.

At last, we have Jantar providing some fact as opposed to various opinions.

Jantar. This case must have had a number. Can you access it? Can you approach the lawyer you mention? Or can you provide me with contact details for him?

If we can get that, then we can all use that part of the road (don't tell the cagers who driver VERY narrow cages). Then, when stopped by a cop we can all quote the relevant case number and, if he/she is still adamant, then we just accept the ticket in good grace and stump up to court with the defence.

[dpex]

The police spokesperson's phone always goes straight to message and has never returned my calls. Due diligence - gave up.

A few KB Bike cops have kindly made themselves available for an off the record/after hours chat about several matters and I haven't had sh*t together enough to follow up.

You make an excellent point.

I currently have a backlog of bike tests to write up < irony.

You make an excellent point. Come on, Scumdog! What's the rules?

[dpex]

er No ... most have a cattle grid at front and rear, but no motorway network and no jams (save Wellington of course)

Sorry. Wellington is not a major city. It is a prole-hill, filled mostly with bureaucratic proles who can't get proper jobs, many of whom spend their days thinking ever-more creative ways to upset bikers, and parents, and tax-payers, and cockroaches. See! They even get at their own type.

[dpex]

Hmmm, you are saying that if you get 3 speeding tickets over 2 years and earn enough demerit points to lose your license for 3 months (as well as the 3 fines you have already paid) then it is fair to also lose your job, possibly your house (the job was paying the mortgage) and be unable to support your family? Is this really your idea of justice? It seems a little over the top to me for infringing on some technicality in the driving regulations.

In law there is a requirement for the punishment to fit the crime, there have been people that that had convictions quashed because the effect of having those convictions on their records would be out of proportion to the severity of their offending. Being punished for breaking the law is one thing, but over the top severe penalties for minor infractions is not fair or just. We don't hold with imprisoning a person for 2 years for being rude to officials in this country, thank you very much. http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/austral...ten-and-jailed

And then there's the Polynesian woman who killed her own baby....Birthed it in a dunny, stuffed it in a plastic bag and slung it out the window. The judge decided that to convict her would cause her Samoan family indescribable embarrassment.

Oh yeah. The justice system works really well in NZ.

You kill a baby and get off. You get 100 demerit points and probably lose your job, house, family.

[Jantar]

At last, we have Jantar providing some fact as opposed to various opinions.

Jantar. This case must have had a number. Can you access it? Can you approach the lawyer you mention? Or can you provide me with contact details for him?
.....

The case didn't go to court, it was dropped before it got that far. The Lawyer who answered BRM's query was Bill Dean from Dean and Associates in Oamaru. I'll look back through my old issues of BRM and see if I can find the actual item.

[dpex]

Sorry re talking to Mr policeman Im talking check out the tyres on any motorway bike cops bike. A good mate of mine used to be mechanic at the north shore mway base. A bifg part of his work was fixing flat tyres.
If ya don't believe me find a safe place to stop and have a looksee

Keep thumping the tub, me old mate. Fact is, I've used both left and right parts of the motorways for ages, not just one day. Never had a prob yet, even on my old, munted tyres.

Interestingly, the cagers seem to change attitudes on a daily basis.

Today I did Central Orks to Te Atatu, using whatever spaces where available...Lane splitting, left shoulder, and right. I was amazed at the number of cagers who moved 'into' my path....Like it was, 'Fuck you! If I'm stuck in this shit then I ain't letting you past.'

Yet, on so many other days, the cagers have moved left or right to allow me passage.

I find this same thing in suburban traffic. Most days many cagers move out of my way. I always wave a thanks. Yet, on other days, I see them squeazing the gap, knowing I'm coming along.

Must be something to do with the moon phases.

The other thing I've noticed is, cagers tend to keep to the right of the lanes. I guess this is because they can measure their safety on their right-side a lot more easily than they can on their left.

Have you all noticed that there is always a great deal more space to the left of cagers in a lane, than on the right?

[dpex]

The case didn't go to court, it was dropped before it got that far. The Lawyer who answered BRM's query was Bill Dean from Dean and Associates in Oamaru. I'll look back through my old issues of BRM and see if I can find the actual item.

You do that...Well done Jantar. I'll go after Dean and Assocs.

We'll get some sense into this discussion yet.

Cheers

[Jantar]

.... I'll look back through my old issues of BRM and see if I can find the actual item.

Whewww! I had to look back further than I thought. It is in issue 18 of BRM April/May 2004. The rider concerned is Ross Charlton, and the Lawyer was indeed Bill Dean. He actually received two tickets for this. He simply paid the first one, but when another cop advised him to use the right hand safety shoulder he went back to using it. 4 months later the cop who gave him the first ticket gave him another one. That is when he started the legal route to get it tossed.

[dpex]

The case didn't go to court, it was dropped before it got that far. The Lawyer who answered BRM's query was Bill Dean from Dean and Associates in Oamaru. I'll look back through my old issues of BRM and see if I can find the actual item.

Well done you! I found them. I've emailed them. I've offered to pay....on behalf of all KBers (God but I have such a big heart) to get the legal low-down.

When I get it, you'll all get it.

Consider it an early Christmas present. :--))))

[MarkH]

Have you all noticed that there is always a great deal more space to the left of cagers in a lane, than on the right?

Yep, notice that pretty much every day. It's because the cagers are sitting on the right side of their vehicle, much easier to judge the distance from the right of the cage to the line/barrier. I just cruise past and if a gap closes up it doesn't hold me up for too long, there's always another way past!

[rwh]

Yep, notice that pretty much every day. It's because the cagers are sitting on the right side of their vehicle, much easier to judge the distance from the right of the cage to the line/barrier. I just cruise past and if a gap closes up it doesn't hold me up for too long, there's always another way past!

I do it when I'm in my car too, but I don't think that's the reason. I think it's in the vain hope that I might actually see what's up ahead. Of course, since everyone else is doing the same thing, it doesn't work. The other factor is probably just lining up with the rest of the cars. It's not something I usually think about. Oh - and if I moved to the left while everyone else was on the right, there'd be nowhere left to split ...

Richard

[peasea]

You make an excellent point. Come on, Scumdog! What's the rules?

Firstly: Who'd want to cum on Scumdog and
Secondly: It's "what ARE the rules?"

'Rules' are plural and therefore it's 'what are the rules'.

Sheesh.

[rwh]

Le Motorway cop has got zip to do with your posit that the side bits are covered in shit.

Except that le bike cop probably spends more time than most riding in les side bits.

Richard

[peasea]

Yep, notice that pretty much every day. It's because the cagers are sitting on the right side of their vehicle, much easier to judge the distance from the right of the cage to the line/barrier. I just cruise past and if a gap closes up it doesn't hold me up for too long, there's always another way past!

I was cruising southward just off the bridge one afternoon, some twat moved right, as he saw me trundling along in the far right 'lane'. I slowed, almost to a stop, smashed his right-hand mirror with my left hand, motored off and never heard a thing about it.

Sometimes jealousy (of a faster commute) can bite you on the arse. Power assisted mirrors ain't cheap.