Careless driving charge! Help

**MSTRS:Me** · 12th May 2009, 09:10

Originally Posted by fireliv

If you are looking at pleading guilty, and are a first time offender you are eligable for diversion.

Diversion is used for Criminal cases, not Traffic

Originally Posted by z99

I am hoping can keep my licence and that I will just get a fine and maybe do a driving defence course and that I wont get a record.

If you are fined, then you have been found guilty and you will have a 'record'.
Heard of the term 'convicted and discharged'? That means Guilty, not penalty imposed. But you cannot have a penalty imposed without the conviction.

**TOTO** · 12th May 2009, 11:39

It was an open road situation. it was not a "speed bump" what he calls it , but just a bump. It was the joint where the bridge connects to the tarmak. The tarmak was about 5-10cm higher than the bridge - i.e bump.

Sorry Andy, I cant offer any legal advice coz i dont know nuffing, but good luck with the whole thing brother.

**cs363** · 12th May 2009, 11:52

Originally Posted by z99

Thanks for all the replies. Some of you might already know my story but for those who don’t I was in a motor bike accident 3 months ago. I was out riding when I hit a speed beep after a bridge and I got a tank-slapper (wild and rapid swings of the handlebars from hard-stop right to hard-stop left and back again) happens when harmonic feedback is generated following your front tire hitting an imperfection on the road surface such as the slight bump at the end of your driveway. Anyway I lost control and hit into a car on the opposite side of the road luckily no one in the car was hurt. The bike was ridden off.
I am no sure what speed I was going at the time or are the other members in the group. I spent 3 weeks in hospital as I had a dislocated shoulder and broke my pelvis. I have been off work for the last 3 months now. I am hoping can keep my licence and that I will just get a fine and maybe do a driving defence course and that I wont get a record. Well only got 10 more days if anyone knows a good community lawyer on the shore please let me know or any other suggestions might help.

From that description it sounds to me like it would be well worth getting a lawyer, as it sounds like it should be defendable.
At the very least it would be worth paying the fee and talking to a lawyer about your situation, certainly time better spent than asking a bunch of bush lawyers like all of us...

**James Deuce** · 12th May 2009, 12:05

At the risk of making myself really unpopular (hang on, no need to worry really, is there?), Careless Use is usually dropped on drivers/riders who fail to to take due consideration of the conditions and cause an accident.

It is sometimes used on motorcyclists who simply fall off whilst cornering enthusiastically, and in one case I know a mate fell off on diesel during a light rain shower and the camber and slippery conditions caught him out. The cop following him (unlucky, eh?) didn't fall off and reasoned that the mate shouldn't have either, if he'd been a little more careful.

The fact that you involved another vehicle in the loss of control of your motorcycle (it sounds mean, but that's what happened. The "beep" didn't make you fall off.) is not going to look good I'm afraid.

I don't think you have a defensible case. You lost control and hit a car. You can't really "spin" that in a positive light.

**Max Preload** · 12th May 2009, 12:12

Originally Posted by z99

...that I wont get a record

Are you taking kidding? It's such a pissy non-event it's not even worth worrying about.

**Winston001** · 12th May 2009, 12:20

You should ask for disclosure from the police. That is a copy of the officer's notes and witness statements. The police have charged you because there has been a serious accident - your bike was written off and you were hospitalised. You crossed the centre line thus endangering oncoming traffic.

Those are the basic reasons you've been charged. None of that means you are actually guilty of careless driving. If you can provide an explanation that an event outside your control caused the accident, then you have a good chance of being acquitted on a defended hearing.

A tankslapper is unpredictable but if witnesses say you were speeding then the odds are against you. So you need to see witness statements.

If I was you defending the charge, I'd find a mature credible motorcyclist to give supporting evidence about tankslappers. I've just seen a case where the Court was told sliders were used on racing bikes - which implied the dead bike rider had been speeding and did so regularly. No one in the court knew any better and so it was accepted.

You really should get a lawyer if you want clear advice. Community law centre is fine to start with. You can then defend this yourself if you feel sufficiently self-confident but most people find it too difficult.

**fireliv** · 12th May 2009, 17:30

Originally Posted by MSTRS

Diversion is used for Criminal cases, not Traffic

Not true (Sorry MSTRS but I deal with this stuff). You can have diversion in a traffic charge as long as there is no mandatory disqualification period and the charge is not deemed serious enough. This is such a case. I would strongly suggest you try for diversion if it is an option.

**munterk6** · 12th May 2009, 17:41

you could always stall off the court date by ringing in a bomb threat every time you are due in court....

thats what I did...

but the 6 years in prison was a bit of a bummer tho.

**MSTRS:Me** · 12th May 2009, 17:48

Originally Posted by fireliv

Not true (Sorry MSTRS but I deal with this stuff). You can have diversion in a traffic charge as long as there is no mandatory disqualification period and the charge is not deemed serious enough. This is such a case. I would strongly suggest you try for diversion if it is an option.

Well, I never...
Really? How does that work?

**scumdog** · 12th May 2009, 17:52

Originally Posted by MSTRS

Diversion is used for Criminal cases, not Traffic

Not so

**MSTRS:Me** · 12th May 2009, 18:01

Yeah yeah...I just found out that I don't know everything. A real shock, it was, too.

**marty** · 12th May 2009, 18:48

Originally Posted by MSTRS

Well, I never...
Really? How does that work?

if the judge is not encumbered with a mandatory sentence diversion can be offered. disqual is mandatory for many traffic offences, but not simple Careless Driving - it's just an option

**marty** · 12th May 2009, 18:51

Originally Posted by Max Preload

That actually counts as careless causing injury.

injuring yourself does meet the ingredients of the offence, but a cop would be roundly criticised by O/C prosecutions for charging careless injury on a single car (injury to driver) crash.

i know this for a fact - i tried it.