How much throttle?

[vifferman]

Moral of the story is if you buy a big bike and are not going to use the full extent of the throttle then whats the point?

Oh, I know the answer to that one.
The point is, it makes for fairly effortless riding. Same as a bigger, more powerful car is less tiring on a long trip than a small gutless one.

[naphazoline]

I've been feedleen about wit' my Powah Commando lately, and so need to take note of throttle position vs. RPM. It struck me that in normal use, I never need to use more than a wee bit of throttle, even accelerating hard. Occasionally I might use half throttle, but that'd be about it. Any more'n that, and I'd be in danger of unnecessary acceleration or grossly excessive speed.
I found it was actually hard work to try and use more throttle than about a quarter turn (even thought there's no freeplay in the throttle, and it's a fairly quick acting one). Extra twisting didn't make it go much faster, just resulted in much more intake noise.

It's kinda silly, innit? All that throttle to play with, and most of it unusuble, except maybe on the track or dyno (where they seem to tune bikes at full throttle through the gears, whereas in the RealWorld, probably no-one uses it).

So what about you (if you ride a bike over say, 600cc)? How much would you twist the throttle during a normal ride?

Do you have a USB III p/c ?

If so,you could try downloading the "accelerator pump" mod,and use it to tame your throttle,so you can use more of it.

Just a thought.
Can't say i've tried it myself.Instead,i boosted it at 75% open throttle,by 15% percent more fuel,over every 20rpm.Nice little boost.Occasionally.Lol.

[vifferman]

Do you have a USB III p/c ?

Nup - PCII.
I was running a map for a while that boosted fuel AND advanced the ignition slightly at higher revs and large throttle openings, so I had to run 98 octane fuel. In the couple of years I ran it, I don't think I ever got to try it out.
Now back to 91 and a more 'normal' map.

[naphazoline]

Nup - PCII.
I was running a map for a while that boosted fuel AND advanced the ignition slightly at higher revs and large throttle openings, so I had to run 98 octane fuel. In the couple of years I ran it, I don't think I ever got to try it out.
Now back to 91 and a more 'normal' map.

Bugger. I thought i might have had ya a cheap fix. Sorry

[ducatilover]

Silly question sorry, why have you got the 02 sensors disabled mate?

[vifferman]

Silly question sorry, why have you got the 02 sensors disabled mate?

It's because when they aren't disabled, the bike runs in "Closed loop mode", when at constant small throttle openings. This is ultra lean, so results in the bike having a slight lean surge. That's OK, but when you open the throttle, there's a very slight but noticeable hesitation as the ECU/EFI switches from closed loop to mapped mode. If you're going around a sharp, slow speed corner, you get a slight hesitation which is annoying at best, and potentially dangerous at worst. You can get round this with clever clutch work, but it's ferkinannoying.
However, if you unplug the O2 sensors, and fit 330ohm resistors across the leads of the plugs, the ECU doesn't bother using 'closed loop' mode at all.

Also (plus!) if you fit a PCII, PCIII, or PCIII9USB), you really need to disable the oxygen sensors to get the most benefit, otherwise the PC and ECU are interfering with one another at small throttle openings.

In most conditions, the bike runs better without the O2 sensors, with or without a PC fitted. It has a slight 'bogginess' taking off from standstill without the PC, but otherwise it's fine. With the PC, you just adjust the map (or the buttons) to tune it for whatever pipe/airfilter/fuel you're running.

[ducatilover]

It's because when they aren't disabled, the bike runs in "Closed loop mode", when at constant small throttle openings. This is ultra lean, so results in the bike having a slight lean surge. That's OK, but when you open the throttle, there's a very slight but noticeable hesitation as the ECU/EFI switches from closed loop to mapped mode. If you're going around a sharp, slow speed corner, you get a slight hesitation which is annoying at best, and potentially dangerous at worst. You can get round this with clever clutch work, but it's ferkinannoying.
However, if you unplug the O2 sensors, and fit 330ohm resistors across the leads of the plugs, the ECU doesn't bother using 'closed loop' mode at all.

Also (plus!) if you fit a PCII, PCIII, or PCIII9USB), you really need to disable the oxygen sensors to get the most benefit, otherwise the PC and ECU are interfering with one another at small throttle openings.

In most conditions, the bike runs better without the O2 sensors, with or without a PC fitted. It has a slight 'bogginess' taking off from standstill without the PC, but otherwise it's fine. With the PC, you just adjust the map (or the buttons) to tune it for whatever pipe/airfilter/fuel you're running.

Ah that makes sense, I was assuming you just had them disconnected without running any sort of 02 signal. I could see quite fun problems arising from this. why not have some lovely little rheostats in place of the o2s? this could ensure you can dial in what ever setting the ecu and pc want to see

[Drew]

Most the time on the road, I have no idea, usually open it wide to do wheelies, and I do that a lot.

On the track, I generally try to twist it past the stop, and wish whatever I'm on was quicker. Bit different on the new thou but, that bad ass tends to lift the wheel in fourth off the pipe, so less throttle is best.

[vifferman]

why not have some lovely little rheostats in place of the o2s? this could ensure you can dial in what ever setting the ecu and pc want to see

That's been thought of (for Ducatis, at least), but apparently isn't an option for VFRs (or else no-one knows what sort of resistance would be appropriate, or isn't saying.)
There are other things that work or help out, like increasing the fuel pressure via an aftermarket FPR, or fitting one of these.

[naphazoline]

....... there's a very slight but noticeable hesitation as the ECU/EFI switches from closed loop to mapped mode. If you're going around a sharp, slow speed corner, you get a slight hesitation which is annoying at best, and potentially dangerous at worst. You can get round this with clever clutch work, but it's ferkinannoying.
However, if you unplug the O2 sensors, and fit 330ohm resistors across the leads of the plugs, the ECU doesn't bother using 'closed loop' mode at all.

Also (plus!) if you fit a PCII, PCIII, or PCIII9USB), you really need to disable the oxygen sensors to get the most benefit, otherwise the PC and ECU are interfering with one another at small throttle openings.

I have this snatchy surge problem with my 06 1000rr.I have gone down one tooth,to a 15 tooth sprocket on the front,and it has tamed it down quite a bit,but i have yet to get her custom mapped,and i want to sort out the cat' removal,block the PAIR,and disable the O2 sensor.

How hard/expensive is it to disable the sensor,and fit the 330 ohm resistors?

I'm not much of a DIY'er.

[CookMySock]

If you're going around a sharp, slow speed corner, you get a slight hesitation which is annoying at best, and potentially dangerous at worst. You can get round this with clever clutch work, but it's ferkinannoying.

Right. You would think with a computer in the thing they might program it so it didn't DO shit like this. Like, EFI is supposed to be BETTER than carbs innit? Why isn't "better" actually better?

edit: oh, in answer to the question: I idle around at quarter throttle or less, blap it at half throttle to around half revvs (it's a vtwin) depending on how I feel, and overtake on the open road usually at full-throttle and 3/4 revvs.

Steve

[cowpoos]

It's because when they aren't disabled, the bike runs in "Closed loop mode", when at constant small throttle openings. This is ultra lean, so results in the bike having a slight lean surge. That's OK, but when you open the throttle, there's a very slight but noticeable hesitation as the ECU/EFI switches from closed loop to mapped mode.

Errr.....how many throttle butter flys does your bike have per cylinder dude?